DT tire ratings (handling, noise, comfort)

MAST4R

MAST4R

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This thread is about the new Discount Tire ratings for various tires.

Note: you must enter a vehicle and then search by wheel size and then by tire size to see the new rankings.

EDIT: from a PM I got from Discount Tire:
"The data provided such as Handling, Noise, Stopping Distance, etc is provided by an industry leading automotive vehicle and tire testing company specializing in subjective and objective evaluations. Longevity averages are based on manufacturer's data, tire industry data, and data captured in our stores from our customer's experience."

The data also includes dry and wet braking but I did not take that info out. However, the winners in dry braking from what I noticed are the P-metric Wrangler Adventurer with Kevlar and the P-metric Falken Wildpeak AT3W. Among the poor performers is the LT-C/D KO2.

Here is what I was able to find looking for 265 70 17 and 255 75 17.

The info is in the order I got it, not sorted out. I am NOT SURE how trustworthy it is but it is on Discount Tire's website. Funny enough, the data sometimes shows and sometimes does not. I am sure I got the General ATX LT-E data but I cannot go back to it now. Clicking on Cooper AT3 4S got me the data twice and twice it did not? Anyway.

First number is handling, second is noise, third is ride quality, out of 5.

KO2 LT-C/D 3/2.5/2.5
Duratrac P-metric 3/3.5/3.5
Conti A/T P metric 4/3.5/3.5; LT-E 3.5/3.5/3.5
GO15 P-metric 3.5/4/4
AT3 4S P-metric 4/4/4
Wrangler ATS P? 2.5/3.5/3.5
Wildpeak AT3W P-metric 4.5/4/4; LT-E 3/4/4
Terra Grappler G2 P-metric 2.5/3/3
Discoverer ATP 3.5/2/2
Ultraterrain P-metric 3/2.5/2.5
Discoverer AT 3 LT-C 3.5/3.5/3.5
Baja ATZ P LT-E 3.5/2.5/2.5
Ridge Grappler LT-E 3/3/3
Dueler Revo 3 P? 3.5/3.5/3.5
Wrangler Adventure with Kevlar P 3.5/3.5/3.5
Michelin LTX AT2 P 4/3.5/3.5
MTR 4.5/2.5/2.5
KM 3 LT-E 3/2.5/2.5
Cooper STT MAX 2.5/3/3
Cooper STT Pro 3/1.5/1.5
Grabber ATX LT-E 3/2.5/2.5

Other: Michelin Defender LT-E gets only 3.5/3.5/3.5 with rather poor dry braking: 164 ft vs 124 and 126 for the winners.

Notes: didn't think that many would be available, so did not take P vs LT ratings all the time but I think I got them right.
 
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Are you that these scores are not from consumer reviews?

Link?

I don't see anything on their site except consumer reviews with star ratings (from 1-5).

If so, then i would not put much faith on it. But if they are independent rating made by DT editors or a quotable source, then that is pretty cool and informative.
 
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Thai said:
Are you that these scores are not from consumer reviews?

Link?

I don't see anything on their site except consumer reviews with star ratings (from 1-5).

If so, then i would not put much faith on it. But if they are independent rating made by DT editors or a quotable source, then that is pretty cool and informative.
Click to expand...

They are not based on the consumer reviews. As I said, I am not sure what is up with their site, but the info does not always show up. I just went to a page I had bookmarked and it did not show it until I re-entered the 4Runner as my vehicle and re-did the search.

So, search by vehicle, choose 17", then choose 265 70 17 and start clicking on each tire one after the other. Not all tires have it. Don't forget to cross your fingers first, lol.

Not sure why it has to be so tricky.

Another thing I noted, but only glanced at, was store data about mileage. Most tires, at least in this category, don't seem to live up to their mileage warranties.
 
