KDSS worth it?

[A.Wilson013]

I don't understand the added complications while lifting.

The rear I didn't do anything special at all.

The front I just unbolted the swaybar at both LCAs and the two Allen bolts connecting the bar to the static mount.

To reinstall I connected the passenger LCA mount, then the two Allen bolts, then set it down on the wheels and jacked the piston up with a floor jack, and pushed the driver LCA side into place. All said and done, maybe 30 minutes? First time I had done it and it was completely intuitive.

I love the KDSS. Combined with the internal bypasses on the BP-51s it's the nicest riding truck, both on and off-road, that I have ever ridden in. Puts my stage 5 Icon that I had on my 4Runner to shame.

 

[e60ral]

perhaps im not as worried about it as i should be. ive always been able to throw a ton of abuse at toyotas and they just keep on hammering away.

that being said, i dont really plan to disable it often or for extended high speed travel. more like... a softer ride on the truck trails around my house or the occasional desert run.

ill sort out a switch and a few tests and get back to you all. seems like itll be pretty easy to do.

yeah toyota makes good stuff, but as designed its all static at speed, so i'd be worried leaving it dynamic at speed may be outside of its design criteria.

 

[transplant]

yeah toyota makes good stuff, but as designed its all static at speed, so i'd be worried leaving it dynamic at speed may be outside of its design criteria.

only one way to find out!

since there is so much fluid in the system, i think its unlikely to get hot enough to even degrade much less fail.

like i said, i dont plan on running it open and then racing the baja 1000. its just for the times i want to go offroad and have an easier ride.

 

[e60ral]

only one way to find out!

since there is so much fluid in the system, i think its unlikely to get hot enough to even degrade much less fail.

like i said, i dont plan on running it open and then racing the baja 1000. its just for the times i want to go offroad and have an easier ride.

i'd be more worried about the stabilizers and maybe the accumulator

 

[transplant]

i'd be more worried about the stabilizers and maybe the accumulator

isnt the "accumulator" fluid on both sides? a typical hydraulic accumulator would have pressurized gas on one side and the fluid on the other... right?

even so, i wouldnt expect high speed use to get too crazy. its a stabilizer bar not a shock. the movement at speed wont be full stroke even though it could be considerably faster.


like i said, we will see.

 

[CS223]

I'm here reading as much on the KDSS system as I can trying to make a decision. on a new Off Road. First I'll preface it by saying that I 'technically' drive off road every day. About 3 miles one way, twice a day on an often rough wash boarded, sometimes washed out Florida dirt road. Our half mile 'driveway' is almost always deeply rutted & washed out with rut crossovers due to the 95 feet of elevation change from the bottom to the top.

The body roll on the wife's SR5 annoys me some on the highway especially when we are on a trip to the mountains. Daily FL highway driving doesn't have much curves, biggest thing would be an avoidance maneuver. The SR5 is smooth on this rough dirt road, at least compared to my F-150 4x4 with LT tires which will shake the fillings from your teeth.

The video on the KDSS function shows that it reduces body roll on the highway which is a big plus to me and that it should smooth out the washboard as well. But I see conflicting posts here in that regard. I really don't want to end up with a harsher ride on the dirt road since it's part of my daily commute, though I can't imagine it being anything like the F-150. Does anyone here have first hand experience driving with KDSS under those conditions on a daily basis? I have no intentions of modifying or lifting the vehicle, it will live it's life in a stock configuration other than new tires when that time comes. All indicators here say get the KDSS option.

 

[SATSTRAIL]

I'm here reading as much on the KDSS system as I can trying to make a decision. on a new Off Road. First I'll preface it by saying that I 'technically' drive off road every day. About 3 miles one way, twice a day on an often rough wash boarded, sometimes washed out Florida dirt road. Our half mile 'driveway' is almost always deeply rutted & washed out with rut crossovers due to the 95 feet of elevation change from the bottom to the top.

The body roll on the wife's SR5 annoys me some on the highway especially when we are on a trip to the mountains. Daily FL highway driving doesn't have much curves, biggest thing would be an avoidance maneuver. The SR5 is smooth on this rough dirt road, at least compared to my F-150 4x4 with LT tires which will shake the fillings from your teeth.

