KO2 no traction -Scary!

[NorthwoodsRunner]

These posts are very helpful. I have Bridgestone Duelers on my 2016 and they are so-so in the rain. I run dedicated Nokian Hakkapeliitta r2 tires now. Planning to get DEFENDER LTX M/S to replace Duelers. Stable performance in the rain is a must have IMHO.

 

[Florunner78]

I've got about 15k on mine over nearly 2 years of Florida rain and the only time I've had issues is going around a 90 degree turn just after the rain started and the oil hadn't washed off the road yet - the rear end kicked out a bit but to be fair I was accelerating through the turn. I wonder if it's a QC thing?

 

[Oey12]

I have have run the KO’s and Rugged Terrains and Trails are various Tacoma’s and my 1st and 3rd gen 4Runner. They KOs were especially great in the deeper snow but I found Bfgoodrich tires in general seemed to use a hard rubber compound which lead me to get wheel spin with every model on all my trucks. I want to put them back on my 5th gen but I know they don’t hold a candle to my Michelin’s in ice and rain. The wheel spin was dramatically reduced on my Tacoma’s after going to Michelin’s. Nothing wrong with the KO 2s in my opinion they are just geared for more specific purposes than handling rain and ice...leans more towards off roading than commuting.

 

[teotwaki]

I have a 2014 Trail Premium with KO2 and traction on wet roads is scary. I took an exit on the freeway yesterday the kind that cloverleafs around 180 degrees. I was going 35 around the curve (which is what the rating was on the yellow signs), it was 37 degrees and lightly raining. As I continued around the turn the back end broke loose and started to drift out. I ended up in a controlled side until I could get down below 20mph. No cars in front of me or behind had any problems making the turn.

This is not the first time these tires have lost traction. When it rains the tires spin when you pull out into traffic or leave a traffic light if the roads are wet.

Has anyone had issues with this? Should I put some weight in the cargo area? I loved the KO1, the KO2 are not as good.

Depending on the size of tire and the inflated PSI it may have a really small contact patch which makes it easier for it to lose traction compared to stock sizes.

 

[Jivewalker]

Had mine for around 20,000 miles and they have been great so far in the heavy SC Low-country rains, hurricanes, 100 year freak southern snows, etc. Running at 36 psi. Wear could be a little better, but I expected what I'm getting. Third set of tires on the runner, never had any issues with any of them. First were stock Duellers that lasted 70k. Next were Michelin LTX that lasted 70k. Now on the KO2's with around 20k.

 

[DrVolkl]

Just got my K02's a few weeks ago... plenty of rain here in Seattle and so far they're no worse than the stock TRD tires that came with the truck. Haven't noticed any extra slip.

 

[Decipher]

Thanks for the more specific responses.

I’m not discounting the experience of some users but load rating matters when you apply it to the Runner. I suspect this is where a lot of the issues arise.


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[WI_4Runner]

Thanks for the more specific responses.

I’m not discounting the experience of some users but load rating matters when you apply it to the Runner. I suspect this is where a lot of the issues arise.


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Additionally the mileage/condition of tires at time of review.

Most tire reviews are done when tires are new and freshly mounted, and of course with tacky tread and fresh compound, said reviews are always overflowing with praise. Beyond balancing issues, traction in the first 10k miles of any tire is superb IMO.

Seems after a few seasons and/or about 20-30k miles, tires see a considerable decline in traction regardless of tread depth remaining.

I have AT3's that performed marvelously in our PNW wet/snowy winters for the first 2 or 3 years. They have plenty of tread left @ 9/32" but factor in wear, UV, moisture, hot and cold cycles etc., that tire is noticeably slicker to the touch and at the wheel.

 

[duck911]

Just put KO2's on my new 4Runner and it didn't make a huge, noticeable difference in the ride to me.

But I have run KO2's on all of my previous trucks and I expect the 4Runner to also ride like a truck, so maybe I am not that picky.

I've always had GREAT luck with those tires.

