5th Gen Brake Failure - 17 TRDP

[enapa]

I still dont know what you expect them to do. No one can recreate the issue. No manufacturer is going to just sign off on anything. Regardless of what they believe. Their lawyers and insurance companies wouldnt allow it.

Not sure why you dont understand that. Also if this was a widespread issue, and not operator error, then where are the news stories about 4runners slamming into other cars all over the place? Hell the "stuck accelerator" issue was on every night.

 

[Hadelson]

Not sure why you dont understand that.

Thanks for the comments. My real Job is Risk Management. So here are my answers

1. The vehicle had zero brakes. A complete failure. 15 minutes prior to the failure, I was on the interstate at 65MPH. Regardless, it doesn't matter the location but what is fact is they failed completely. Rest assured with my background.........no operator error.

2. There is enough information out there on the net that with a few minutes of digging shows a pattern developing with 5th Gen's and Lexus equivalents with same type of brake systems having complete system failures - no codes - and then system resets. Toyota is not accepting any responsibility taking the line, no codes=system resets=no failure.

3. I shared this information researched from the net yesterday with the dealer, Toyota California and the NHSTA. Last comment, Toyota's action/patterns are the same here as with the other well documented brake issues from 2005 to 2011. They never admitted fault, but did settle rapidly after the court case was proceeding badly for them.......they settled with affected parties and issued recalls on all affected vehicles. This action mitigated the damage dollar cost (and this was millions in the settlement) to least dollar cost without admitting ownership to the issue. Over the next several years, numerous brake issue recalls have occurred across several model lines.......but it all started with citizens who had these issues and started documenting.

4. Last point.........you are driving your 2015 T4R and your brakes fail like this..........I'm sure your perspective would change drastically.

Regards.........

 

[Hadelson]

1420 is engine emissions related.

I am not read in a specific codes....Could you point me in direction where to find and brake specific codes?

Thanks

 

[mo_mo]

Not sure why you dont understand that.

Thanks for the comments. My real Job is Risk Management. So here are my answers

1. The vehicle had zero brakes. A complete failure. 15 minutes prior to the failure, I was on the interstate at 65MPH. Regardless, it doesn't matter the location but what is fact is they failed completely. Rest assured with my background.........no operator error.

2. There is enough information out there on the net that with a few minutes of digging shows a pattern developing with 5th Gen's and Lexus equivalents with same type of brake systems having complete system failures - no codes - and then system resets. Toyota is not accepting any responsibility taking the line, no codes=system resets=no failure.

3. I shared this information researched from the net yesterday with the dealer, Toyota California and the NHSTA. Last comment, Toyota's action/patterns are the same here as with the other well documented brake issues from 2005 to 2011. They never admitted fault, but did settle rapidly after the court case was proceeding badly for them.......they settled with affected parties and issued recalls on all affected vehicles. This action mitigated the damage dollar cost (and this was millions in the settlement) to least dollar cost without admitting ownership to the issue. Over the next several years, numerous brake issue recalls have occurred across several model lines.......but it all started with citizens who had these issues and started documenting.

4. Last point.........you are driving your 2015 T4R and your brakes fail like this..........I'm sure your perspective would change drastically.

Regards.........

1) Scary!
2) how does the pattern that you have uncovered with Toyota/Lexus compare to other brands? Additionally is there an increased crash rate for these vehicles which can be attributed to vehicle failure/design flaw/ manufacturing error vs. operator error?
3) I’m not familiar with the brake failures you mention from 2005/2011, but I recall the ‘unintended acceleration’, which actively went after elderly drivers (statistically).
4) Yes they would.

 

[philsey]

I still dont know what you expect them to do. No one can recreate the issue. No manufacturer is going to just sign off on anything. Regardless of what they believe. Their lawyers and insurance companies wouldnt allow it.

Not sure why you dont understand that. Also if this was a widespread issue, and not operator error, then where are the news stories about 4runners slamming into other cars all over the place? Hell the "stuck accelerator" issue was on every night.

Interesting attitude.

I'll bet you'd be singing a different tune were you in the OP's shoes.

 

[philsey]

Todays update. Now, California and dealer aligned and want me to pick-up and drive the car. ....

I'd be careful with this. I admit to being the suspicious type - but I'd not take that loaner anywhere near the dealer. If they decide to play hardball, they could easily take it back, given the opportunity.

Inconvenient? Sure. But much more so, if they grab it.

Around here, the local ABC affiliate has a "consumer help" program. They'd be on this like white-on-rice. This issue needs public awareness to gain traction.

 

[matoolie]

I am not read in a specific codes....Could you point me in direction where to find and brake specific codes?

Thanks

That I do not know. Suggest doing some google searches perhaps.

 

[DeltaTango]

So reading this makes me quite uneasy. My gen 5 has 700 miles on it, and I already took it to the dealer to have them check out the master brake cylinder because it makes an audible squeak when the pedal is depressed. It still works fine but it shouldn't do that.

I was told by the guys that they checked the other 2018's in the inventory and they all exhibit this phenomenon. So the fact I noticed this on day one makes me leary.

 

[flea1983]

So reading this makes me quite uneasy. My gen 5 has 700 miles on it, and I already took it to the dealer to have them check out the master brake cylinder because it makes an audible squeak when the pedal is depressed. It still works fine but it shouldn't do that.

I was told by the guys that they checked the other 2018's in the inventory and they all exhibit this phenomenon. So the fact I noticed this on day one makes me leary.

The squeak is normal, at least for the 5th gens. Just try to ignore it or it will drive you crazy.

