TBU with a twist

185Runner

185Runner

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So in my research I have come across that in a lot of cases the 96-00 4 Runners had a different Master Cylinder and possibly Brake Booster that won't be able to handle the 231 upgrade. So I've been looking into doing the 199 to still gain the thicker rotor.

My questions that I haven't been able to find answers for are:

Why not swap the MC to the newer style?
Would a swap be direct?
Has anyone done it?
Are the boosters the same?
Would swapping adversely effect the abs system?

Please correct me if I'm wrong. Any advice is accepted.
 
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My advise, since you asked, just do the 199 upgrade. It's plenty, I've been more than pleased and I do quite a bit of high mountain pass driving in southwest Colorado...
 
I never had any issues with my 231 swap. Brakes feel fine, work fine, don't warp like the stockers did, I'm a happy camper. It was a '99 SR5 Highlander. No issues with the 231 swap on my wife's '96 SR5 either.

If you're going to bother swapping calipers and rotors, might as well go the extra mile Err... 32mm.
 
I did the 231 because my nearly 6,000lb 4Runner was eating the 199mm rotors for breakfast. No problems after the switch from 199 to 231.
 
JWaldz said:
Didn't take long to find these :rolleyes: lol

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/100329-master-cylinder-upgrade-options.html

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/187027-replace-entire-brake-system-tundras.html

Our MC's are already 1" bore (or 15/16" bore, debatable). Which, is plenty enough to handle just the 231mm Tundra upgrade.
Click to expand...



Thanks for these. Apparently I still need to learn to internet... (although most of it is because I didn't have much time to search at work). I just want to be sure. I read a lot about the soft pedals with 231s or abs issues. So I was looking at the 199s I'll continue to do more research, maybe i can improve my internetting skills...
 
I put them on the 97 puppy hauler. After adjusting the rear brake shoe and ebrake bell cranks it's all good.


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So I have crunched some numbers on the TBU and it doesn't seem like a reasonable upgrade for those with the larger factory brakes (16" factory wheel). I just crunched the numbers and the rotor is only 8% larger. It is thicker, which will help dissipate heat, that I am not disputing.

I'm not sure, but if you already have the larger brakes (13WL caliper) do you need to upgrade calipers or just rotors (and pads?)? I am 99% certain my OE calipers say 13WL inside them.

If you have the larger brakes, shouldn't your MC be larger? maybe that's why some report soft pedal after and some don't. Just a thought. I would opt for some Powerstop slotted z36 rotors and pads for a tundra or limited 4Runner if I were going to do any sort of swap.

Also as noted above, making sure your rear brakes are working will significantly extend the life of your front brakes and stop better. Mine won't self adjust and now my final wheel bearing is out so one side is full of oil.
 
Renegade_Medic said:
So I have crunched some numbers on the TBU and it doesn't seem like a reasonable upgrade for those with the larger factory brakes (16" factory wheel). I just crunched the numbers and the rotor is only 8% larger. It is thicker, which will help dissipate heat, that I am not disputing.

I'm not sure, but if you already have the larger brakes (13WL caliper) do you need to upgrade calipers or just rotors (and pads?)? I am 99% certain my OE calipers say 13WL inside them.

If you have the larger brakes, shouldn't your MC be larger? maybe that's why some report soft pedal after and some don't. Just a thought. I would opt for some Powerstop slotted z36 rotors and pads for a tundra or limited 4Runner if I were going to do any sort of swap.

Also as noted above, making sure your rear brakes are working will significantly extend the life of your front brakes and stop better. Mine won't self adjust and now my final wheel bearing is out so one side is full of oil.
Click to expand...

This has been debated extensively, but the consensus among those who have done it is that it very much worth doing. I have a 2000 with the TBU, and a 99 without it. Hands down the 2000 stops better and has no pedal pulsation. The 99, not so much.

If you have 13WL calipers, you already have the larger pad. Are you sure you don't have 13WE?

And slotted rotors do nothing for everyday stopping. If you plan to road race on the weekend, they might benefit you.

Here is the definitive post on TBU.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/94923-hard-find-specs-info-measurements-231mm-13wl-tundra-calipers-rotors.html
 
IBallEngineer said:
This has been debated extensively, but the consensus among those who have done it is that it very much worth doing. I have a 2000 with the TBU, and a 99 without it. Hands down the 2000 stops better and has no pedal pulsation. The 99, not so much.

If you have 13WL calipers, you already have the larger pad. Are you sure you don't have 13WE?

And slotted rotors do nothing for everyday stopping. If you plan to road race on the weekend, they might benefit you.

Here is the definitive post on TBU.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/94923-hard-find-specs-info-measurements-231mm-13wl-tundra-calipers-rotors.html
Click to expand...

On the WL vs WE, it could say WE. I have just noticed it in passing, not really reading it. I'll look later, didn't know there were 2 similar markings.
I initially had pulsing pedal, but after putting new OE rotors and Wagner Thermoquiet pads on, it has been vastly improved.

Does your 99 have the 318.5 mm Rotors?
 
185Runner said:
Thanks for these. Apparently I still need to learn to internet... (although most of it is because I didn't have much time to search at work). I just want to be sure. I read a lot about the soft pedals with 231s or abs issues. So I was looking at the 199s I'll continue to do more research, maybe i can improve my internetting skills...
Click to expand...

Soft pedal means there's unaddressed brake issues still there, like air in the master cylinder or brake lines or un-bedded brakes.

Going on 2 years here on my 98 and so happy I did it. My ABS actually had to work a few times before I got new tires, before that it had NEVER turned on because I couldn't ever stop fast enough for it to do so! Lol!
 
gamefreakgc said:
Soft pedal means there's unaddressed brake issues still there, like air in the master cylinder or brake lines or un-bedded brakes.



Going on 2 years here on my 98 and so happy I did it. My ABS actually had to work a few times before I got new tires, before that it had NEVER turned on because I couldn't ever stop fast enough for it to do so! Lol!
Click to expand...



That's crazy! And also good to know!
 
Renegade_Medic said:
On the WL vs WE, it could say WE. I have just noticed it in passing, not really reading it. I'll look later, didn't know there were 2 similar markings.
I initially had pulsing pedal, but after putting new OE rotors and Wagner Thermoquiet pads on, it has been vastly improved.

Does your 99 have the 318.5 mm Rotors?
Click to expand...

I've only had my 99 since last June, and it had brand new rotors and pads when I got it so I didn't pay close attention. Didn't measure anything and didn't even look at the caliper markings. I'll be doing the TBU soon though, it REALLY needs it.

:juggle:
 
IBallEngineer said:
I've only had my 99 since last June, and it had brand new rotors and pads when I got it so I didn't pay close attention. Didn't measure anything and didn't even look at the caliper markings. I'll be doing the TBU soon though, it REALLY needs it.

:juggle:
Click to expand...

Actually I just checked mine and they say S13WM. What the heck?
 
Renegade_Medic said:
Actually I just checked mine and they say S13WM. What the heck?
Click to expand...

I wasn't going to call you on it, but there's no way possible that a stock 4Runner had the 13WL calipers. They only came on larger vehicles like Tundras and Sequoias.

It's worth your time & money, especially if you need new rotors and brake pads anyway.
 
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