2003 4Runner and Changing Tranny Fluid

[live4swell]

I am at a little over 30k miles and am not sure if I should have the Tranny Fluid changed by the dealer. The dealer says 30k is when it should be done. Has anyone done it at 30k or can it wait? This is the one thing i am not sure about.

 

[live4swell]

For more detail, I looked at the fluid on the dipstick and it smelled fine and still had the red color to it. It didnt seem burnt or anything.

 

[TechWrench]

It's your call, but if you wait until the fluid smells burnt it's too late, the damage is already started.

 

[bulldog-yota]

The tranny fluid is supposed to last a very long time, I dont even think it is part of the scheduled maintenance on the 2003.

I did mine at 20k, but I wheel a lot. It wasn't really needed, but rather safe than sorry. Most people will prbably go to 60k before changing.

 

[Kanab]

Mines a 2004 that states if you don't tow you never need to service the transmission. I suggest you check your owners manual and follow its direction. A couple of suggestions If you ever decide to have your transmission serviced and they suggest a transmission flush "NEVER" let them put a cleaner into your transmission only type IV transmission fluid should go in your transmission. With a normal transmission service only a few qt's of fluid will be changed (it is more of a refresh of the fluid), with a flush all 12 qt's of transmission fluid will be changed (much better) many dealers do a flush. But again if you go with a flush "DON'T LET THEM PUT ANYTHING BUT TYPE IV TRANSMISSION FLUID INTO YOUR TRANSMISSION" many transmissions fail after a cleaner is run through the transmission.

 

[TechWrench]

Mines a 2004 that states if you don't tow you never need to service the transmission. I suggest you check your owners manual and follow its direction. A couple of suggestions If you ever decide to have your transmission serviced and they suggest a transmission flush "NEVER" let them put a cleaner into your transmission only type IV transmission fluid should go in your transmission. With a normal transmission service only a few qt's of fluid will be changed (it is more of a refresh of the fluid), with a flush all 12 qt's of transmission fluid will be changed (much better) many dealers do a flush. But again if you go with a flush "DON'T LET THEM PUT ANYTHING BUT TYPE IV TRANSMISSION FLUID INTO YOUR TRANSMISSION" many transmissions fail after a cleaner is run through the transmission.

If I'm not mistaken, you have the 'sealed' 5-speed, and I believe Toyota changed the fluid from Type IV to an AW synthetic which is not compatable with Type IV.

 

[Sac State]

Early '03's had a tranny dipstick. My V8 does. I recall Toyota moved to a sealed tranny early-summer. Mine was built 2/03.

 

[Kanab]

If I'm not mistaken, you have the 'sealed' 5-speed, and I believe Toyota changed the fluid from Type IV to an AW synthetic which is not compatable with Type IV.

TW, I agree. I was talking about his 2003 transmission. Mine is sealed/no dipstick and uses "WS ATF" which is not compatible with any other ATF.

 

[slowginjoe]

Early '03's had a tranny dipstick. My V8 does. I recall Toyota moved to a sealed tranny early-summer. Mine was built 2/03.

does this mean that toyota just decided the dipstick wasn't necessary or is the sealed transmission itself different from the dipsticked one?

 

[TechWrench]

does this mean that toyota just decided the dipstick wasn't necessary or is the sealed transmission itself different from the dipsticked one?

Only Toyota knows for sure. But, IMHO, it is a cost cutting thing on several levels. Removing the dip stick and tube probably saves $10-15 bucks a unit. If they 'seal' the unit, it lessens the possibility of DYI 'tampering', and they probably feel this increases the chances that the unit will outlast the warranty.

 

[Kanab]

Tech, I think they took out the dip stick because they went to a new ATF. The "WS" ATF is a lifetime fill and only needs to be serviced if you tow (then at 60K mile intervals). Since the WS ATF is not compatable with any other type of ATF and is a life time fill fluid I doubt they wanted owners poring type IV ATF down the dip stick.

 

[TechWrench]

Tech, I think they took out the dip stick because they went to a new ATF. The "WS" ATF is a lifetime fill and only needs to be serviced if you tow (then at 60K mile intervals). Since the WS ATF is not compatable with any other type of ATF and is a life time fill fluid I doubt they wanted owners poring type IV ATF down the dip stick.

