v8 Pinging/Detonation on hard accel... What's the cause?

[vtecmonster]

this is an interesting thread ... i myself own a V8 and from what i've read on this thread, i see everybody is fascinated with this "ping" or the thought of their engine "detonating" under hard acceleration. i believe i have similar sounds with my V8 Runner but i doubt its pinging or any type of detonation.

Coming from a background of racing honda's, when someone says "ping" or "detonate" its usually a sign that the motor is about to blow ... honestly the sounds that I hear that i try to compare to what is being talked about on this thread sound like sticky valves to me .... which my guess would be a motor oil issue. The "ping" sounds that are mentioned above are more like "tick" sounds and they have rithym like tick, tick, tick, like a clock and never misses a beat.

when an engine "pings" or "detonates" bad enough that it becomes audible, that motor is done, and is about to shoot a rod thru the block or some kind of cotastrophic event will take place ... as with my experience with hondas.

to find out if a motor is really "pinging" or "detonating," you would have to run a wideband O2 sensor kit that monitors air/fuel and have a datalogger. it will show vitals like air/fuel mixture, timing advances/re****s throughout the RPM range. it will allow you to see all the activity with timing and fuel mapping at every RPM which will let you see exactly where pinging or detonating occurs.

i know this is a yota thread and i speak from honda experience but its mostly general engine management knowledge that can be applied to anything that runs on a basic engine ...
just my personal observation not trying to school anybody, just contributing what i know to an information thread ... food for thought, hope it helps.:hatsoff:

i remember one member on here boosting their 4R and was in the process of tuning it???, maybe they'll chime in and elaborate on what i am trying to explain.

 

[MikeInNH]

Pinging doesn't mean the engine is about to blow...HOWEVER...Hard pinging CAN CAUSE an engine to blow.

If the engine is pinging STOP DOING IT. Get it checked out. My V6 says I should use 91 octane. If I run 87 octane the vehicle shouldn't knock. But that's only because the knock sensor senses the knocking and then re****s the timing. If I run 91 octane then the knock sensor shouldn't sense any knocking and re**** the timing.

The vehicle needs to be checked. Sounds like the knock sensor isn't working.

One more thing on pinging....Older vehicles may have carbon buildup that causes more excessive pinging. But the knock sensor still should prevent pinging.

Another cause is if a timing chain or timing belt slipped a tooth. But if that happens you'll notice pinging all the time.

 

[eli_lilly]

If the engine is pinging STOP DOING IT. Get it checked out. My V6 says I should use 91 octane.

I think the manual says 91 research octane, which is 87 "US octane" ((R+M)/2). But his rig definitely shouldn't be pinging. Maybe he is right in that he's hearing something rattling other than the engine? Usually pinging is at the low end of the torque range (lower RPMs), not right before the shift when the RPMs are higher.

-E

 

[Mark86]

I have the same thing. My dealer told me not to worry, it isn't a "bad ping." I notice it more with 93.

 

[stanleybb50]

Still doing it... Not sure if with the change of weather / temp is causing it or not but I'm hearing pinging more often now... I should check to see if it's just loose skid plates or something I guess... But I'm hearing it more often for sure as of late.

 

[JohnnyT]

Might want to try a bottle of dry gas on your next fill-up in case you have too much water in the tank.

 

[stanleybb50]

Might want to try a bottle of dry gas on your next fill-up in case you have too much water in the tank.

I'll definately try it. Thx to your reco, I've got a bottle on the way from Amazon for the next fill. It's worth a try. Although, now that almost all gas has ethanol in it, the water in the tank is not so common.

 

[stanleybb50]

Well, I threw the dry gas in tonight, and also cleaned the MAF sensor (it was cleaned about a year ago). And pulled any fuses that seemed to have anything to do with EFI or the computer. We'll see how it goes on the commute tomorrow.

 

[Wingman707]

08 V8 limited

Under heavy throttle, I too experience a pinging or a dieseling sound. If I am under descent throttle pressure, then feather the pedal a bit more, I can produce that sound.
Here is the kicker, I too noticed it after removing the resonator and added a magnaflow 16" double walled muffler. This sound doesn't concern me too much but enough for me to start searching for a thread.
I run exclusively CA Chevron 91 octane. I am going to try a octane booster to see if it will change anything. The knock sensor is an interesting approach. And makes sense.
I have a 100k 2 year warranty and would love to sort this out prior to its expiration.

 

[WillK]

You have a lot less back pressure now, so your engine is trying to compensate for it, but it can't. I bet you've loss some low end torque too...

Either get an intake, or swap to a muffler with more back pressure and I bet the ping will be gone.
But I'm willing to bet it's not an octane issue, but a back pressure issue.

 

[curtis325]

Anyone ever find a solution to this? I am experiencing the same thing. Not a pretty sound. I am at 90,XXX and just had the timing belt done. I heard it before, so it wasn't related to that. Will changing the plugs make any difference? Probably due anyhow.

 

[peebee]

I'm not trying to be ugly, but there's just a lot of bad information in this thread. The OP hasn't even clearly defined the type of "ping" it is. And engines blowing up from detonation? No... Just no... You would notice very significant issues with much bigger red flags than just a little ping.