--Duck911

 

[downshift]

Curious -

Tirerack reviews give the K02 excellent ratings in the rain. Not that that's the final word or anything, but I've found Tirerack ratings to be pretty good. And it's not just one or two people, there are several hundred reviews here.

I wonder if there is some difference between 4Runners and other SUV's/Trucks/Jeeps that use the same tires?

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=BFGoodrich&tireModel=All-Terrain+T/A+KO2

 

[The Waco Kid]

Curious -

Tirerack reviews give the K02 excellent ratings in the rain. Not that that's the final word or anything, but I've found Tirerack ratings to be pretty good. And it's not just one or two people, there are several hundred reviews here.

I wonder if there is some difference between 4Runners and other SUV's/Trucks/Jeeps that use the same tires?

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=BFGoodrich&tireModel=All-Terrain+T/A+KO2

Read the last note at the very bottom... That should tell you everything. It's not objective.

They also have another table that summarizes all this info for several other AT tires, including the old KO... and the old KO scored higher than several current tires in wet performance despite being objectively proven to be one of the worst tires available in the segment for wet traction.

 

[downshift]

Read the last note at the very bottom... That should tell you everything. It's not objective.

They also have another table that summarizes all this info for several other AT tires, including the old KO... and the old KO scored higher than several current tires in wet performance despite being objectively proven to be one of the worst tires available in the segment for wet traction.

Of course the reviews are subjective. So are the comments in this thread. What I'm saying is that Tirerack has a lot of subjective reviews that say this tire is good in the rain while this thread has a small number (relative to Tirerack) of subjective reviews that say this tire is not good in the rain. I'm curious why there is such a discrepancy.

What table are you referring to? I found the table that has all the other current "On-/Off-Road All-Terrain" tires, which is the Tirerack category this tire is in, but it does not have the old KO. And where was the old KO "objectively proven to be one of the worst...?" Did someone do some do some actual quantitative testing? It would be interesting to take a look at those tests, perhaps they tested the new KO2 as well.

 

[The Waco Kid]

Of course the reviews are subjective. So are the comments in this thread. What I'm saying is that Tirerack has a lot of subjective reviews that say this tire is good in the rain while this thread has a small number (relative to Tirerack) of subjective reviews that say this tire is not good in the rain. I'm curious why there is such a discrepancy.

What table are you referring to? I found the table that has all the other current "On-/Off-Road All-Terrain" tires, which is the Tirerack category this tire is in, but it does not have the old KO. And where was the old KO "objectively proven to be one of the worst...?" Did someone do some do some actual quantitative testing? It would be interesting to take a look at those tests, perhaps they tested the new KO2 as well.

I posted a link to an actual test of available AT tires from expedition portal a few pages back. It's there. It appears they've dropped the KO from the table since I last looked at it, but they also had it above the AT3 which was proven to be superior in almost every category (to the KO).

Subjective data is just that. It has a lot of bias and variances from people that live in and use the tires in a variety of different conditions. In that same post a few pages back I explained a why this information was useless and why you shouldn't rely on it alone.

Edit: I get that this thread is full of subjective information, I mentioned that as well. Peoples opinions are useless without actual data to support it. When you have nothing else to go on, the sure, anecdotal evidence may be the best source if you're unable to rely on anything else. You need to consider the source though.

For an example, in Houston we get a ton of rain each year, but few actual rainy days (less than 1/3 of the year) but when it does rain, it rains for days and it tends to pool on the road. If someone from Arizona, Nevada, Utah, and Southern California swears that theirs tires are great in the rain, I'm going to discount that opinion due to the fact that their situation is nothing like mine. Even someone in Austin, because even though it's in the same state, their climate is vastly different than mine.

All that said, a customer survey is useless in this regard because you have no way of knowing where the person drives, what conditions they put it through, what their driving habits are, or how many miles they actually logged in that situation.

 

[CO-Cygnus]

I posted a link to an actual test of available AT tires from expedition portal a few pages back. It's there. It appears they've dropped the KO from the table since I last looked at it, but they also had it above the AT3 which was proven to be superior in almost every category (to the KO).

