Audi S4 as my 2nd car?

[PhillyBoy]

So I've owned my 4Runner since highschool (got it in early 2003).... I've decided to get a 2nd car; something a bit more sporty with more power. I've ultimately decided on an Audi S4 (2013+). I'm just not sure if I should go brand new or get a gently used one (< 10k miles). Just wondering if anyone has heard of any horror stories with new/used Audi's, especially the S4. My buddy hasn't had any issues with his 2012 S4. Thoughts? Go.

 

[slapdappy]

gently used

 

[lelandr]

Audis are basically good cars. Check out Audizine for things to look for while shopping. I'd always lean toward 2-3 years old so that someone else buys the depreciation (especially with audi). I found that if you can do most of your basic maintenance yourself (get the VAGcom to do diagnostics), you can own these cars very reasonably.

Sorry, just from a BMW fan here: Why not an M3? Better car all around unless you need a wagon. The Audi is better looking, I guess.

 

[Dawg4Runner]

So I've owned my 4Runner since highschool (got it in early 2003).... I've decided to get a 2nd car; something a bit more sporty with more power. I've ultimately decided on an Audi S4 (2013+). I'm just not sure if I should go brand new or get a gently used one (< 10k miles). Just wondering if anyone has heard of any horror stories with new/used Audi's, especially the S4. My buddy hasn't had any issues with his 2012 S4. Thoughts? Go.

I believe [MENTION=4517]jediwebdude[/MENTION] owns a 2013 Audi S4. Give him a shout for his input.

 

[jediwebdude]

Are you planning to get one with manual transmission or dual-clutch?

Mine has the dual-clutch (aka DSG). Love it. Just be aware there have been issues with the DSG for some people. Either the electronics or full tranny have had to be replaced. I can't recommend the 2010 year model. Seems the DSG issues dropped significantly on the more recent years, so go with a newer model.

If audio system is important to you, try to find one with the B&O upgrade. Love mine. Also have the dynamic suspension (rare) and dynamic rear differential (also rare). I ordered mine with those options so I could track it.

Car drives fantastic. Starting in with 2013 model, you get better steering wheel and Google Earth integrated with navigation. Be sure to buy a radar detector.

I'm about to roll over 30K in miles and no issues thus far.

Busy weekend by VisualUniverse, on Flickr

 

[AKmoney]

Sorry, just from a BMW fan here: Why not an M3? Better car all around unless you need a wagon. The Audi is better looking, I guess.

M3/M4 are brand new models and are pricey. Realistically you won't get one for <$70K.

I'm sort of in the new boat... looking for a new daily driver. Kind of. Getting the 7-year itch with my E90 335i (which has been great). I also like the S4; it's one of the (very) few cars out there I consider better than what I already have.

 

[lelandr]

M3/M4 are brand new models and are pricey. Realistically you won't get one for <$70K.

I'm sort of in the new boat... looking for a new daily driver. Kind of. Getting the 7-year itch with my E90 335i (which has been great). I also like the S4; it's one of the (very) few cars out there I consider better than what I already have.

I wasn't suggesting new (new, I'd be angling for the M235i). I said to look for something 2-3 years old. I also kind of have a different car itch (don't buy new cars--just look for something interesting which I haven't previously owned), but my E90 330i has simply been the best car I've ever owned. I understand how it's so hard to justify selling something that has been so good, flexible & reliable.

I can understand why Audis are popular though. They do have great exterior design & use very nice materials inside & out. The S4 is one of those cars that is always pretty cool...going back into the early 90s. Plus, Audi builds pretty much everything into a wagon at some point or another.

 

[Net4n6]

gently used

That's what she said

 

[AKmoney]

I wasn't suggesting new (new, I'd be angling for the M235i). I said to look for something 2-3 years old. I also kind of have a different car itch (don't buy new cars--just look for something interesting which I haven't previously owned), but my E90 330i has simply been the best car I've ever owned. I understand how it's so hard to justify selling something that has been so good, flexible & reliable.

