1st Gen Brake upgrade suggestions?
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flyinhawaiian01
New member
The brembos I had on my truck when I was IFS were cross drilled, and while it felt solid for braking, they warped pretty bad within the first 20k and created lots of tiny cracks between the holes. IMHO, they are just not worth it, stick with a good quality rotor, get some good pads like porterfield or EBC and call it good.
For the record, I did the SAS on my truck and now have solid rotors (from a landcruiser i believe) with the stock IFS calipers, still running the porterfield pads (R4s I think) and have braided brake lines, as well as the 1" master cylinder upgrade from Marlin Crawler. With 35's I can literally lock up the front wheels on dry pavement if I really put my foot in it!
I would not suggest doing the 1" bore master though, I think the best upgrade I did were the brake lines. That stopped all the mushiness in the brakes instantly, but I feel the 1" bore master made the pedal rock solid and required more force to actually get the same amount of braking from the stock master. There's lots of write-ups of the myths of high performance brake mods, but this article explains a TON of stuff about brakes!
Index of /t4r/pulpfriction
Granted, our trucks are not race cars, but the basic principles are the same for better braking in a 4x4.
For the record, I did the SAS on my truck and now have solid rotors (from a landcruiser i believe) with the stock IFS calipers, still running the porterfield pads (R4s I think) and have braided brake lines, as well as the 1" master cylinder upgrade from Marlin Crawler. With 35's I can literally lock up the front wheels on dry pavement if I really put my foot in it!
I would not suggest doing the 1" bore master though, I think the best upgrade I did were the brake lines. That stopped all the mushiness in the brakes instantly, but I feel the 1" bore master made the pedal rock solid and required more force to actually get the same amount of braking from the stock master. There's lots of write-ups of the myths of high performance brake mods, but this article explains a TON of stuff about brakes!
Index of /t4r/pulpfriction
Granted, our trucks are not race cars, but the basic principles are the same for better braking in a 4x4.
joeynational
Member
Did you every report the cracking to Brembo? Their stuff is top notch, kind of odd. Maybe you got a defective rotor or something.
Bad_Vision
Moderator
Upgrading your brakes needs to start at the master cylinder. The turbo model offered a bigger bore size so more fluid pressure. Then after that just get some regular high carbon rotors and good break pads. You have a SUV not a race car so stopping should be friction based not cooling based aka slotted.
You can barley go 100mph so get real and thing surface area. Don't waste time or money in disc brake rear ether.
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You can barley go 100mph so get real and thing surface area. Don't waste time or money in disc brake rear ether.
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nevada
Senior Member
are you having any problems with your brakes now?
is it not stopping well?
I did 86 truck calipers, and 86 land cruiser rotors when I did mine. but that was just so I could get away from the solid rotor. im on 35's, and it still stops very good.
89FourRunner
New member
Keep it simple, make sure both calipers are in good working order. If they are not, they are pretty cheap on rockauto. I did both of mine two years ago just because one wasn't wearing as evenly as the other and it was a night and day difference.
Use the correct material brake pads recommended for this truck - cannot remember off hand.
Bleed them well if necessary. New rotors if necessary.
Not worth wasting money attempting to upgrade anything in this department, especially if you are turning stock sized tires. (225/75 R15 or 31x10.5 R15).
Just make sure it all works right and replace as needed. There will come a time and point where you will need that money for your 4Runner.
Use the correct material brake pads recommended for this truck - cannot remember off hand.
Bleed them well if necessary. New rotors if necessary.
Not worth wasting money attempting to upgrade anything in this department, especially if you are turning stock sized tires. (225/75 R15 or 31x10.5 R15).
Just make sure it all works right and replace as needed. There will come a time and point where you will need that money for your 4Runner.
Griswald
New member
The master cylinder is leaking into the booster. This will be replaced in a couple weeks. Still stops, just not great. The plan now is to do an upgrade of the master and booster and replace the brake lined w braided. Not sure if rotors are needed, but I think the upgrade should add confidence.
txlonghorn85
New member
I'm in the process of doing an upgraded brake booster/1" master cylinder from a later model 4runner on my 85. In addition, stainless brake lines (make sure you go with a reputable brand), later model drum brakes in the rear (much larger), and massive tundra calipers/rotors in the front with the Front Range Off-road mounting kit. I feel this is as good as you can get without getting crazy with it. I run 37s and DD it.
KidVermicious
New member
What do you have now? Solid axle can upgrade to V6 calipers with Landcruiser rotors. Early 4cyl IFS can upgrade to V6 calipers. Trucks that already have the V6 are as upgraded as you're going to get, unless maybe there's a T100 solution that bolts up.
