5th gen may be last 4runner?

[Knight-Errant]

It is built on a global platform, it currently has over 100k in annual sales, it has a loyal following, toyota makes bank on each one they sell....it isn't going anywhere (meaning they're not getting rid of it for the U.S. market).

Also: It is a special niche that nobody else has. If anything they'll update it and make it more attractive now that the Bronco is coming; the fact that the bronco is coming is proof that the mid-size BOF segment still has legs to run....the competition will be a plus for any 4runner fans, since toyota will have to step up their 4runner game.

 

[Throwback]

I'm sure you all saw the new 5th Generation RAV4 thread and they're now offering an Adventure trim RAV that is 4x4 with Multi-Terrain select, downhill ascent control, etc. and is definitely more off-road oriented. It even looks like a 4Runner/Tacoma front end.

I would expect the next generation of 4Runner to be even more off-road marketed if Toyota is trending that direction with the super vanilla mom mobile known as the RAV4.

 

[ryslegit]

I'm sure you all saw the new 5th Generation RAV4 thread and they're now offering an Adventure trim RAV that is 4x4 with Multi-Terrain select, downhill ascent control, etc. and is definitely more off-road oriented. It even looks like a 4Runner/Tacoma front end.

I would expect the next generation of 4Runner to be even more off-road marketed if Toyota is trending that direction with the super vanilla mom mobile known as the RAV4.

This only tells me the 4Runner is more viable to be dropped. Why continue to create a separate vehicle for the adventure type when they can just add a "trim" to another vehicle in their line up.

 

[Dalko43]

You are 100%right, thats why I think Toyota will be dropping 4runner in the North America market and make a Jeep Wrangler compeiter. That's were the growth in the market is young "off road ready" vehicle . 80% of the new buyers don't want to work on there vehicle, so they buy one they can fit 33's without a lift .


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I honestly think Toyota's 4runner is the main Wrangler competitor. I mean, what else is there in the North American market that even comes close in terms of size, cost and 4x4 functionality?

And why would Toyota stop making a SUV that sells so well, despite the minimal R&D it has seen over the last 10 years?

Toyota sells the 4runner and, to a lesser degree, the Sequoia and LandCruiser 200 series. These are among the few BOF SUV's left that still have some offroad DNA; people, especially Toyota loyalists, know this and will always be there to buy those models. Toyota doesn't market its vehicles with same MOAB culture that FCA markets the Jeep, but the Toyota 4x4's are still viewed in a similar light and are mostly bought by the same type of consumers.

Fuel is cheap, for now, so Toyota will continue to sell their 4x4 models to willing crowds. When prices rise again, Toyota will have to innovate their engines to keep current with consumer expectations, but I suspect even then people will still be lining up to outside dealerships to buy whatever Toyota is putting out on the showroom floor.

 

[Throwback]

I am seeing Toyota as pushing the whole off road segment much more. The 2019 TRD Pro stuff is totally after that desert off roading culture. The Tacoma TRDP comes with a snorkel and The 4Runner, Tacoma, and Tundra all get new FOX suspension.

Scroll down and watch the 4Runner video clip closely. It looks like it's getting the sliders and roof rack like the Trail Team FJC had.

https://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/trdpro/5


And of course notice the RAV4 isn't part of the TRD Pro thing. I don't think the idea of the RAV4 replacing the 4Runner is remotely viable.

 

[weiasian]

Bs

Bull shit, Bull shit...
The 4runner sales numbers are climbing every year...

 

[progress4m]

Trying to make it as short as I can with focus on the “marketing and profit”
From layman point of view:
Judging by Toyota impassive global successes as a business they obviously understand “marketing” …. I also believe that Toyota have great “long term “vision and that sets them apart from many other corporations… so from business stand point, I am sure they will do the right thing when it comes to 4Runner -some of us here may not like the result, but out wishes are irrelevant until sales numbers (profit) will suffer.

Here is my hope\thoughts: as other have mentioned, Toyota makes profit on every 4Runner they sell and sales numbers are strong, so they will continue to make 4Runner now and at least in the near future- as far as 4runner power train, shape, size and overall characteristics-they did OK in the past and have corrected themselves when things went wrong -5th gen is the proof of that.

