3PMSF Tires for the winter

[chipski]

I did a search and read through many of the threads, but most of the time they got off on tangents or weren't really for winter driving.

A little background first- planning a trip out to Utah/Colorado mid Feb-Mar 2022 for about 4 weeks of skiing. I will be driving my 2016 4Runner 4wd out there from North Carolina, so plenty of driving non winter conditions each way. Don't really want to go with a full blown winter tire and I'm looking more at the 3PMSF category. I just picked up a full set of 17" stock oem wheels to mount these new tires on. So I will not use these tires year round.

Trying to get suggestions from fellow owners that actually have driven a specific tire in snow/winter conditions.

Heard good things about the Nokian's, but just don't know anything about the brand. Also have looked at some Coopers and Falkens. But at this point I'm wide open to all suggestions.

TIA

 

[91foxbody]

General ATX or Falken Wildpeaks.


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[DingleTower]

I'm typically a full blow winter tire kind of guy. My wife's 4Runner has Blizzaks for the winter but I just decided to put General Grabber ATXs on my new Tacoma as a year round tire. I live in the cold Canadian prairies and a couple friends have them on their trucks and have been happy with winter performance. Around here most work trucks (fleet trucks, RCMP, Hydro company etc) use Duratracs all year long. Definitely a proven AT that can handle winter.

I'd recommend either of those two if you're not looking for a full winter tire.

 

[Bmnorm2]

www.tirerack.com is your friend for tire research. Other than brand new tire models they have extensive reviews as well as objective ratings for dry, wet, snow, noise, treadwear, etc...

I know you aren't looking for full winter, but if you are going to own 2 sets of tires/rims you really should use that to your advantage to cover the full range of conditions. Aka... get winter tires and throw them on every winter. Whether you go full winter or not you will likely never use up the tread and end up scrapping due to age. I was an engineer at Bridgestone for 5 years, there really is no substitute for winter tires in CO winter conditions.

I'd recommend the Bridgestone Blizzak DM V2s
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...20&autoModel=4Runner&autoModClar=TRD Off-Road

 

[xtacles]

We run Cooper AT3 4S' and have been extremely pleased with them all around, including winter/snow/slush/rain. They don't look nearly as aggressive as most A/T tires but they are quiet, handle great and haven't impacted MPG.

 

[spartacus]

Almost any tire with 3 peak snow rating would be good. Yokohama geolander at have served me well. You cant beat Michelin defender ltx ms in my opinion. Really good highway tire really good wet and snow tire and pretty good off road.

 

[Mike Beyers]

I agree with the guys who are recommending a full on winter tire. If you're going to have two sets, you might as well have the advantage. I have studded Firestone Winterforces that I run from December to about mid-March. They turn your 4Runner into a tank in the snow. I don't know what the legalities are in your state regarding studded tires, but they are totally worth the noise when things get ugly.
HOWEVER, if you don't go full on winter, go Grabber ATX.

 

[chipski]

I agree with the guys who are recommending a full on winter tire. If you're going to have two sets, you might as well have the advantage. I have studded Firestone Winterforces that I run from December to about mid-March. They turn your 4Runner into a tank in the snow. I don't know what the legalities are in your state regarding studded tires, but they are totally worth the noise when things get ugly.
HOWEVER, if you don't go full on winter, go Grabber ATX.

Mike-
Thanks for the suggestion- I grew up in NJ and my dad used studded on his work van during the winters- can't beat them. I guess I could bring in the full on winter tires into my search (non studded). Living in NC now- I have learned that when it snows and the conditions are bad- that you stay home so you don't interact with the crazies that really don't have a clue on how to drive in the snow...

 

[4Rums]

Heard good things about the Nokian's, but just don't know anything about the brand. Also have looked at some Coopers and Falkens. But at this point I'm wide open to all suggestions.

TIA

I have the Nokian Rotiiva AT Plus in 275/70/17 (LT C-Load) and have been happy with them. They are quiet, don't vibrate, and good traction in the snow. I run them all-year and drive frequently to the mountains during the winter. They are just short of 30k miles and the 80% wear mark is still showing, so durability seems pretty good too (17/32" thread depth when new).

 

[Rack]

I ski Utah exclusively, UDOT does a great job with keeping the roads to the resorts open. Tourism is Utah's Bread & Butter.

I have Michelin Defenders and have not had any problems with them.
The only resort I would hesitate to go in Bad weather is Powder Mountain the road from Eden to the resort is a "Double Diamond".

Regardless of what tires you get, always carry a set of Tire Chains

 

[Humble Leader]

if you're driving anywhere where it's below about 45 degrees F, a non dedicated winter tire, even the 3PMS, is going to be a compromise. there's nothing more to it, dedicated winter tires are far superior to all terrain tires in every type of winter driving scenario, including very cold dry pavement

If you only drive in winter weather occasionally and generally have warmer winters without a lot of ice and sub zero temperatures then many of the tires listed here will be fine. the siping of the winter tires is very different from the all terrain tires. honestly it sucks to have to get two sets of tires and two sets of rims, but really that is the best combination you can have

Many will disagree with me and say they run ATs that are as good as winters. I run winters from nov - april due to the sub zero temps, snow, ice and slush where I live during those months, I can tell who runs them and who doesn't on the road

 

[chipski]

I ski Utah exclusively, UDOT does a great job with keeping the roads to the resorts open. Tourism is Utah's Bread & Butter.

I have Michelin Defenders and have not had any problems with them.
The only resort I would hesitate to go in Bad weather is Powder Mountain the road from Eden to the resort is a "Double Diamond".

