Stock ground clearance

[Doubledown4x4]

I recently bought a 4th gen 4Runner and took it out for some mild off-roading. I was surprised that I heard so much scraping underneath. It looks like the front skid plate drops really low to the ground and was scraping on everything. I noticed that a lot of folks remove the stock running boards as well (I understand the reasoning now).

Overall, I'm surprised that the 4Runner doesn't seem to have much ground clearance in stock form. My previous truck was an Isuzu Trooper 4x4 and that thing cleared most dirt roads just fine. Is a lift pretty much necessary to do any off-roading in the 4Runner?

 

[Thai]

I recently bought a 4th gen 4Runner and took it out for some mild off-roading. I was surprised that I heard so much scraping underneath. It looks like the front skid plate drops really low to the ground and was scraping on everything. I noticed that a lot of folks remove the stock running boards as well (I understand the reasoning now).

Overall, I'm surprised that the 4Runner doesn't seem to have much ground clearance in stock form. My previous truck was an Isuzu Trooper 4x4 and that thing cleared most dirt roads just fine. Is a lift pretty much necessary to do any off-roading in the 4Runner?

This topic has been discussed many times. Stock ground clearance on a stock 4wd 4runner (4th gen) is 8.3". The lower lip of the front skidplate is lower than 8.3", but the actual skid is about 8.3" off the ground. This is the lowest point of the 4runner. If you want something mild, then i would recommend a 1" front spacer lift + FJ Cruiser springs (+/- shocks). That would give you more front clearance without negatively affecting durability and reliability of the front suspension components. Of course, a quick fix would be to get bigger tires.

 

[Pikeman]

I ran my 3rd Gen stock with out lift off-road for a year doing some hard trails. As mentioned by Thai the front bumper with approach angle is usually the bigger problem on the 4th Gen. The front bumper on mine is a little higher and less likely to scrape stuff. I also removed the running boards after my first trip out since they did rub a bit on some things. If you are going to wheel a considerable amount then I would probably advise a 2-3" lift however if it is a once in a blue moon then Thai is right on the money with 1" Spacer and the next larger tire (i.e going from a 265/70 to a 265/75 will give an additional half in in most cases)

 

[Doubledown4x4]

Sorry for the newbie questions. I did some searching and found some conflicting/confusing info so I'm hoping that folks can clear things up for me:

Does the OME suspension kit stress the front suspension components? I've read some conflicting reports. Some say there is no significant stress since the lift is less than 3 in., yet I've seen some OME suspension bundles with a diff spacer and/or upper control arm replacement?

Also, doesn't getting higher profile tires throw off your speedometer?

 

[Pikeman]

IMO if you have it set below 3" then you are fine without the diff drop however it doesnt hurt it to put it in either. I have mine set at 3" and use the diff drop. The kits available dont usually add that much more stress themselves, its the use of the vehicle after we lift that adds the stress. replacing the Upper Control arms isnt necessary with most lifts, it is only when you go for the max height adjustment on Coil overs that you will be maxing out your ball joint angles. In this case an aftermarket UCA with Uniball will fix that.

Yes going with a higher profile (larger) tire puts your speedo off a little. I went from 265/70/16 factory tires to a 285/75/16 tire which is a two inch overall increase. My speedo reads 70MPH when my GPS is tracking me at 73-74.

 

[Thai]

I know that i am in the minority...but i believe that any lift will put stress on your suspension components and decrease its durability. For one thing, the CV boots life will be shortened significantly.

 

[Pikeman]

I know that i am in the minority...but i believe that any lift will put stress on your suspension components and decrease its durability. For one thing, the CV boots life will be shortened significantly.

If going with a minimal (1-2) lift that is designed to work with each indivdual part then is not a real issue or significant stress. I do not like Spacer lifts for the simple fact that they do add more stress on factory parts not designed for it. A shock and spring combo designed to work in tandem is just as durable and in a lot of cases more durable. Thicker shock bodies and shafts for example.

CV boots life is shortened if you go with the taller lifts because the fins/ ribs start to touch each other causing friction and heat. This will reduce their life significantly. That is why they offer the diff drop to help minimize this rubbing of the cv boot ribs. This was a trade off I was willing to accept based on my individual usage of my vehicle.

To the OP- what you need to do is really assess how you plan to use your vehicle and make your decision based on that. Knowing that whatever you decide there are pro's and con's with each.

 

[Will_4R]

I understand the concern with ground clearance, but with careful driving it really isn't that bad. That said, I would still like to increase it a bit, but like you I am concerned with messing with the front end geometry. From my research (mostly on here), I have concluded that going up in tire size is the more conservative way to improve clearance (assuming the tire fits without rubbing). The tire will only give an extra half inch of clearance though. I think the next most conservative mod after that would be beefier skid plates.

I have also conculded that if you do lift, a full suspension swap (coil and shock) is better than a spacer or coil only. A concern with the front diff drop is that it could adversely affect the safety of your vehicle in a crash (I am not completly sure how mind you.)