IMHO: 4runner sales numbers are strong as they have no competition… all other midsize SUV (in the same price range and with true body on the frame) are all gone… only one remains: 4Runner… Toyota knows that... and they will not spend (waste) any $ on commercials, unnecessary updates etc., unless they see potential benefits in profit or to prevent market share losses…

For those who would argue that Wrangler and 4Runner are in competition (again IMHO): this is not correct… there is no competition… instead of using “apple to orange” I would say it is like comparing Samurai sword to a log splitter- technically they both have “sharp” edges, but that where similarity ends… and that not taking in consideration 4Runner large advantage in quality…

My $0.02

 

[Throwback]

Eh, I don't know about that. I cross shopped a Jeep and 4Runner. I actually started with the Jeep because my other toy was a '66 CJ5.

On paper a 4 door Jeep with a hard top looks like it would offer a similar driving experience and off road capability as a 4Runner and would offer the same interior room for the family. However driving a new Jeep is an atrocious experience. My '66 CJ5 rattletrap was more comfortable than the new Wrangler Unlimited I drove. And don't try to drive one with a manual transmission because you can't hear the engine and the clutch pedal offers no tactile feedback.

Go do that and then hop in a 4Runner Trail that drives like a Cadillac on the test drive down the interstate and then play with 4L, CRAWL, MTS, and e-locker in the grass next to the Toyota dealer and you realize it's nearly as capable off road as the Jeep and a million times more comfortable. Sale complete.

Now, if the 4Runner was some watered down version like a Limited that wasn't off road oriented I would've just dealt with the uncomfortable Jeep since I was not looking for a comfortable SUV.

 

[mcarey86]

Wrangler sales have declined over the last three years as well.

4Runner is going nowhere though, and I'm far from a 4Runner fan boy.

 

[mscot]

That's a pretty weak sponsorship. There's a skateboarder that was/is? sponsored by Audi and they gave him an A7.

If Mr. T gives it to them, they have to pay taxes and such. Might be better for both of them to loan it for $$ reasons.

This. Also, sponsors typically reclaim the car when the sponsorship ends or if they want the athlete in a new model.
Seems a lot of people on this board don't understand how sponsorship deals work.

 

[terrorofthesky]

I see a market growing for the utility of the Land Cruiser 70 series in the american market. It's a vehicle that's not only know for it's rugged durability, but for it's vast availability of aftermarket modifications very similar to the wrangler. I could see the LC 70 Wagon being a replacement or even an addition to the line as a more compact version of a 4Runner.

 

[ryslegit]

Eh, I don't know about that. I cross shopped a Jeep and 4Runner. I actually started with the Jeep because my other toy was a '66 CJ5.

On paper a 4 door Jeep with a hard top looks like it would offer a similar driving experience and off road capability as a 4Runner and would offer the same interior room for the family. However driving a new Jeep is an atrocious experience. My '66 CJ5 rattletrap was more comfortable than the new Wrangler Unlimited I drove. And don't try to drive one with a manual transmission because you can't hear the engine and the clutch pedal offers no tactile feedback.

Go do that and then hop in a 4Runner Trail that drives like a Cadillac on the test drive down the interstate and then play with 4L, CRAWL, MTS, and e-locker in the grass next to the Toyota dealer and you realize it's nearly as capable off road as the Jeep and a million times more comfortable. Sale complete.

Now, if the 4Runner was some watered down version like a Limited that wasn't off road oriented I would've just dealt with the uncomfortable Jeep since I was not looking for a comfortable SUV.

You must not have test driven a JL. Completely different experience.

 

[JSparky]

You must not have test driven a JL. Completely different experience.

I owned a JK for 7 years and checked out the JL recently. They basically added soft-touch to the entire interior (it’s like a padded room). It won’t clean up as easily but it is more comfortable to sit in.

Otherwise, to me, it’s pretty much the same. If they had a wagon variant that did away with the inner sport cage and supported a real roof rack I may be interested, otherwise I wouldn’t touch anything Jeep unless it was built before the 80’s.. too many other issues that go along with Jeep ownership to keep me away.

 

[Throwback]

No I drove a JKU. The interior felt extremely cramped because of the roll cage and associated padding. The driver position felt like being crammed up against the windshield and firewall, way more than my early CJ5.