Subjective data is just that. It has a lot of bias and variances from people that live in and use the tires in a variety of different conditions. In that same post a few pages back I explained a why this information was useless and why you shouldn't rely on it alone.

Interesting. I was looking at AT3 4S recently as an all-year possibility, just not sure how much it gives up on offroad durability.

 

[The Waco Kid]

Interesting. I was looking at AT3 4S recently as an all-year possibility, just not sure how much it gives up on offroad durability.

Not much. It's weakest point is the thin(er) sidewall compared to the KO/KO2. 2ply vs 3. Traction wise they are good all-rounder offroad. Plenty of people on here use them, and they're really popular with the Subaru crowd.

 

[rcfs1834]

I agree with the Waco Kid...each of us drives in different climates with different conditions, so a tire that works great in Montana might not be that great in Florida.

That being said, I have 25k miles on a set of OEM size KO2's in Load E (the shop I went to put on the load E's since I just asked for KO2's in the OEM size, my bad for not researching and getting Load C's). I was running the KO2's in the low 40 psi range and I am now at 37 psi. I thought they were an OK tire but at around 20k miles I noticed a loss of traction on wet surfaces, especially breaking loose when starting from a stop. Now it's nothing truly scary, just disappointing and I have to adjust to it.

I live on the coast of southern Maine and we get a lot of rain in the late fall and early spring. And during the winter the snow ranges from a foot of light and fluffy stuff to a mix of snow/sleet/freezing rain. I did have the original KO's on a '95 Pathfinder and that was a tank in the snow/wet conditions. But I do know that some people hated that tire too. On my '03 4Runner I ran Revo's and Grabber's to save money and those were OK tires. So when I bought my '16 my first upgrade was the KO2's since I had a good experience with the KO's. The KO2's are OK in my driving conditions, but I'm not impressed with loss of wet traction at around 20k miles.

As winter is coming upon us soon, I'm going to look at swapping out the KO2's for the Cooper AT3 4S or ATW.

 

[nevada]

im hearing the "breaks traction when taking off from a stop" quite often. how hard are you guys launching at lights?

given enough throttle, just about every tire is going to slip in wet conditions when taking off...

 

[rcfs1834]

[MENTION=84120]nevada[/MENTION] I don't have a lead foot and I've never encountered the breaking traction before on other tires in wet conditions (until I had the KO2's). Per my post above, it didn't start happening until 20k miles with the KO2's.

 

[bigbadpoppa]

im hearing the "breaks traction when taking off from a stop" quite often. how hard are you guys launching at lights?

given enough throttle, just about every tire is going to slip in wet conditions when taking off...

This is exactly my issue. It wont break on flat...but once you combine a slope it will break on me. I wouldn't say I am driving the truck hard at all nor at grandpa pace.

An aggressive turn it will break on flat and wet. That I expect for these tires since they are not designed specifically for wet.

On another note...hard braking on wet is suspect. The tire does lose traction during this scenario also.

On hwy wet crusing...no problems

Running 36 psi, tried 32 psi. No difference.

 

[2flyfishin]

KO2’s going back

Against my better judgment, I recently bought the KO2’s in c rating. As I mentioned earlier, I knew they would have poor wet traction due to my past experience with the ko’s. My thought was I also have a Chevy traverse and I will just drive it when it rains. This past Sunday I drove down a dirt road that I have gone down a 100 plus times and almost got stuck. I never had a problem before these tires. Three days before I drove down it same conditions in my two wheel drive traverse, never spun a tire! Mind you I never had a second thought when I drove my Volkswagen Jetta the 30 or 40 times down this road! With my terra grapplers no 4 wheel drive, never spun a tire! Two days later, I went back with my buddy in his F-150 with street tires and he drove straight through, 2 wheel drive, and never spun like it was nothing. On our way back, we pulled over to let a freaking Nissan Altima go past in the same section I had to 4 wheel drive in! and still had a hard time. I have never been so freaking embarrassed! These tires are crap! I almost had to air down to drive through 100 yards of 2 inch deep sand that a Altima had no problem with! And this whole time I was worried about wet weather performance!