Regardless of what tires you get, always carry a set of Tire Chains

I do plan on picking up some chains just in case- would hate to miss a great Pow day because I can't get to the mountain. We will be skiing LCC and BCC with maybe a couple trips to Deer Valley.
I do agree about the Powder mountain access road- fun in clear weather- down right never racking snow covered in places.

I'll look into the Defenders

 

[Ripper238]

I live in the NE and snow can get bad. I used to do dedicated Vredestein snowtrac 5's (best dedicated snow I have used) on my Acura TL and Mazda3 since i had dedicated rims for them. But with the 4Runner i went with Goodyear Duratracs, so many people reamended them for better snow/wet AT tire. Great tire and hard to beat in the snow without going dedicated snow tires.

 

[TrailRunnin14]

They seem to get a lot of hate but always a fan of KO2’s in the winter. I’ve never had an issue in rain or snow with these tires. I think they grip really well in the snow and I highly recommend them.


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[02SE]

I live by the Cottonwood Canyons, and can tell you that sometimes they can be treacherous. There are also Traction Laws that are enforced if conditions are bad. Blizzak DMV2's are great if you don't want to miss a powder day.

I'm running Yokohama Geolandar A/T G015's. They are 3PMSF rated, and do better than KO2's IME. Better wet traction than Duratracs. Better than Defender LTX M/S tires (which are just M+S rated). They do better than lots of tires I've tried over the years. But they are not dedicated snow tires like the Blizzak DMV2's.

The road to Powder Mountain is great on a Sportbike in summer.

 

[chipski]

I live by the Cottonwood Canyons, and can tell you that sometimes they can be treacherous. There are also Traction Laws that are enforced if conditions are bad. Blizzak DMV2's are great if you don't want to miss a powder day.

I'm running Yokohama Geolandar A/T G015's. They are 3PMSF rated, and do better than KO2's IME. Better wet traction than Duratracs. Better than Defender LTX M/S tires (which are just M+S rated). They do better than lots of tires I've tried over the years. But they are not dedicated snow tires like the Blizzak DMV2's.

The road to Powder Mountain is great on a Sportbike in summer.

The more I think about this- the more I'm leaning towards the 3PMSF tire. Living in NC we don't get a lot of snow, but I do take the 4Runner off road occasionally and this type of tire would be more useful in my opinion.

So would this setup get me to the resorts in BCC/LCC during a storm? Do you feel that with these I would still need chains (prolly safer) with a big dump? Do you have the LT one? What size are you running?

I'm sure the PM road is a blast with that bike!

 

[Pedro367]

The more I think about this- the more I'm leaning towards the 3PMSF tire. Living in NC we don't get a lot of snow, but I do take the 4Runner off road occasionally and this type of tire would be more useful in my opinion.

This was my thought. Living in NC you rarely get snow and when you do you stay home because they don't treat the roads and everything becomes ice and everyone wrecks. Nothing beats a dedicated snow tire in the snow, but A 3PMS AT would be ideal for you. They'll be relatively quiet and comfortable on the road and offer plenty of traction in the snow. They are a 365 day a year tire, so no need for two sets once your others wear out...or you sell them. You'll have confidence to take them on the beach or go wheeling in NC with them too, something a dedicated snow tire won't handle well. There are tons of threads out there on them in which you can make your own opinions on. I am a huge fan KO2s. They are fantastic in the snow.

BFG KO2s
Falken Wildpeak AT3W
Toyo OC AT3
Nitto Ridge Grappler

These are the top choices at the moment. Toyota people love the Falkens and historically they are cheaper, although everything is about the same at the current time.

 

[02SE]

The more I think about this- the more I'm leaning towards the 3PMSF tire. Living in NC we don't get a lot of snow, but I do take the 4Runner off road occasionally and this type of tire would be more useful in my opinion.

So would this setup get me to the resorts in BCC/LCC during a storm? Do you feel that with these I would still need chains (prolly safer) with a big dump? Do you have the LT one? What size are you running?

I'm sure the PM road is a blast with that bike!

I had a long reply typed out, hit submit and my internet was out. Reply lost.

So, short and to the point: Yes, I've used them extensively in snow. They are not a dedicated snow tire like the Blizzak, but they do pretty well. They do great in rain. I like them better as an all-around tire than BFG KO2's, Defender LTX M/S, Falken Wildpeak AT3W's, Duratracs, and the list goes on.

I am running LT265/70R17 E. I wanted the extra durability of the 10 ply-rated tires, for 4wd trails.

I have no complaints so far.

As for the old hopped-up 'Busa, I love that thing. It's my favorite bike of all time. We also have a new stock '22 'Busa, and three other sportbikes as well. The old hot rod is the most fun.

 

[nonuniform]

I've had the chance to compare winter tires back to back living in the Sierras. The Audi with Blizzaks was great, until the snow got deep. The Defender with Duratracs was equal to the Audi w/Blizzaks on everything but ice. I have no idea what people mean about Duratracs in wet conditions, never had a problem, but as usual, YMMV.

 

[chipski]

I had a long reply typed out, hit submit and my internet was out. Reply lost.

So, short and to the point: Yes, I've used them extensively in snow. They are not a dedicated snow tire like the Blizzak, but they do pretty well. They do great in rain. I like them better as an all-around tire than BFG KO2's, Defender LTX M/S, Falken Wildpeak AT3W's, Duratracs, and the list goes on.

I am running LT265/70R17 E. I wanted the extra durability of the 10 ply-rated tires, for 4wd trails.

I have no complaints so far.

Well these sound like a good way to go, plus I can get a good deal on them. About 145 for P rating and about 185 for the LT.

I would think the LT would be somewhat harsher on the road- is that safe to say? Since I really don’t do much rocky 4wd excursions with my 4Runner, I’ll prolly go with the P rated tire.