160k ATF change

[Sean7]

Thank you firebirdguy and Berty_K, I appreciate the info given. I'm definitely leaning towards using maxlife and will be picking some up next week after changing the timing belt and water pump at the dealer.

 

[Bikeric]

My last transmission fluid change was at 200,000 miles. I also dropped the pan and replaced the filter, so I have no experience with the coolant hose method. The pan gasket came with the filter. I gave it plenty of time to drain because it just seemed to keep dripping. I also wiped the inside bottom of the pan and cleaned the 4 magnets. Those magnets will give you an indication of your transmissions life. I was very happy to only see minor dust (clutch plate friction material) and not actual metal flakes. I used Valvoline Max Life fluid. Driven another 6,000 miles with no issues.

 

[Captsolo]

I'm in the same boat as you at almost 170K and have been doing a lot of research. I don't know when was the last time mine was changed, if ever.

I'm planning on doing the change myself. The only thing I'm stuck on at the moment is whether to use Toyota's standard atf or go with valvoline maxlife. There is a huge debate about it and both sides make good points. I just don't know yet which one I'm going to go with.

Another thing I'm debating is whether I should also drop the pan and change the filter underneath. My 4runner is lifted and getting under it is not a huge issue.

I let the dealer that sold me my 2005 runner do a tranny drain and fill (and a filter)at 110,000 miles. On the receipt, it says 6 quarts WS (filter), but I bet they only changed 5 quarts D/F.

I'm now down the road with another 45,000 miles and purchased 5 quarts of WS for another D/F, but I'm in no rush. The 4runner tranny holds 12-13 quarts, so I gave some new life to the fluid when I brought it to the dealer (I suppose).

My own feeling is that Toyota transmissions need WS (not the max life), and Scotty Kilmer says always use the same tranny fluid that's in there.

I've seen Toyota 4runner owners say they got to 275,000 miles without ever a tranny D/F or "flush".

I used 3 quarts of Valvoline (non synthetic) for the diff at 135,000 miles, and will D/F the diff in another 50,000 miles.

Synthetic is overrated IMO. Better lubrication if you live in Alaska where it's sub-zero 1/2 the year, but not in this town! :washing:

I don't tow or offroad and seldom see speeds over 50 mph on HW as I live in Nassau Bahamas - an island that is 26 miles long and 7 miles wide. Horrible roads over here.

There's a girl on UTube doing drain and fill videos for Toyota trucks with no dipsticks. I like her method, but want to drain 5 quarts and replace exactly 5 quarts WS, and call it done. She used Maxlife because the customer gave her Maxlife.

 

[Bluesky 07]

Isn't the ATF good for the lifetime of the vehicle?

The difference is the definition of “lifetime.” To Toyota, it’s until the warranty expires and they’re no longer responsible. To the owner, it’s a lot longer than that. IMO, no fluid can protect a high-temp, tough-duty mechanism like a transmission for 15+ years & 300K+ miles, milestones that are by no means unreasonable for a typical 4R.

About Maxlife, look, I don’t know the right answer, but I’m suspicious of any “it does everything!” product. From Valvoline’s website: “MaxLife™ Multi-Vehicle ATF is a full synthetic formulation with advanced additives to prevent the major causes of transmission breakdown and help extend transmission life. Developed to help prevent leaks, maximize transmission performance, reduce transmission wear, and maintain smooth shifting longer than conventional fluids. It is suitable for use in a broad range of ATF applications including most Ford, GM, Toyota & Honda models as well as Dex/Merc, Mercon LV and many more applications.”

Really? It does all those things in all those different transmissions? Maybe, but what I know for sure is that WS works in mine.

 

[Captsolo]

Agree with you bluesky. Stick with Toyota WS.
Toyota 4runner transmissions are built by AISIN and reputed to be the best transmissions in the world - used today by other car and SUV manufacturers.

Copy and PASTE: Aisin automatic transmissions are manufactured by Aisin Seiki and Aisin AW, formerly known as Aisin-Warner, and which was established in 1969 as a joint venture between Aisin Seiki and BorgWarner. The joint venture terminated in 1987. While Aisin Seiki manufactures a variety of automotive components including automatic transmissions for heavy duty vehicle applications, Aisin AW manufactures automatic transmissions for light vehicle applications, including hybrid electric vehicle powertrains

Aisin AW supplies automatic transmissions to 55 automotive manufacturers around the world, virtually every major OEM.

 

[Drcoffee]

Hey, I hope Im not going to cause anybody discomfort, but I am just now replacing the ATF in my new to me 07 T4R sport with 224,000 miles on the clock (I know, mixed measurements). I first start by draining the pan, and only 3.5qts came out. If you were billed for 5-6 qts, you got overcharged. I would expect nothing less from the stealership.

I plan to tow with this truck, so I did a full atf exchange using Amsoil 10qt jug. Its not cheap ($150) but more resistant to heat. I also added a tranny cooler since the radiator is being replaced now as well.