Maybe I'm a little old fashioned, but I am somewhat skeptical about the claim of 'lifetime' fluid in any transmission. Maybe I'm a little paranoid, but my perception is that the manufacturers no longer trust us with the vehicles they sell us. It's not that I think the WS type fluid is bad, just the opposite. But I want to be able to monitor its condition my self without having to climb underneath it all the time. After all, Toyota is already suggesting that it can fail under the additional stress of towing. If they don't want me to mix any other type of fluid with the WS, then tell me in the manual. And if I am stupid enough to not read the manual or ignore it, the I should have to bear the consequences.

I rebuilt transmissions for a living, up until I got out of the automotive service line, so I feel I am qualified to maintain my own vehicles. I spend a lot of money aquiring service manuals on all my vehicles, and trying to keep up with where technology is going. I also know that no matter how well built a transmission is, it is not bullet proof. Seals and gaskets can fail. If one does, I would like to be able to keep the trans full until the repair can be made. I know I am in the minority among vehicle owners, because I don't mind getting a little grease on my hands. But I feel there are a lot of forum members in the same minority. And I also feel that many of us though we like the inovations of the newer vehicles, we are a little uncomfortable about the trend tword the necessity of taking take them to the dealer for normal service procedures.

OK, enough of my bitchin', I'll climb down of my soap box, for now.
:violin:

PS: It wouldn't surprise me if someone comes up with a 'mod' very soon to retrofit the 'sealed' unit with the older pan and dipstick before long. If I had the new 5-speed, I would be looking at it myself.

 

[Kanab]

Tech I can't argue with what you are saying.

 

[Cliff s]

I would guess that Toyota is using a synthetic trans fluid and took out
the the dip stick to keep Jiffy Lube from filling the transmission with Dexron
and ruining the transmission, then Toyota has to pay for the rebuild under warranty.
GM and Ford are doing the same thing.

If you read your service order fine print from Jiffy Lube it disclaims
any damage done by any of the products.

Who knows what oil they put in cars, it all comes from one spout,
but they charge extra for the various types.

Cliff s

 

[TechWrench]

I would guess that Toyota is using a synthetic trans fluid and took out
the the dip stick to keep Jiffy Lube from filling the transmission with Dexron
and ruining the transmission, then Toyota has to pay for the rebuild under warranty.
GM and Ford are doing the same thing.

If you read your service order fine print from Jiffy Lube it disclaims
any damage done by any of the products.

Who knows what oil they put in cars, it all comes from one spout,
but they charge extra for the various types.

Cliff s

A perfect example of why Jiffy Lube will NEVER see one of my vehicles.

 

[Larry]

A quicky lube in my area had several 55-gal drums of engine oil and if you read the stensil carefully it said '30w HD'. They service all kinds of new cars and none of those cars require 30wt oil. So, I don't think I'd go to one of those places. Your dealer may put 10w-30 in your 4Runner when he should use 5w-30 and say he knows local conditions better than the factory (choke).

And I can give you some insight on the 'sealed transmission' stuff. The factories are going to synthetic oil that can not be 'mixed' with other oils. Some times the competence of service people borders on sabotage. We build gen sets that are designed to go full throttle, full load for a year without service or any outside help, because local service sometimes does more harm than good. It cost a bit at first to figure out how to do it and then cost a bit more to implement it but in the end, it saved money. It's simple, you may not like it but it's the futrue.

 

[toyo]

If your tranny has Type IV fluid, I suggest you drain and refill every 15 k miles. If you do that I promise you wont ever have a tranny problem. I am giving you that advise from alot of experience.

 

[slowginjoe]

If your tranny has Type IV fluid, I suggest you drain and refill every 15 k miles. If you do that I promise you wont ever have a tranny problem. I am giving you that advise from alot of experience.

is that a full transmission flush or just what falls out the pan?

 

[Larry]

A complete flush every 15k miles is a but much, and expensive. I've got about 16k on an 03 V8 and plan to flush and replace with Red Line ATF (just my choice, there are many good ATF's), and then run to 50 or 60k miles and do it again. I'm going to do it in my driveway. I just don't trust the idea of a machine. I think that puts seals at risk, and besides I can be sure I'm getting nothing but MY NEW SYNTHETIC. I'm calling the first 15 to 20k miles a break-in. For me, it's because I keep vehicles a long time.

 

[toyo]

That is not a flush, just a drain and refill. It will cost you less than $20.00. I say your taking a gamble if you put anything else in your trans besides TypeIV fluid from Toyota.