The video on the KDSS function shows that it reduces body roll on the highway which is a big plus to me and that it should smooth out the washboard as well. But I see conflicting posts here in that regard. I really don't want to end up with a harsher ride on the dirt road since it's part of my daily commute, though I can't imagine it being anything like the F-150. Does anyone here have first hand experience driving with KDSS under those conditions on a daily basis? I have no intentions of modifying or lifting the vehicle, it will live it's life in a stock configuration other than new tires when that time comes. All indicators here say get the KDSS option.

My truck has KDSS. In my experience so far I have definitely noticed that this system reduces body roll and makes cornering in the truck hands-down better. However, I have not at all noticed that it improves the ride quality/reduces the road impacts such as on washboard terrain. In fact I have found that it rides pretty rough... I guess I am slowly starting to get used to it though

 

[Jeremy556]

I'm here reading as much on the KDSS system as I can trying to make a decision. on a new Off Road. First I'll preface it by saying that I 'technically' drive off road every day. About 3 miles one way, twice a day on an often rough wash boarded, sometimes washed out Florida dirt road. Our half mile 'driveway' is almost always deeply rutted & washed out with rut crossovers due to the 95 feet of elevation change from the bottom to the top.

The body roll on the wife's SR5 annoys me some on the highway especially when we are on a trip to the mountains. Daily FL highway driving doesn't have much curves, biggest thing would be an avoidance maneuver. The SR5 is smooth on this rough dirt road, at least compared to my F-150 4x4 with LT tires which will shake the fillings from your teeth.

The video on the KDSS function shows that it reduces body roll on the highway which is a big plus to me and that it should smooth out the washboard as well. But I see conflicting posts here in that regard. I really don't want to end up with a harsher ride on the dirt road since it's part of my daily commute, though I can't imagine it being anything like the F-150. Does anyone here have first hand experience driving with KDSS under those conditions on a daily basis? I have no intentions of modifying or lifting the vehicle, it will live it's life in a stock configuration other than new tires when that time comes. All indicators here say get the KDSS option.

You will have a much harsher ride with KDSS on washboard roads (compared to an SR5 or limited) if you are traveling above 12mph. That is the biggest drawback for me to KDSS.

 

[Riverfisher]

You will have a much harsher ride with KDSS on washboard roads (compared to an SR5 or limited) if you are traveling above 12mph. That is the biggest drawback for me to KDSS.

2017 TRDORP with KDSS. Can confirm; a lot less body roll on road, great articulation at slow speed off road, and will rattle your fillings loose on a washboard similar to a full size truck. If you want to go fast off road, the Bilstein set up may be more appropriate.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[DeepSea]

Couple informative KDSS links for you guys. 1st is a write-up and video from 4x4 Australia:

https://www.4x4australia.com.au/reviews/road-tests/1606/toyota-prado-kdss-test

And 2nd my video showing the actual KDSS flexing along with the suspension on the trail via a GoPro mounted on the side of the skid plate. Fast forward to 1:50

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/PaUOahy7S8s?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[e60ral]

Just drop your air pressure on washboarded FS roads

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[05Rrunner]

Absolutely not, I tried to reply "NO" it was too short . lol

 

[1engineer]

Absolutely not, I tried to reply "NO" it was too short . lol

No... works just fine. I use it a lot...

 

[CS223]

And 2nd my video showing the actual KDSS flexing along with the suspension on the trail via a GoPro mounted on the side of the skid plate. Fast forward to 1:50

That by far is the most informative bit of video information on the system I've seen. The most common animation video linked when KDSS is searched shows the shocks hydraulically tied together though accumulators which if that were the case, then I would expect the system to handle washboard as depicted, the animation also implies that its a passive system. Clearly not the case at all on the 4R.

So as I understand it now, the KDSS system has heavier sway bars which are locked down highways speeds or above 12mph. That accounts for the improved handling. At crawl speeds, the sway bars are allowed to drop thus giving the suspension more room to articulate.

From what I've read KDSS has no impact on nose dive either.

So it appears in reality there isn't any real solution to having good cornering performance and good rough road performance. Other than specific performance shocks or soft tires.

