Tech Help Needed: General Grabber ATX on 2018 TRDORP

[jhmoore]

I've got a 2018 TRDORP with stock Dunlop AT20's on it, 45K miles and have been a lot of places. It's my daily driver (back when I had a commute) in San Diego, but I take a lot of trips and it's seen a lot of bad roads in CA, UT, WY, MT and a bit of AZ. I was out doing the White Rim Trail outside of Moab in February, solo, and was looking at my tires and thinking that should probably be my last offroad trip with those tires... with the 45K of wear.

I've been doing a lot of reading online and think I've probably settled on General Grabber ATX's, but have a couple questions that I have not yet found answers to... and I'm by no means a tire expert. Hoping you all can help.

My three choices seem to be

265/70/17 in an "SL" and does not have "LT" in front of the size. 41 pounds, 31.6 inches, and roughly $155 each

LT 265/70/17 in an E rating, 52 pounds, 31.6 inches, and roughly $215 each

LT 285/70/17 in an E rating, 58 pounds, 32.7 inches, and roughly $230 each

Question #1: what is an SL rating?? General Tire says on their website that they don't offer the tire in P-metric, but... the tire doesn't have "LT" in front of it and there are other sizes in their chart for this tire carrying C, D, and E ratings... so where does "SL" fit as a load range??? At this point I'm not towing anything and I'm not hugely overloaded. My biggest concern is avoiding tire damage when I'm a day or two into the backcountry by myself. On the other hand, I have to be able to lift the damn tire if I have to change it by myself.

So can anyone tell me how the "SL" rated tire holds up to the E or what is different about the specs between the two? I assume the SL is less sturdy than the E just by weight, but... what am I losing?

Question #2: I'm pretty tempted to go up to 285, even if all I'm actually gaining is half an inch of clearance over my 31.7 inch Dunlop AT20's (which makes me sad, wish I was gaining a bit more), but ... can anyone confirm firsthand that a 285/70/17 E will actually fit in the spare tire space under a 5th gen (2018 TRDORP)?

Bonus Question #3: I'd really really love a set of TRD wheels, how in the hell did I miss that there was a 40% off sale????

Thanks all!

(photos from White Rim Trail in Feb 2021)

 

[91foxbody]

SL = P rating. I’ve had them on my truck in stock size for 3500 miles and I’m very pleased so far, but my wheeling is limited to the PNW so slick moss-covered rock, fire roads, and snow trips to the mountain (where the P rating really shines).


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[jhmoore]

SL = P rating. I’ve had them on my truck in stock size for 3500 miles and I’m very pleased so far, but my wheeling is limited to the PNW so slick moss-covered rock, fire roads, and snow trips to the mountain (where the P rating really shines).


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generaltire.com (ATX page) says that they don't offer a P rated... unless perhaps the answer has changed since that Q&A 8 months ago?

 

[fkheath]

285s may be to big. Lots of people say they rub. I'd stay with the stock size.

I went with the BFG K02 and like them. Some people say they are hard to balance, but I have not had any problems.

You should be able to find the TRD wheels for less than what your dealer would charge. Even the official Toyota parts web site (Toyota Parts and Accessories - Official Online Store) gives a discount and free shipping to your local Toyota dealer. Try Hub Cap Heaven for good used ones. Or even Ebay.

 

[meltdown]

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=195

SL = Standard Load. As stated above, consider it the same as P rated.

Edited to add: I know I’ve read that 285/70 will fit in the spare location.

In almost every case, 285’s will require a lift and trimming to fit without rubbing.

 

[MIKE969]

I would definitely recommend the SL and stock size, especially if the stock tires got you everywhere you wanted to go so far. As for the rating itself, there are actually two “standard load” tire ratings. P metric is what is equipped by the factory for 4runners (113S rating). My understanding is that they are a “standard” load rating for a given size.

When you go beyond that rating without going LT, it’s technically called ISO metric, which is essentially the same as p metric but with various load ratings. For example, the 265/70r17 Grabber ATX is an ISO METRIC 115T rated tire (as is the Falken Wildpeak).

More info on that here:

https://www.toyotires.ca/sites/default/files/application_of_load_inflation_tables_20170203.pdf

I went through the same dilemma as you did last fall and ended up buying the standard load Falken Wildpeak. The Grabbers were a close second, it essentially came down to looks but it was a coin toss.