Is it a synchronous ping? Something that is very distinctly timed with RPM's?

Or is it more of a true "rattle" that happens with detonation? Some non-mechanical people describe it as a "lose screw rattling around" but someone earlier in the thread also described it as a "dieseling" sound, which is accurate (but not as heavy).

 

[stanleybb50]

I'm not trying to be ugly, but there's just a lot of bad information in this thread. The OP hasn't even clearly defined the type of "ping" it is. And engines blowing up from detonation? No... Just no... You would notice very significant issues with much bigger red flags than just a little ping.

Is it a synchronous ping? Something that is very distinctly timed with RPM's?

Or is it more of a true "rattle" that happens with detonation? Some non-mechanical people describe it as a "lose screw rattling around" but someone earlier in the thread also described it as a "dieseling" sound, which is accurate (but not as heavy).

Over a year later....

Dude - it's the most common usual pre-ignition/detonation sound. A ping in an engine doesn't need too much of a description.

 

[aeb28]

Over a year later....

Dude - it's the most common usual pre-ignition/detonation sound. A ping in an engine doesn't need too much of a description.

Not true, it could be this...

Muffler Bearing - $33.95 : KaleCoAuto.com, Your home for the rare, unusual, and hard to find auto parts.

Or you could try this... It should take care of ALL sounds coming from the engine

Engine Scrub - $32.99 : KaleCoAuto.com, Your home for the rare, unusual, and hard to find auto parts.

 

[stanleybb50]

Not true, it could be this...

Muffler Bearing - $33.95 : KaleCoAuto.com, Your home for the rare, unusual, and hard to find auto parts.

Or you could try this... It should take care of ALL sounds coming from the engine

Engine Scrub - $32.99 : KaleCoAuto.com, Your home for the rare, unusual, and hard to find auto parts.

I'm talking about the olé time "70's v8" climbing a hill on low octane fuel here.

It's not that bad and obviously hasn't caused any problems as my T4R still has all its juice.

Man this forum likes to flex their "I'm smarter than you" muscles a lot...

 

[bpowa]

Still got some knocking when I gass 'er up... I even threw in 89 octane this tank and more of same...

Not that noticeable, but I notice everything with my ride. And it'll do it under even like 3/4 gas if I hit it suddenly.

You feel you may have a ping and went with midgrade gas to see if it get rid of the ping?

Doesn't it make more sense to put 91octane just to see if it is a denotation/ping?

DOPE... I got suckered into a thread from the dead.. OP do you still have the issue?

 

[aeb28]

I'm talking about the olé time "70's v8" climbing a hill on low octane fuel here.

It's not that bad and obviously hasn't caused any problems as my T4R still has all its juice.

Man this forum likes to flex their "I'm smarter than you" muscles a lot...

Sorry my sarcasm was not more transparent. I am actually with you on this one, detonation is pretty unmistakable IMO.

I disagree that the forum flexes their "Im starter than you" muscles, personally I have found it 98% helpful and 2% flexing... I posted the silly links with the premise someone pulled up a year old thread to say how everyone is wrong and its all bad information.

If you said that its detonation, then I am going to assume it is detonation. Anyway, I hope you got it fixed.

 

[stanleybb50]

You feel you may have a ping and went with midgrade gas to see if it get rid of the ping?

Doesn't it make more sense to put 91octane just to see if it is a denotation/ping?

DOPE... I got suckered into a thread from the dead.. OP do you still have the issue?

Haha not really. But I'm not worried about it anymore anyway. All seems well.

And yes I'm the op and I responded to someone *seemingly* picking on me from 1.5 years ago

 

[MrRoo]

Lots of times detonation can be caused by a dirty PCV system. Which causes oil in the intake manifold. Oil drastically lowers the octane level. Very small amounts of oil in the fuel/air charge can cause this. Very common on lots of motors. You could try to install a oil catch can designed. For use on a PCV system. I use them on my LS Motor in my G8. Common on LS motors. I got detonation on my G8 till I put the catch can on. No more in my intake either. If you understand how a PCV system works, you'll know what I'm talking about. Worth a shot. I use Mighty Mouse catch cans. I have one on my 2010 highlander also. No more oil in the intake on that. My 98 3rd gen has a simple. Moroso can on it. Gets about 6oz of oil every 3000 miles. Remember oil in the PCV system is "dirty". Full of moisture and contaminates that would normally go right back into the engine.

 

[MrRoo]

Lots of times detonation can be caused by a dirty PCV system. Which causes oil in the intake manifold. Oil drastically lowers the octane level. Very small amounts of oil in the fuel/air charge can cause this. Very common on lots of motors. You could try to install a oil catch can designed. For use on a PCV system. I use them on my LS Motor in my G8. Common on LS motors. I got detonation on my G8 till I put the catch can on. No more in my intake either. If you understand how a PCV system works, you'll know what I'm talking about. Worth a shot. I use Mighty Mouse catch cans. I have one on my 2010 highlander also. No more oil in the intake on that. My 98 3rd gen has a simple. Moroso can on it. Gets about 6oz of oil every 3000 miles. Remember oil in the PCV system is "dirty". Full of moisture and contaminates that would normally go right back into the engine.