Stainless lines are a bonus and will make definitely a difference, especially if your existing rubber lines are original. If you don't already have a dual diaphragm booster, that will make a difference too. Upsizing the master cylinder without converting to calipers in the rear or much bigger calipers in front won't do anything but make the pedal feel harder. Slotted/drilled rotors would be a complete waste of money unless you're running hot laps at the local track.
Kean
New member
IMO, (generally speaking) cross drilled rotors are usually a waste of money unless you're looking to install them for aesthetic reasons. Even with the claims some make regarding their benefits (which are usually arguable) you'll get more for your money in other upgrades. ....heck, simply changing the old fluid with something better (with a high boiling point), using an appropriate pad for the task and decent solid rotors will make a big difference.
If you have the time, I would really encourage you to read through the technical white papers on Stop Techs website:
Technical White Papers
There is a lot of good information in there. Some of it is is likely way more technical than most will care to learn but much of it is very informative/useful if you want to understand more about braking systems. It gets in depth covering the physics, common issues (and causes), overviews of specific components (pads, fluid, SS brake lines, etc.), BBKs, procedures (like bedding in pads, bleeding...), etc. Great stuff and it's free information.
If you have the time, I would really encourage you to read through the technical white papers on Stop Techs website:
Technical White Papers
There is a lot of good information in there. Some of it is is likely way more technical than most will care to learn but much of it is very informative/useful if you want to understand more about braking systems. It gets in depth covering the physics, common issues (and causes), overviews of specific components (pads, fluid, SS brake lines, etc.), BBKs, procedures (like bedding in pads, bleeding...), etc. Great stuff and it's free information.
Last edited:
nevada
Senior Member
get the mc and booster replaced, then make sure to check and adjust the rear brakes. these trucks have pretty good brakes from the factory, I doubt you will need an "upgrade" above just having new/properly working brakes.
flyinhawaiian01
New member
Nope, this was years and years ago, noticed the cracks when I did the straight axle swap and wasn't going to be using the rotors again, as the new kit had its own rotors.
I figured that they just weren't up to snuff for 33's and hard city/highway driving with the extra mass. The brembos in my supra have been fantastic, although they are only slotted and not cross drilled.
flyinhawaiian01
New member
And, for those who suggest the larger bore master, not bustin' your balls at all, but I have the 1" master on mine and noticed it just requires more force for the same amount of braking power, its just not an upgrade for our vehicles at all. Stick with the ¾" master, you'll be better off.
Its not a horrible master to use, and I won't replace mine unless it is leaking or broken, but if I do, it will be the stock sized master, that upgrade really wasn't an upgrade at all.
Where I've really noticed issues is when I'm on a steep trail, trying to come down a face or anywhere that I'm really hard on the brakes trying to hold the truck in place. I'm not a small guy, but I will notice my leg hurtin' at the end of the day on the trails. Not a big issue, but it could have been avoided if I knew about it. Read page two of the links I posted, it explains the theory in layman's terms.
Its not a horrible master to use, and I won't replace mine unless it is leaking or broken, but if I do, it will be the stock sized master, that upgrade really wasn't an upgrade at all.
Where I've really noticed issues is when I'm on a steep trail, trying to come down a face or anywhere that I'm really hard on the brakes trying to hold the truck in place. I'm not a small guy, but I will notice my leg hurtin' at the end of the day on the trails. Not a big issue, but it could have been avoided if I knew about it. Read page two of the links I posted, it explains the theory in layman's terms.
txlonghorn85
New member
You're going to need the upgraded dual diaphragm brake booster in conjunction with the upgraded master cylinder to receive the desired effect. Your experience sounds about right if you only upgrade the MC. These two along with larger calipers/rotors for heat dissipation are a great upgrade... especially if your truck sees lots of street driving.
IMO, (generally speaking) cross drilled rotors are usually a waste of money unless you're looking to install them for aesthetic reasons. Even with the claims some make regarding their benefits (which are usually arguable) you'll get more for your money in other upgrades. ....heck, simply changing the old fluid with something better (with a high boiling point), using an appropriate pad for the task and decent solid rotors will make a big difference.
If you have the time, I would really encourage you to read through the technical white papers on Stop Techs website:
Technical White Papers
There is a lot of good information in there. Some of it is is likely way more technical than most will care to learn but much of it is very informative/useful if you want to understand more about braking systems. It gets in depth covering the physics, common issues (and causes), overviews of specific components (pads, fluid, SS brake lines, etc.), BBKs, procedures (like bedding in pads, bleeding...), etc. Great stuff and it's free information.
Thanks for the technical white paper link, good reading and for me especially the fluids section. I have used Dot 5 since my time in the Marines, 1984. The silicone based fluid doesn't harm paint and I never noticed any change in the firmness of the pedal. I've used it since that time on many vehicles including motorcycles and once properly bleed no performance issues.
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