If you mostly drive on the road and never had a puncture or other issues with your stock tires, definitely get the SL. They will be more comfortable, be lighter, and you will be able to run them at the standard 32psi instead of having to look at conversion charts and change inflation pressure depending on the payload you’re carrying, as you should technically do with an LT tire.

 

[91foxbody]

generaltire.com (ATX page) says that they don't offer a P rated... unless perhaps the answer has changed since that Q&A 8 months ago?

SL definitely = P, and the next range up is E which is significantly heavier and will affect ride quality/fuel economy. They'll also require a lot more air to fill. I've not done any crazy stuff on my SL-rated tires, but I have not felt the need to air down (for comfort) yet. That will basically be a requirement on E-rated tires from what I understand.

265 fits fine in the stock spare location, but I can't be sure about the 285. 285's will likely need a little massaging to work in the fenders, but it shouldn't be crazy.

 

[Brianr436]

I have been running the General Grabber ATx for the past 3500 miles in stock size (265/70R17 - SL load rating) on my 12 TE. I replaced my stock tires with the Cooper AT3 very soon after purchasing it. The Coopers lasted almost 60k miles. The ATx is a much more aggressive AT tire and the traction that they have is impressive to say the least. The snow traction is phenomenal. We have had a lot of serious storms here in PA and I recently had them up in the Green Mountains of VT. The Atx bites very hard in deep stow and has great traction.

The ATx also looks fantastic. I don't think you need E rated tires unless you are carrying heavy loads or really destroying them off road (rocks and such). The weight of the T4R is more suited to the P or SL rated tire.

 

[NotaTRD]

No complaints with the 265/70/17 AT/X in E load. Ride quality is fine. They are a little louder than the stock Dunlop’s, but didn’t notice much decrease in mpg.

 

[Captain Planet]

I went with the P tires. Mainly driving on sandy soils and beaches. They air down a lot nicer than the LT's I had.

 

[jhmoore]

I got this response from General Tire:

SL stands for Standard Load and is what your vehicle came with from Toyota. Our non LT tires, unless they are OEM, come based on the ETRTO standard which means the Load Rating is higher. Ie your OEM tires were P265/70R17 113S SL, the 113 is the load carrying capacity, were the Grabber ATx is a (Hard Metric) 265/70R17 115T being able to carry more weight at the same pressure as you OEM tire.

The SL version will carry your vehicle without issue and there is always a “But”
it depends on what you are really looking for in regards to performance. For Off Roading, the LT tire will be More Robust, Stiffer sidewalls. The LT285/70R17 will fit your stock rim, keep in mind the overall Diameter is 1.1 inches taller and almost an inch wider. So make sure you have the clearance you need… as for the under vehicle storage area, we do not have data on the opening size so you would have to measure that base on the current tire. find center and the tire radius for the LT285/70 R 117 is
16.35 minimum for ease I would use 16.5”. also make sure there is a heat shield or wider clearance near exhaust.

 

[ElectroBoy]

Here’s a good review of the tire on a 4Runner.
It would be for the LT version since they were 285/70/R17 load range E.
General Tire Grabber A/T X Review | Outworld

https://generaltire.com/sites/default/files/tires/files/GT19_Grabber_ATx_ProductFlyer_v2_Print.pdf

 

[skag1T]

I have a set of General Grabbers ATX on my 2018 4Runner and love them !

They are LT 265 / 70 / R17 - stock size.

LT = Light Truck, they are sturdier than the P (Passenger) rated tires, and I believe the side walls are stronger.

I have about 20,000 miles with them now, and the threads look almost new. I do quite a bit of offroading, and this is my daily driver as well.
I keep them at 35 psi.

Excellent dry traction, on road and off road.

Good wet on road traction, but traction in snow and icy roads is bad ! They slip very easy. As long as you keep that in mind, they are a winner.

 

[jhmoore]

For anyone that this might be helpful for...

I asked General Tire: "When you say stiffer sidewalls on the E vs SL, is that primary simply to carry more weight or would it also impact sidewall resistance to puncture? My 4Runner is not (yet?) overweight... I haven't added a bunch of overlanding gear everywhere... but I do want reasonable resistance to tire damage. How much difference is there in resistance to tire damage between the SL and the E? Are the treads different or the same? Are the sidewalls different or the same? Different in what way? Other than bad luck, are the SL's generally sturdy enough for considerable off road use--in terms of avoiding damange/puncture? Thanks!"