 

[Hadelson]

So reading this makes me quite uneasy. My gen 5 has 700 miles on it, and I already took it to the dealer to have them check out the master brake cylinder because it makes an audible squeak when the pedal is depressed. It still works fine but it shouldn't do that.

I was told by the guys that they checked the other 2018's in the inventory and they all exhibit this phenomenon. So the fact I noticed this on day one makes me leary.

My 14TE brake pedal was noisy and the brake unit would hum at times. That said, the brakes worked fine. My 17 TRDP brake unit is quiet and no humming from the unit until this failure occurred.

 

[philsey]

So reading this makes me quite uneasy. My gen 5 has 700 miles on it, and I already took it to the dealer to have them check out the master brake cylinder because it makes an audible squeak when the pedal is depressed. It still works fine but it shouldn't do that.

I was told by the guys that they checked the other 2018's in the inventory and they all exhibit this phenomenon. So the fact I noticed this on day one makes me leary.

You verify this yourself? Me? I don't believe it. I agree, this thread makes me uneasy too. Much more so that Toyota is stonewalling the OP.

*** GUYS. I just realized we are taking this off-topic, and maybe shouldn't.

 

[e60ral]

You verify this yourself? Me? I don't believe it.

I agree, this thread makes me uneasy too. Much more so that Toyota is stonewalling the OP.

the audible squeak is well documented on this forum, it's normal

 

[CookieRoe]

Wow, [MENTION=92288]Hadelson[/MENTION] , hope you get a fix for this. It would drive me insane.

Which dealership (Bennett or Krause Toyota)? I got my 4th gen at Conicelli (1 hour drive south of Allentown) and they seem to be better then Bennett (the one I use to get my 4R inspected every year), but I don't go there b/c it's a pain for me to drive there. Luckily I haven't had any mechanical issues as of late.

Good luck!

 

[Hadelson]

Wow, [MENTION=92288]Hadelson[/MENTION] , hope you get a fix for this. It would drive me insane.

Which dealership (Bennett or Krause Toyota)? I got my 4th gen at Conicelli (1 hour drive south of Allentown) and they seem to be better then Bennett (the one I use to get my 4R inspected every year), but I don't go there b/c it's a pain for me to drive there. Luckily I haven't had any mechanical issues as of late.

Good luck!

Freedom in Hamburg for the TRDP. Bennett for the 14TE.

 

[e60ral]

I would tell them to replace the part [MENTION=120933]Captramrod01[/MENTION] mentioned, and would pay out of pocket if necessary

tell the dealer that you will pay for them to replace the part, but if it solves the problem you want to be reimbursed for the part

 

[Judd94]

Around here, the local ABC affiliate has a "consumer help" program. They'd be on this like white-on-rice. This issue needs public awareness to gain traction.

My thoughts exactly, take it to the news, and take all your proof of it becoming a widespread issue and let the news do what they do best, f*** stuff up. Just think of how many people have wrecked, don’t read forums about their cars and were to see a story on the news? Then they let the dealer roll right over em. Or the cop downplays it after they’re recked and it got shrugged off as operator error. Point being, not everybody reports critical failures to where it needs to go.

As far as these “codes”, they probably aren’t actual codes like a failure code, they probably pulled all the info stored in the black box that monitors every single thing you do and the only way to get access to it outside of Toyota is with a court order. It’s written within the first few pages of the owners manual.

Also, Toyota is divided into 5 regions within the US. I don’t know what the west coast region is called but I would try to find someone above that. It sounds like that region is stopping you.

If I were to put money on it, I’ll bet it comes back to the micromanagement brake system that the Atrac and Crawl Control vehicles have.

 

[Hadelson]

I would tell them to replace the part [MENTION=120933]Captramrod01[/MENTION] mentioned, and would pay out of pocket if necessary

tell the dealer that you will pay for them to replace the part, but if it solves the problem you want to be reimbursed for the part

Here is the problem. Complete Brake failure, Flatbedded to dealer and dropped off with Brakes not working. Dealer started checks and brakes now working.

This is a 2017 and still under warranty. The 4 part modular unit in question costs $3000-$4000 dollars

 

[Hadelson]

Dealer swapped Camry for a Highlander loaner. While there, they had my full paperwork out on the desk. Person stepped away to pull the Highlander into the bay and I reviewed the paperwork.

Paperwork said no codes found in system, brakes working correctly. Note this directly contradicts what the service person told me 1st day vehicle in shop and again several days later. Said they ran full checks to include visual checks of all components. Now the interesting part....say they induced code 1452 failure to check system.

**Edited** Just tapped into the Australian Prado site. This code is for low accumulator pressure. Someone with a 2016 Prado had this issue and turned out air in lines required bleeding/flush and problem went away.s

 

[e60ral]

Here is the problem. Complete Brake failure, Flatbedded to dealer and dropped off with Brakes not working. Dealer started checks and brakes now working.

This is a 2017 and still under warranty. The 4 part modular unit in question costs $3000-$4000 dollars

I'd pay that to make sure the brakes work, if it solves the problem you aren't put any money

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[NuclearN8]

Not sure what I would do if in the OP's shoes...
What I do know is that if my wife or I experienced that same scenario, we would never sit in the driver's seat of that vehicle again.
The probability of recurrence and associated risk is just too high with that particular vehicle.

The good news is, since it is the "unicorn of 4Runner models" (sarcasm) in the TRDP model, I would trade it in or have them buy it back.

[If there truly is no issue they should have no issue (and they are willing to go on the record by documenting it) reselling it and accepting the liability with the service performed by their shop shouldn't be an issue.]

and if that doesn't work, have them drive it to the neighboring ford dealer and meet it there to trade it in on a Raptor.

Do you value your life more than you value a vehicle?