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MAST4R said:
They are not based on the consumer reviews. As I said, I am not sure what is up with their site, but the info does not always show up. I just went to a page I had bookmarked and it did not show it until I re-entered the 4Runner as my vehicle and re-did the search.

So, search by vehicle, choose 17", then choose 265 70 17 and start clicking on each tire one after the other. Not all tires have it. Don't forget to cross your fingers first, lol.

Not sure why it has to be so tricky.

Another thing I noted, but only glanced at, was store data about mileage. Most tires, at least in this category, don't seem to live up to their mileage warranties.
Click to expand...

I doubt that DT does any formal testings on THAT many tires. TireRack does not even do that many testings!

I think that the only legit source that do that many tire testing is Consumer Reports.
 

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All DT says is "independent" whatever. An outside source in any case, not DT itself, except for tire life which is their store data and thus extremely valuable (for people who do not really go off pavement).

The issue with CR is the very poor coverage of the segment; I like that they have updated their ratings but they are missing way too many tires. Their ratings are not surprising in that the two mildest designs get the best on pavement ratings.

By the way, I think that you should not worry much about noise. I get zero noise from my Wildpeaks in the 4R. I doubt any modern AT design will get noise into the cabin of a Lexus until maybe late in life. I am not sure what vehicle they used.
 
MAST4R said:
All DT says is "independent" whatever. An outside source in any case, not DT itself, except for tire life which is their store data and thus extremely valuable (for people who do not really go off pavement).

The issue with CR is the very poor coverage of the segment; I like that they have updated their ratings but they are missing way too many tires. Their ratings are not surprising in that the two mildest designs get the best on pavement ratings.

By the way, I think that you should not worry much about noise. I get zero noise from my Wildpeaks in the 4R. I doubt any modern AT design will get noise into the cabin of a Lexus until maybe late in life. I am not sure what vehicle they used.
Click to expand...

Well, a GX owner recently dumped your tire due to noise beyond 60: Falken Wilkpeak AT3w on stock wheels - Page 2 - ClubLexus - Lexus Forum Discussion

Sorry, DT does not think that highly of your tires. Your tires are consider 2nd tier by DT, no matter what "independent" ghostly rating that you have found.

BTW, i have owned some of the tires in CR chart. My personal experience is similar to what CR found.
 
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To recap, the DT data I showed you, which is much more detailed than the simplistic best, better, good ratings shows the Wildpeak as their highest rated tire. Whether the data is trustworthy or not is another question. The same is true of the best, better, good ratings. You keep ignoring the AAA study because you don't like the results: cheaper tires are no worse than pricier tires.

How come that a DT "best" tire, their Ultraterrain, has B traction rating in their official UTQG rating? How can that be? Because it is a DT-only tire? Right there, the DT best, better, good loses credibility. I don't care how they rate any particular tire with A traction rating, but to claim that one with B is "best" is...not a serious proposition. As for temperature, all ATs in this size get Bs, so that's fine.

Speaking of experience, for tires I have already had the only opinion that matters to me is my own. I have had Wildpeaks, KO2s, and Conti AT over the last 2 years and the Wildpeaks are the best tire overall.

I have no issue accepting that the top two Consumer Reports AT tires may be the best on pavement. But the advantage over the group of the 68s is small, 72 vs 68. The problem there is offroad. Along the two edges of the tread both of those tires lack the design necessary to allow the tires to bite in soft terrain and the shoulder protectors that allow tires with 2-ply sidewalls to be somewhat trustworthy in rocky terrain. I punctured a Conti AT somewhere between my house and the nearby grocery store due to a box cutter the tire picked up. I don't believe a box cutter can get through the tread of a KO2 since very little of the blade sticks out. There is a reason that Conti omits rocks for their ad material. They are upfront and honest that their tire is for mild offroad terrain. And as such the Conti is indeed a great tire. But it is not in the same group as the more aggressive ATs, be that KO2s, Ridge Grapplers, Wildpeaks, etc.

