Are these front lower control arm bushings bad?

nissanh said:
I don't know why there are plastic bushings. A bushing supposed to absorb an impact and mitigate its effect going into the frame and body. If plastic bushings are good as a bush, many automakers will go into plastic as those are nearly free these days compared to good rubber.

Get OEM bushings.
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Just like rubber, there's different densities and stiffnesses to poly bushings. It's not like were installing a completely rigid piece of plastic into the control arms. There is give to these poly bushings. I think this is a common misconception when considering using poly over rubber.
 
I figure if the truck can hold an alignment / drive straight and tracks true, then it would be ok leave it alone.

If I was in the middle of doing a lift or suspension work, I would probably address it all at the same time if needed.

I agree with the can of worms thing… sometimes if you go looking for trouble you might just find it.
 
Lamer said:
from what I have seen, if you have enough heat on the front control arm around the bushing, you can "melt" the rubberized connection to the outer sleeve and push the rubber out. followed by some clean up of course. But it doesn't sound too hard.
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That is how I did mine. Weed burner in my outdoor firepit. PITA, but not too hard.
 
mtbtim said:
I'd say you can tell by looking. If you have cracks like that, there's most likely gross play in the bushing. I've replaced lower control arm bushings many times, and when the bushing is cracked like that, there is significant play.

But, is the play causing issues? I just noticed I have cracked bushings but don't have any vibration or alignment issues. If it's not causing you issues right now, go ahead and drive it as is until you feel like tackling this repair. When you do get ready to do it, [MENTION=102606]infamousRNR[/MENTION] and I have a couple videos that might assist you. I recommend you use Whiteline Poly bushings as a replacement.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kmaZNBp1gZM" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/6FzEHygizoI" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Definitely have to agree with Tim here. The rubber is somehow adhered to the metal sleeve.

I'm inclined to believe that for the most part unless the bushing is severely degraded there isn't any concern.


I recently replaced the UCA bushings with new OEM Toyota bushings through the use of a vice and bottlejack method. I'd strongly suggest watching Tim's videos on replacing the control arm bushings.


In general I'd recommend whiteline over Toyota bushings, Toyota simply wants a lot of money for their bushings. I'd wager at this point you wouldn't be able to tell any difference if someone swap your bushings out overnight without your knowledge.
 
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96RedRunner said:
vids floating around using drill motor and bit thttp://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/o remove rubber, looks way simpler than heat or fire.
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It is. You can't easily do it with our bushing set-up though. We have a metal sleeve and collar that won't allow you to do it without sawzalling one of the collars off. I was all set to do mine with a 1/2" drill bit until I actually removed them.

I could have used my sawzall but my map gas and bottle jack where already out. I soaked them for 5 minutes in Liquid Wrench and set up the jack. The first one popped in 3 minutes because, well, because it was the first one I'd ever done. The other 3 where out in less then 3 minutes. It's easy and painless.
 
My take on the 'Poly vs. OE rubber' debate is this- On a rubber bushing, the center sleeve is vulcanized to the rubber (meaning its bonded together), so when the suspension is cycling up and down, the rubber is being twisted back and forth because the center sleeve is anchored in place when the mounting bolt pinches the control arm tight.

A poly bushing just has the sleeve spinning inside of the bore of the bushing because the sleeve isn't physically bonded to the urethane. There's no way that the poly bushing can have the life span of the comparable rubber bushing. The metal sleeve is literally wearing away at the urethane every time it cycles.
 
theesotericone said:
It is. You can't easily do it with our bushing set-up though..
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Not really, when melting rubber came up I was like whoa up redirect.
The way You me Timmy and most eveybody else does it the best way.
Little heat, PB blaster, jig I made to keep from spreading arm and jack best way.

Good seeing your truck back in beast mode in last pics, wish I had that close.
 
2ndhandyotaman said:
My take on the 'Poly vs. OE rubber' debate is this- On a rubber bushing, the center sleeve is vulcanized to the rubber (meaning its bonded together), so when the suspension is cycling up and down, the rubber is being twisted back and forth because the center sleeve is anchored in place when the mounting bolt pinches the control arm tight.

A poly bushing just has the sleeve spinning inside of the bore of the bushing because the sleeve isn't physically bonded to the urethane. There's no way that the poly bushing can have the life span of the comparable rubber bushing. The metal sleeve is literally wearing away at the urethane every time it cycles.
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Hmmm, You sound very certain of yourself for something that nobody has the answer for yet. Your premise is the smooth center sleeve is slowly going to wear away the inner bore of the poly bushing. For the rubber bushings, they fail BECAUSE the inner sleeve is vulcanized to the rubber and as the rubber twists over and over and over again, the rubber finally tears when the rubber loses it's pliability from age. So, while the inner bore of the poly bushing could eventually wear down, it will most likely never tear like the OEM rubber bushings. Guys have been running poly for a long time but not quite long enough for us to know what kind of longevity they really have.
 