 

[firebirdguy]

the WS vs maxliffe or other fluids has been beat to death on here & other forums... fact is the maxlife & other "universal" fluids have been developed to meet or exceed any specs WS is rated for. need to remember WS was devolped for toyota back in ~2003 when they started to use the sealed trans. major lubricatioin companies like valvoline (ashland) & amsoil etc many years later developed a fluid that can meet or exceed many different companies fluid specs. i would trust a modern fluid designed by companies that specialize in one thing, lubrication fluids. & it is also a fact that synthetic fluids are much better than conventional fluids of any kind, its not just about cold temps, synthetics have better lubrication which means less friction, they handle heat far better & will last longer. maybe for 1 guy that lives on an island & doesnt drive much or ever abuse/tow with their vehicle WS is ok & im sure its ok for many other situations, but why would you pay more for a lower quality product?

its kind of like motor oil that was a SM API spec back in ~2000, since then oils have come a very long way & now SN & SN+ dexos oils are far superior to 20 year old SM oils & using the newer oils wont harm anything on older vehicles. why would anyone use 20 year old SM oil technology (if it was still sold) vs a newer better oil? same applies to WS vs a newer better full synthetic.

& no, WS is not lifetime fluid, the owners manual clearly says to change it at 60k if it was towed with or even just driven in very hilly areas like colorado etc, otherwise its 100k recommended intervals regardless of how the vehicle is driven. yes, you can go to 150k-200k+ miles & the trans will probably not blow up, just like you can go 10k miles on oil & the motor wont blow up, but it shortens its life & causes more wear than needed.

buy the fluid you want, they will both work ok, but just realize there are better fluids today than WS or even 15-20 years ago oils.

 

[AuSeeker]

the WS vs maxliffe or other fluids has been beat to death on here & other forums... fact is the maxlife & other "universal" fluids have been developed to meet or exceed any specs WS is rated for. need to remember WS was devolped for toyota back in ~2003 when they started to use the sealed trans. major lubricatioin companies like valvoline (ashland) & amsoil etc many years later developed a fluid that can meet or exceed many different companies fluid specs. i would trust a modern fluid designed by companies that specialize in one thing, lubrication fluids. & it is also a fact that synthetic fluids are much better than conventional fluids of any kind, its not just about cold temps, synthetics have better lubrication which means less friction, they handle heat far better & will last longer. maybe for 1 guy that lives on an island & doesnt drive much or ever abuse/tow with their vehicle WS is ok & im sure its ok for many other situations, but why would you pay more for a lower quality product?

its kind of like motor oil that was a SM API spec back in ~2000, since then oils have come a very long way & now SN & SN+ dexos oils are far superior to 20 year old SM oils & using the newer oils wont harm anything on older vehicles. why would anyone use 20 year old SM oil technology (if it was still sold) vs a newer better oil? same applies to WS vs a newer better full synthetic.

& no, WS is not lifetime fluid, the owners manual clearly says to change it at 60k if it was towed with or even just driven in very hilly areas like colorado etc, otherwise its 100k recommended intervals regardless of how the vehicle is driven. yes, you can go to 150k-200k+ miles & the trans will probably not blow up, just like you can go 10k miles on oil & the motor wont blow up, but it shortens its life & causes more wear than needed.

buy the fluid you want, they will both work ok, but just realize there are better fluids today than WS or even 15-20 years ago oils.

You bring up a good point about how long the WS has been around and thusly possibly antiquated, just a thought on my part or maybe I'm just being the Devil's Advocate but one would think that Toyota being as quality minded as they seem to be would require that the formula for WS to be modified along with the advancements in lubrication technology?

I just find it hard to believe that Toyota would use a fluid that has seen better days and thusly antiquated if there's something else out that would do the job much better.

 

[firebirdguy]

You bring up a good point about how long the WS has been around and thusly possibly antiquated, just a thought on my part or maybe I'm just being the Devil's Advocate but one would think that Toyota being as quality minded as they seem to be would require that the formula for WS to be modified along with the advancements in lubrication technology?

I just find it hard to believe that Toyota would use a fluid that has seen better days and thusly antiquated if there's something else out that would do the job much better.

so if age is an issue, youre saying WS was changed or improved? that kind of goes against what it was originally designed for at the time it was formulated & how good it was claimed to be. its possible they changed it but personally i doubt it, the MSDS or any analysis done that ive read over the years indicates its the same fluid, & if its so good, there would be no need to change it, right?

but if it was changed at some point in the last ~17 years, that supports the fact that the newer universal fluids like maxlife are legitimately better than original (& current) WS. & still cant get around the fact that WS is not synthetic & maxlife & others are... synthetic fluids of any kind are superior to conventional fluids.

also keep in mind toyota doesnt make their own fluids, aisin spec'd the required fluid & some other lubrication company makes it, then toyota puts it in a bottle with their name on it. same for most all other vehicle manufacturers that sell their branded fluids... VW & audi have a special trans fluid too... but many modern companies offer a fluid that meets or exceeds their specs & is perfectly fine to use.

just like oil, everyone has their opinions on whats best, but the fact is in todays world, almost any oil that meets API specs is ok to use in any engine & you or the engine will never know if you have mobil or valvoline or walmart super tech. im not trying to tell anyone what fluid to use, just pointing out some facts about WS vs maxlife or any other synthetic vs conventional fluid. i prefer to save money & use a full synthetic fluid in my aisin sealed trans.