It is your tires, your choice, hope you are happy with whatever you choose. Let's not turn this thread into another discussion of your tire purchasing decision.

The point of the thread is to discuss the new info added by DT. Maybe it is good info and maybe it is not that good. Maybe someone here knows more and can shed some light on where those ratings come from.
 
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MAST4R said:
To recap, the DT data I showed you, which is much more detailed than the simplistic best, better, good ratings shows the Wildpeak as their highest rated tire. Whether the data is trustworthy or not is another question. The same is true of the best, better, good ratings. You keep ignoring the AAA study because you don't like the results: cheaper tires are no worse than pricier tires.

How come that a DT "best" tire, their Ultraterrain, has B traction rating in their official UTQG rating? How can that be? Because it is a DT-only tire? Right there, the DT best, better, good loses credibility. I don't care how they rate any particular tire with A traction rating, but to claim that one with B is "best" is...not a serious proposition. As for temperature, all ATs in this size get Bs, so that's fine.

Speaking of experience, for tires I have already had the only opinion that matters to me is my own. I have had Wildpeaks, KO2s, and Conti AT over the last 2 years and the Wildpeaks are the best tire overall.

I have no issue accepting that the top two Consumer Reports AT tires may be the best on pavement. But the advantage over the group of the 68s is small, 72 vs 68. The problem there is offroad. Along the two edges of the tread both of those tires lack the design necessary to allow the tires to bite in soft terrain and the shoulder protectors that allow tires with 2-ply sidewalls to be somewhat trustworthy in rocky terrain. I punctured a Conti AT somewhere between my house and the nearby grocery store due to a box cutter the tire picked up. I don't believe a box cutter can get through the tread of a KO2 since very little of the blade sticks out. There is a reason that Conti omits rocks for their ad material. They are upfront and honest that their tire is for mild offroad terrain. And as such the Conti is indeed a great tire. But it is not in the same group as the more aggressive ATs, be that KO2s, Ridge Grapplers, Wildpeaks, etc.

It is your tires, your choice, hope you are happy with whatever you choose. Let's not turn this thread into another discussion of your tire purchasing decision.

The point of the thread is to discuss the new info added by DT. Maybe it is good info and maybe it is not that good. Maybe someone here knows more and can shed some light on where those ratings come from.
Click to expand...

I have not decided on any one tire...so, i don't really care one way or the other what you're trying to push down our throats. But your constant push of the Wildpeaks is frankly annoying.

You mentioned the Wildpeak's off-road ability...yet as soon as you aired it down in rough terrain, it popped. So, clearly, those shoulder "protectors" are not all that effective. Your sidewall is not all that strong.

So, the question is...if you're gonna off-road with some frequency, then frankly, BFG KO2 or Goodyear Wrangler AT with Kevlar are better choices due to their class-leading durability off-road. If you rarely off-road and spend most time on pavement, then Michelins or Conti's (or many more) are better choices.

Wildpeaks are neither here nor there. They are good tires no doubt...but are they class-leading? No. That's my opinion. YMMV.

Unless you can confirm your phantom DT ratings, i will leave this thread to you to boast your Wildpeak's capability.
 
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Thai said:
I have not decided on any one tire...so, i don't really care one way or the other what you're trying to push down our throats. But your constant push of the Wildpeaks is frankly annoying.

You mentioned the Wildpeak's off-road ability...yet as soon as you aired it down in rough terrain, it popped. So, clearly, those shoulder "protectors" are not all that effective. Your sidewall is not all that strong.

So, the question is...if you're gonna off-road with some frequency, then frankly, BFG KO2 or Goodyear Wrangler AT with Kevlar are better choices due to their class-leading durability off-road. If you rarely off-road and spend most time on pavement, then Michelins or Conti's (or many more) are better choices.

Wildpeaks are neither here nor there. They are good tires no doubt...but are they class-leading? No. That's my opinion. YMMV.