They didn't answer about whether the treads were the same between the SL and E, but did answer in detail and with a drawing for the sidewalls:

"The Load range E tire will have more resistance to Puncture of sidewall damage than the SL tire. it is a benefit of having the higher load capacity. Stronger ply material and full 2 plys of material in the sidewall, as well as a taller bead filler (Apex) for added support below is an example of the SL tire. The SL ply only wraps the bead and comes ½ to ¾ up the sidewall. A LR E that ply is 2 full layers thick which helps deflect objects In the tread and sidewall. The LR E is overall a heavier duty tire and while not indestructible is heavier and more resistant to tears, scuffs and punctures. Downside is stiffer ride and heavy weight. But don’t get me wrong, the SL version is a capable tire and durable. If the question is “will the SL tire work with your vehicle and be a durable product?” yes, if your goal is Best possible durability, LR E is the answer."

 

[TRD PANTHER]

Go SL if this is your daily driver. If they have a C load = 6 plys, that would be a little tougher than an SL, but will weigh more. Going to 285's on an ORP will require approximately 2.5" lift up front and an additional 1+" in the rear. Depending on the rake/stance you desire for looks and loads. Running the TRD Pro wheel works great on 285's and the wheel width and offset will allow you to clear the fender and mud flap/body mount better than any other wheel. The Pro's come with the fender liner mod already done and this is something you would have to do also to your ORP. You will obviously need an alignment afterwards and they can bump the caster up if you are close to the body mounts by the mud flaps. You will probably lose 2-3mpg if you lift it and go to 285's. All these 4Runners have some slight variance when it comes to lifts and tire clearance, so beware. On my Pro I just added Cornfed spacers and did no other mods whatsoever. I really like the stance, ride and offroad ability it has with the SL 285's. It is a good idea to run the same size/type spare also. You could buy 5 and do a 5 tire rotation every 5k too. Good luck with your decision. Nice pics from White Rim.

 

[jhmoore]

Poll: LT E-load or P?

I'm struggling mightily with replacing my stock Dunlop tires with an E rated or P rated tire. Planning to get General Grabber ATX. There's no C load option.

My vehicle: 2018 TRDORP, fairly stock: stock suspension, no lift, haven't added a ton of weight

My usage:
1. Daily driver in San Diego
2. I'll do 3-6 longer trips per year (Sierra mountains in CA; desert in UT/AZ, mountains & valleys in WY/MT/ID) and then some runs out to play in the Anza-Borrego desert outside of San Diego
3. I'm not a hard-core rock crawler
4. I do spend a fair amount of time on unpaved roads
5. Recent offroad, as examples: White Rim Trail outside of Moab; Kofa National Wildlife Refuge--way back; national forest roads outside of Zion NP; national forest roads in Jackson Hole; various trails in Anza-Borrego Desert; White Pocket and other areas within Vermilion Cliffs NM in UT/AZ; various non-hard-core trails in Death Valley NP)

I pretty much always air down. Have been on the stock tires for almost 3 years / 45K miles and have not had a problem. Time to replace those and I'm trying to balance tire weight, MPG, ride, cost, and durability.

Go with the P (SL) or E????

Only difference on the Grabber ATX's been P (SL) and E is the sidewall, so far as I can tell.

 

[Captain Planet]

I have ATX P-rated mainly due to most driving in on sandy soils or the beach. They air down a hell of a lot better than E load tires.

If it was rocky, I would go with E.

It's all a tradeoff.

 

[jhmoore]

Hmmm... my reply up two comments was a new post with attached poll, but looks like some admin combined the this post and that new poll post and buried the info that I wanted to go with the poll deep into this thread....

 

[Tuco S.]

I haven't lost any fuel economy since switching from oem tires to 255/80R17 Toyo OC A/T III (E load). It's both taller (33") and heavier (50 lb) than oem. They ride like I'm on pillows but the handling is much more controlled and stable than the oem tires, probably the stronger sidewalls.

If you frequently venture off road by yourself, I would go for better puncture resistance just to be safe. Toyo makes an E load in oem size at 48 lbs. Great tire.

BF Goodrich KO2 is available in C load 265/70R17. I think Cooper Discoverer has a C load in this size as well.

 

[Pedro367]

I went with KO2s because of the 3 ply sidewall and being a C-load. The Generals are at a great price point, but I have had great experiences with KO2s and definitely would have been dissapointed in going with the Generals for the $200 price difference. KO2s also look cooler because Smiles per Gallon is important