If KDSS had a mode where it lowered the sway bars slightly, lets say two inches for the sake of engineering argument and then locked them down, would this serve to soften the ride on rough roads?

Curious how much rougher it would be with stock tires. Recently put Yokohama Geolander A/T's on the SR5 because the wife wanted the same smooth ride & quiet performance of the original Bridgestones.

 

[wfo9]

If KDSS had a mode where it lowered the sway bars slightly, lets say two inches for the sake of engineering argument and then locked them down, would this serve to soften the ride on rough roads?

No. The height has nothing to do with it.. If the connection between the sway bar and the frame is rigid... Then the sway-bars are going to impact the spring rate between opposing wheel movement on the same axle.

If the KDSS system had a manual mode where you could flip it on/off... Run loose at mid speed.. It would smooth out just fine. But its doubtful the system is designed to take such violent cycling of those cylinders over time.

An electronic disconnect (like what the JK Rubicon) has is what most offroad enthusiasts would really like to have. Toyota's system is more geared towards not having to think about it... and it works for most use cases, just not 100% ideal.

 

[CS223]

No. The height has nothing to do with it.. If the connection between the sway bar and the frame is rigid... Then the sway-bars are going to impact the spring rate between opposing wheel movement on the same axle.

If the KDSS system had a manual mode where you could flip it on/off... Run loose at mid speed.. It would smooth out just fine. But its doubtful the system is designed to take such violent cycling of those cylinders over time.

An electronic disconnect (like what the JK Rubicon) has is what most offroad enthusiasts would really like to have. Toyota's system is more geared towards not having to think about it... and it works for most use cases, just not 100% ideal.

Found the other thread where someone experimented with pulling the fuse & pulling the connector on the control module to achieve that operation but I would agree with you that the cylinders and system isn't designed to take that kind of high frequency movement. I typically drive 30-40 mph on the dirt road so KDSS isn't going to do anything for me.

So the question at this point is what can I do, after-market presumably, to improve the handling on the highway without harshing the ride on the dirt road?

And thanks all for helping me not make an $1800 mistake.

ETA it's sounds like the X-REAS system is what I should be looking for. Is this anything that can be added in an after-market application?

 

[wfo9]

Found the other thread where someone experimented with pulling the fuse & pulling the connector on the control module to achieve that operation but I would agree with you that the cylinders and system isn't designed to take that kind of high frequency movement. I typically drive 30-40 mph on the dirt road so KDSS isn't going to do anything for me.

So the question at this point is what can I do, after-market presumably, to improve the handling on the highway without harshing the ride on the dirt road?

And thanks all for helping me not make an $1800 mistake.

ETA it's sounds like the X-REAS system is what I should be looking for. Is this anything that can be added in an after-market application?

Honestly.. the hwy ride is pretty darn good without KDSS if you ask me. Sure KDSS has way less body roll, but it is big body on frame SUV and drives better than most trucks stock.. If you drive mountain roads constantly with hairpin turns.. KDSS can feel really nice.

Some people have added ploy bushings to the swaybar and say they notice a difference in handling.

Better aftermarket shocks will greatly improve the overall ride. Never messed with XREAS myself, but overall I would avoid it as unnecessary complexity and mixed reviews.

 

[CS223]

Reading up on the Bilstein 5100 threads, seems this is a popular option. While this will primarily be my ride, the wife will occasionally drive it when hers is being serviced or when we take turns driving on trips. Making a noticeable change in the harshness of the ride will not go over well with her.

 

[CoolMax]

Reading up on the Bilstein 5100 threads, seems this is a popular option. While this will primarily be my ride, the wife will occasionally drive it when hers is being serviced or when we take turns driving on trips. Making a noticeable change in the harshness of the ride will not go over well with her.

Makes it better, helps with the brake dive.

 

[flyinhawyan]

What was the verdict?

only one way to find out!

since there is so much fluid in the system, i think its unlikely to get hot enough to even degrade much less fail.

like i said, i dont plan on running it open and then racing the baja 1000. its just for the times i want to go offroad and have an easier ride.

So what was the outcome of your experiment? We never got any feedback.