Unless you can confirm your phantom DT ratings, i will leave this thread to you to boast your Wildpeak's capability.
Click to expand...

See the edited first post. Yes, confirmed by Discount Tire.

You don't seem to read my posts. I have logged 1,769 offroad miles over 83 complete runs of 70 different trails and dirt roads in 3 states in 12.5 months.

How many people here with MTs and E-load KO2 can match my P-metric Wildpeaks' resume? Half a dozen?

P-metric tires need not be aired in rough terrain, only in deep sand. They have plenty enough flex at 33 psi. I did air down once and it was a mistake.

That said, yes, I am looking for a plan B if I do get an issue in a dangerous spot. So far, the Cooper ST Maxx in LT-C 255 75 17 is the only tire of some interest.

EDIT:
As for the Wildpeak's downsides, I have explained what I dislike about them and why the low price is an essential part of their appeal to me here:
https://www.toyota-4runner.org/3261287-post1274.html
 
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Thai said:
Goodyear Wrangler AT with Kevlar ... class-leading durability off-road.
Click to expand...

You may still have a winner here and it is possible that this is the best overall P-metric AT tire over the Wildpeak. It is possible that the general obsession with looks leads people to overlook a quality tire with ho-hum appearance. However, there are still unknowns, as far as I am concerned:

--How much of that strength argument applies to the P-metric version? Surely, it does apply, but is it enough to make a big difference? I don't know. I very much doubt any of the reviews you found apply to P-metric versions.

--How does it actually perform on dirt and rock? Aesthetics aside, the tread does not seem to have the deeper and more open voids to deal well with loose terrain. I have not seen one in person though. They are not popular around here.

--How does it wear with a lot of offroad use?

The last question is actually even more important than the first, let alone the second (the 4R OR has traction to spare), for me. I am not above trying new tires, but at 220/tire and 12/32 advertised starting tread vs 133 and 14/32nds, respectively, the Goodyear is a terrible value against the Wildpeak for a person that goes through tires quickly, assuming it wears at the same rate. True, right now a set of Goodyears can be purchased with 160 in rebates vs no rebates on the Wildpeaks, so 180sh vs 133, but I don't need new tires now and certificates cover me against punctures. And I am not willing to be the guinea pig when it comes to wear with frequent offroad use.

Maybe you can get a set of those Goodyears and then we will all have a better idea? :)
 
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MAST4R said:
You may still have a winner here and it is possible that this is the best overall P-metric AT tire over the Wildpeak. It is possible that the general obsession with looks leads people to overlook a quality tire with ho-hum appearance. However, there are still unknowns, as far as I am concerned:

--How much of that strength argument applies to the P-metric version? Surely, it does apply, but is it enough to make a big difference? I don't know. I very much doubt any of the reviews you found apply to P-metric versions.

--How does it actually perform on dirt and rock? Aesthetics aside, the tread does not seem to have the deeper and more open voids to deal well with loose terrain. I have not seen one in person though. They are not popular around here.

--How does it wear with a lot of offroad use?

The last question is actually even more important than the first, let alone the second (the 4R OR has traction to spare), for me. I am not above trying new tires, but at 220/tire and 12/32 advertised starting tread vs 133 and 14/32nds, respectively, the Goodyear is a terrible value against the Wildpeak for a person that goes through tires quickly, assuming it wears at the same rate. True, right now a set of Goodyears can be purchased with 160 in rebates vs no rebates on the Wildpeaks, so 180sh vs 133, but I don't need new tires now and certificates cover me against punctures. And I am not willing to be the guinea pig when it comes to wear with frequent offroad use.

Maybe you can get a set of those Goodyears and then we will all have a better idea? :)
Click to expand...

- You doubt that the reviews are with P-metric? I don't know. But you cannot ASS-U-ME either.