 

[ryslegit]

I owned a JK for 7 years and checked out the JL recently. They basically added soft-touch to the entire interior (it’s like a padded room). It won’t clean up as easily but it is more comfortable to sit in.

Otherwise, to me, it’s pretty much the same. If they had a wagon variant that did away with the inner sport cage and supported a real roof rack I may be interested, otherwise I wouldn’t touch anything Jeep unless it was built before the 80’s.. too many other issues that go along with Jeep ownership to keep me away.

I drove a JK and hated it, my buddy also has one and it's horrible to be in which is why I picked up a 4Runner. However, I feel the JL does now compete with the 4Runner in that part of the spectrum. In the end it is all subjective really.

Couldn't agree more on the Jeep issues, I'm already hearing really bad things about the first year JLs.

 

[Digital Man]

I’m planning to replace my 2005 Sequoia in 3-4 years. I’ll look at everything available at the time but right now the 4Runner is my top choice. I love the looks and almost everything about the 5th gen. Here are the things I’m hoping change before I have to make a decision otherwise there will be trade offs for me:

- Improved powertrain with more power and better gas mileage. I live in Colorado so want to have no issues fully loaded at elevation doing mountain passes.
- Addition of Safety Sense or other adaptive cruise control system
- Larger navigation screen with CarPlay and Android Auto
- Wheel wells that would accommodate all 33’s without the need to modify fenders, mud flaps, etc.
- Maybe better departure angles
- A little more head room with the sun roof


The main thing I don’t want to change is the rugged exterior look, I love it the way it is. I want comfort and luxury on the inside but a rugged exterior.


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[BigredTEX]

I apologize in advance for resurrecting this topic since it brings out a lot of emotional responses, but I am in a position to emphatically say that there will be a 6th Gen 4Runner. I was recently invited to participate in a couple of styling exercises with Toyota. I am under NDA so I will tiptoe around some details.

Timing: Direct quote, "we are three years out", so I anticipate a release in late 2020 as a 2021 model. This lines up with some of the speculation I've read on this forum based on known release dates of other models.

Mechanicals: All indications are that it will be based on the same 150 platform as the 5th Gen. Another direct quote, "it will be the exact same size as the current generation", which reinforces the speculation that it will be based on the 150 platform. Plus all the exterior styling artist renderings showed running gear that looked exactly like the 5th Gen. No discussion of engine.

Exterior Styling: Those who like the rugged appearance of the 5th Gen will not be disappointed. There were four different versions shown that ranged from mild to wild on my scale and all of them were what I would call "bold". Common themes of all of them were large front grill, very modern looking lighting (front and rear), much more aggressive flares (some versions more than others), very good front and rear approach and departure angles, barn door type rear hatch and rear hatch mounted spare tire. My feedback and that of others that I was privy to was 1) do not lose the retractable rear window, 2) keep the lift gate if you can, but keep the retractable rear window at all cost, and 3) if you must move the spare tire to the rear, use the space opened up underneath for additional fuel capacity. All of the styling studies reminded me of an updated 4 door FJ Cruiser.

Interior Styling: Much more car like, but also much more refined than the current interior. It appeared that many of the hard switches and buttons will become soft switches on the large center display screen. My feedback, and again that of those I was privy to, was there was a disconnect between the rugged exterior styling and the (too) refined interior styling. Recommended using large buttons and dials rather than soft buttons on a glass screen (have you ever tried to press a button on a screen when bouncing down a trail or dirt road?).

Again, I am under NDA, which I don't feel I have violated with what I have shared, but this is the extent of the information I am comfortable sharing at this time. What we see in three years may or may not be what I saw, but I'm confident it will be very close. I am also very confident there will be a 6th Gen 4Runner and it will be body on frame.

 

[PeoplecallmeIan]

Nice. This is something I can get excited about. I should be done paying off mine by then. I do like the look of the Ford Bronco that has been floating around the internet also but those transmission problems Ford has been having is ridiculous. Also hearing that the raptor motors have been blowing up left and right.

 

[brtnstrns]

... but keep the retractable rear window at all cost ...

Anything else would be sacrilege!

 

[WallyT4R]

Thank goodness I have a 5th gen.