I understand what you're saying. My statement comes from using poly bushings in control arms/ suspension mounting points of Auto-x cars that I've owned/raced in the past along with cars for street use. The poly is firmer and it helps in certain instances but they wear quicker, much quicker than a OE rubber bushing.

With our 4x4 trucks, the suspensions have more articulation compared to the cars that I've "upgraded" in the past so I could see a poly bushing wearing out much quicker than a OE bushing, especially in a place like a control arm. This is why some grease is applied to the center sleeve before pressing it into a poly bushing. It's the only thing keeping the bushing from turning into dust within a matter of hours.

I'm not trying to sway anyone's opinion one way or the other, I'm just offering up some points of view that no one else has brought up.
 
2ndhandyotaman said:
I understand what you're saying. My statement comes from using poly bushings in control arms/ suspension mounting points of Auto-x cars that I've owned/raced in the past along with cars for street use. The poly is firmer and it helps in certain instances but they wear quicker, much quicker than a OE rubber bushing.

With our 4x4 trucks, the suspensions have more articulation compared to the cars that I've "upgraded" in the past so I could see a poly bushing wearing out much quicker than a OE bushing, especially in a place like a control arm. This is why some grease is applied to the center sleeve before pressing it into a poly bushing. It's the only thing keeping the bushing from turning into dust within a matter of hours.

I'm not trying to sway anyone's opinion one way or the other, I'm just offering up some points of view that no one else has brought up.
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This is good info to share. Now you've got me wondering how long all these poly bushings I've installed my control arms are going to last. I guess time will tell.
 
I just thought I'd chip in here on my 13-month review of the Whitelines after 22k miles. I replaced every single suspension-related bushing on my rig except the front UCA bushings. Everything still feels solid and tight. Most people don't believe its got nearly 300k and feels as solid as it does...which it definitely didnt prior to the installation. However, about 6 months ago we moved and now we live on a dirt road that is about 1.2 miles from pavement. About two months after we moved, my front LCA bushings started creaking/squeaking, and BAD. It sounds worse than it did prior to me changing all this out. I initally thought it was the front UCA's, as those are still the original, but when I disconnected the coilover to move things around its definitely the LCA. And when moving it up and down it feels very gritty. My thought is that the constant exposure to dust/fines has resulted in the impregnation of that material to the bushing, and this is the result. I am now wondering if this will quickly degrade the life of the bushings. Time will tell. Interestingly, all the bushings in the rear of the vehicle remain whisper quiet.

So my review is, if you are on dirt/mud a lot, you may consider doing OEM for front LCA. I will in the next go around.
 
NegroTundra said:
And when moving it up and down it feels very gritty. My thought is that the constant exposure to dust/fines has resulted in the impregnation of that material to the bushing, and this is the result.
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that's interesting to read. do you ever grease them? i live on a dirt road too, and that caught my eye.
 
photoleif said:
that's interesting to read. do you ever grease them? i live on a dirt road too, and that caught my eye.
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No, I'm not really aware of a way to do that other than spraying lithium grease wherever you can. Perhaps I'll try that but doubt it'll help given its a sealed system
 
Have fun replacing those bushings. My trusted mechanic couldn't get them out so I took on the job myself knowing that I couldn't afford to pay him hours on hours of labor trying to troubleshoot the problem.

I probably spent close to 25-30hrs or more working on getting the bushings out. It took a sawzaw, torch, air chisel, and a BFH, to get those things out. I never wish that much effort on anyone.
 
jeredcollins said:
Have fun replacing those bushings. My trusted mechanic couldn't get them out so I took on the job myself knowing that I couldn't afford to pay him hours on hours of labor trying to troubleshoot the problem.

I probably spent close to 25-30hrs or more working on getting the bushings out. It took a sawzaw, torch, air chisel, and a BFH, to get those things out. I never wish that much effort on anyone.
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It seems that this varies from truck to truck. I used Timmy's (and others') method of a bottle jack and some MAPP gas, and those suckers came flying out in no time.

For me, the much bigger hassle was getting the steering rack out of the way of the lower cam bolts, which would still have to be tackled even if you buy replacement LCAs to avoid pressing out bushings.
 
4Runner4Leon said:
It seems that this varies from truck to truck. I used Timmy's (and others') method of a bottle jack and some MAPP gas, and those suckers came flying out in no time.

For me, the much bigger hassle was getting the steering rack out of the way of the lower cam bolts, which would still have to be tackled even if you buy replacement LCAs to avoid pressing out bushings.
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Yea, I used Timmy's bottlejack effort. It helped some but the metal sleeve that houses the rubber bushing was seized badly. Even a hydraulic press could not get the bushing out. That's when I went with an air chisel. I carved up the LCA pretty good in the process.
 
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