Remember, as far as we're concerned, Goodyear (or TireRack) does NOT say that the sidewall of P-metric is any lesser than LT. It just says that the TREAD has one less Kevlar layer. BOTH LT and P-metric have DURAWALL technology; again with NO mention of any difference b/w the two. And i doubt that there is a difference because otherwise, Goodyear / TireRack would say it (as it did with the Kevlar layers).

And in the reviews, DuraWall is very strong. You assumed something that is not written anywhere. Why would you do that?

- Maybe they are not as good, maybe they are. It is interesting that what you focused on is probably not where Wildpeaks is better than Goodyear......given your off-roading experience.

Assuming that Wildpeaks have wider void, I will say that the Wildpeaks are probably better in MUD where the wider tread pattern allows it to self-clean better. In rocks, i think that either is fine...and if you air down, you will have a softer tire wrapping around rock ledges providing more grip. Dirt...either is fine...unless you add water (=mud). At the same time, in sand, Goodyear probably better since your open spaced treads can dig instead of float.

- I have no idea why you even ask this. Not sure what you're getting at. Goodyear is probably more puncture resistant due to Kevlar tread? Maybe yours last longer due to deeper tread? Who knows?! According to DT, Goodyear has 5,000 miles longer warranty in my size (265/65/18)...with shallower tread (12/32 vs. 13/32)...pretty impressive.

- Guinea pig? Did Goodyear just come out? Which tire is newer? Goodyear is standard tires on Tacomas with TRD Off-road and TRD PRO...so, i am sure that they have been abused plenty off-road given how popular Tacomas are in the off-roading community.

Maybe Goodyear cost almost double.......because it has more expensive materials? Maybe because it is better designed (quieter, stronger???)?? Maybe because your Wildpeaks have the looks but ordinary materials?? Maybe because that is why your tire is 2nd tier?

In addition, according to DT, Goodyear weighs 4 lbs less than Wildpeaks, which is ALWAYS a good thing.
 
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New updates to the Discount Tire website.

Their new ratings are called Treadwell ratings and you can now search for tires by choosing your performance priorities.

For example, 265 70 17 with 1/ Handling 2/ Stopping 3/ Comfort and 4/ Tire Life yields the following rankings:

No offroad parameters included in this ranking:

1. P-metric LTX AT 2, not a shock exactly;
2. P-metric Defender LTX
3. P-metric Wildpeak (but the LT version only comes at #44)
4. P-metric Continental AT
...
9. Discover AT3 4S
...
12. Revo AT3
...

Highest rated LT tires on street:
16. Hankook ATM
17. Michelin ATX AT2
18. Michelin LTX
...
20. Goodyear MTR


Other:
22. P Wrangler All Terrain Adventure with Kevlar
25 P Wrangler Duratrac
28 P Geolander GO 15
36 LTE Baja ATZ P3
38 P metric Terra Grappler
48 LTC Ridge Grappler (yikes!)
59 KO2 finally checks in

I am actually surprised that:
1/ AT tires took 3 out of the top 4 places, a testament to how good modern ATs are (and, yes, Michelin is still Michelin on street).
2/ That the Wildpeak outdid the Conti AT in a street test comparison.
3/ That Conti LX20 scored well but not on top
4/ There is a huge gap between P and LT Widlpeak street performance, much smaller gap for the Michelin tires.

EDIT: THat's with my "driving" zip code, not sure it matters though. Doubt the ratings are sophisticate enough to take local weather into account, say dry vs wet climate.

Also, this type of search may only be possible with the stock size tire. I tried an optional size for our Subaru and the rankings did not show up. They did in the Subaru's OEM size as they did in the 4R's OEM size.
 
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I wonder what criteria DT uses. I somehow doubt that Goodyear MT/R is better on the streets than Goodyear ATA with Kevlar. That directly goes against Goodyear’s own ratings. And i would bet that Defender would spank Michelin AT2 on the street as well.

Yeah, weird rankings...some of which makes no sense.

I just wish that TireRack does more comparisons.
 
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