 

[techno]

This topic has been discussed many times. Stock ground clearance on a stock 4wd 4runner (4th gen) is 8.3". The lower lip of the front skidplate is lower than 8.3", but the actual skid is about 8.3" off the ground. This is the lowest point of the 4runner. If you want something mild, then i would recommend a 1" front spacer lift + FJ Cruiser springs (+/- shocks). That would give you more front clearance without negatively affecting durability and reliability of the front suspension components. Of course, a quick fix would be to get bigger tires.

I seem to remember a recent thread where you said you would recommend a locker before doing a lift.... good to see you've changed your mind

 

[Doubledown4x4]

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I'm still rather confused on the whole lift situation.

I found a thread and states that diff spacers are not necessary (one member stated that he Emailed the fabricator of spacers who told him they weren't necessary - which begs the question, why does he market/sell them??):
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/41888-diff-drop-necessary.html

Then I found another thread where a member installed diff spacers with his 3" lift and had CV boot problems anyway:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/54592-lift-installed-now-cvs-leaking-pretty-bad.html

Reading threads like this and your responses here, it seems like regardless of HOW you lift (whether it's with suspension spacers or a full blown replacement kit), you're bound to run into issues with the CV joints/boots. That's rather depressing as the stock clearance is somewhat disappointing for me coming from another truck that had more clearance stock and hence required no modification.

 

[Will_4R]

Techno is that member who sent the email.

By installing the diff drop you are losing an inch of clearance that you gained from the lift, you are altering the drive shaft angles and you are potentially affecting safety. It is a trade off of course, but you need to be reasonably sure there is going to be some gain.

 

[techno]

Doubledown, the bottomline is you will get far more benefits from a lift than you will get problems. There are literally hundreds and hundreds of guys out there with all sorts of lifts. Some people experience issues, others don't. Those that do rarely if ever see the problem as severe enough to warrant returning to stock.

For my lift on my 3rd gen, I got nearly 3" of lift up front, no diff drop and my cv boots are still ok after 18 months. I can see where the ribs contact but there is no sign of deterioration. I make sure they are clean after being offroad and I give them the occasional squirt of WD40 to keep them soft and help prevent then drying up and cracking. For me, lifting has caused no issues at all.

As Thia mentioned earlier, I think you should consider increasing your tire size first. Bigger tires will increase the entire ground clearance, suspension lifts do nothing for the lowest point on the vehicle, the rear diff.

 

[Doubledown4x4]

Great, thanks for the info everyone!

 

[Thai]

I seem to remember a recent thread where you said you would recommend a locker before doing a lift.... good to see you've changed your mind

Only in your dreams would i ever change my mind on a topic....

 

[java]

on my 4th gen, i have a bit over 3" in the front, i had 100k on it before lifting and my CV boots did start to leak a little, easily fixed by a new clamp. the consensus is that for the 4th gens there is no diff drop needed. i am happy with the way it handles and drives, also factory alignment specs were acchieved for me with the stock UCA's.

hope that helps

its OME 885/895 if that helps

 

[BlairB]

I think with 2-3 inches of lift a diff drop is not necessary. I personally run one on my truck because I am running over 3.5 inches of lift in the front and I was having some leakage from my driver side CV band. Diff drops are definitely no necessary, but at the same time, do not hurt.

The reason diff drops are less needed on 4th gens when compared to older Toyota trucks is that from the factory the CV's are actually angled upward rather than downward, so you can actually lift your 4Runner a decent amount and still maintain your factory CV angles, just in the opposite direction (although on full drop they will be stressed more).

 

[gratefulneal]

I know that i am in the minority...but i believe that any lift will put stress on your suspension components and decrease its durability. For one thing, the CV boots life will be shortened significantly.

You may be in the minority but you are right...doesn't matter what truck you drive...a lift increases stress on all of the suspension components...if you don't think so, then you are in denial!

The Aussie's have it right, they limit the lift one can drive with a vehicle on the street to like 2" (something like that); not only is it SAFER for everyone else and the driver, but it has a double benefit of not having too much stress on the components.

If you wanna rock crawl, then make it with your 2nd vehicle b/c imo, a daily driven rock crawler would be a nightmare to drive!

 

[Thai]

If you wanna rock crawl, then make it with your 2nd vehicle b/c imo, a daily driven rock crawler would be a nightmare to drive!

Yup. I don't like to modify factory suspension geometry too much for fear of loss of durability and reliability, which is inevitably the case with any significant lift kits. Reliability and durability are two factors why most people on this forum bought a 4runner. I much rather concentrate on things that will improve upon the factory setup and improve traction (aka appropriate tires, rear locker, sliders, etc.). If i wanted a full-blown off-roader and not care about durability, then i would get the Jeep Wrangler where the mods are cheaper and the suspension easier to modify.

 

[Will_4R]

What you you consider "too much" (or a conservatively safe) lift for a 4th gen? What do you think about how the 4th gens axles are angled slightly downward, where a mild lift would either strighten them out, or put them at the same as stock angle (but upward)?