Ahh, someone else who understands my E90 plight.

Gotcha on the older M3. The E90/E92 M3 is great...only negative is gas mileage. The high revving V8 is pretty thirsty.

 

[ndcent]

Why is there a helmet on that car?

 

[jediwebdude]

Why is there a helmet on that car?

Because I track the car. On that particular evening, I had returned from 1/8 drag race event where I lost to a Porsche Panamera Turbo.

 

[jediwebdude]

With regard to the BMW M3 vs S4 debate, the S4 is more affordable, achieves 28 mpg on the highway (my best is 27.4), has a nicer interior, and does quite well against the M3 on the track.

:car:

 

[PhillyBoy]

Are you planning to get one with manual transmission or dual-clutch?

Mine has the dual-clutch (aka DSG). Love it. Just be aware there have been issues with the DSG for some people. Either the electronics or full tranny have had to be replaced. I can't recommend the 2010 year model. Seems the DSG issues dropped significantly on the more recent years, so go with a newer model.

If audio system is important to you, try to find one with the B&O upgrade. Love mine. Also have the dynamic suspension (rare) and dynamic rear differential (also rare). I ordered mine with those options so I could track it.

Car drives fantastic. Starting in with 2013 model, you get better steering wheel and Google Earth integrated with navigation. Be sure to buy a radar detector.

I'm about to roll over 30K in miles and no issues thus far.

Busy weekend by VisualUniverse, on Flickr

Hey,

I'm looking at a 2013 with the DSG and of course I have to have the Bang and Olufsen system. My buddy has a 2012 with the DSG, the only problem he's had was with the water pump (but it was a recall). Some of his friends have S4's too and they have the DSG "Fart", but still running fine. He suggested I get the AudiCare Extended warranty. Could be a good idea...

 

[PhillyBoy]

Audis are basically good cars. Check out Audizine for things to look for while shopping. I'd always lean toward 2-3 years old so that someone else buys the depreciation (especially with audi). I found that if you can do most of your basic maintenance yourself (get the VAGcom to do diagnostics), you can own these cars very reasonably.

Sorry, just from a BMW fan here: Why not an M3? Better car all around unless you need a wagon. The Audi is better looking, I guess.

Not really a big fan of BMW (mostly aesthetics). Thanks for mentioning that site btw.

 

[jediwebdude]

Hey,

I'm looking at a 2013 with the DSG and of course I have to have the Bang and Olufsen system. My buddy has a 2012 with the DSG, the only problem he's had was with the water pump (but it was a recall). Some of his friends have S4's too and they have the DSG "Fart", but still running fine. He suggested I get the AudiCare Extended warranty. Could be a good idea...

Ah, so you're already familiar with the car. Only other Audi I would want right now is the RS5, but the fuel mileage and insurance cost for that car are more than I'm willing to spend.

Only downside to Audi is this (as you are probably already aware): if you get the mod bug, you can affect your warranty. I've got an APR Stage II tune and Roc-Euro intake. I know that if I run into issues with the drivetrain, Audi of America is likely not going to honor the warranty. But it sure is fun outperforming Corvettes.

 

[PhillyBoy]

Ah, so you're already familiar with the car. Only other Audi I would want right now is the RS5, but the fuel mileage and insurance cost for that car are more than I'm willing to spend.

Only downside to Audi is this (as you are probably already aware): if you get the mod bug, you can affect your warranty. I've got an APR Stage II tune and Roc-Euro intake. I know that if I run into issues with the drivetrain, Audi of America is likely not going to honor the warranty. But it sure is fun outperforming Corvettes.

I've done a little bit of research. I've only ever had Japanese cars so I'm a bit weary making the move to a German car. One of my friends had a 2011 M5, he had to replace the tranny after 20k miles; albeit he tracked the car hard. My brother-in-law owns a transmission shop and is constantly telling me to stay away from Audi/German cars in general. He replaced the transmission in a BMW 760, he said the fluid alone was an exorbitant amount. The only Audi's he's worked on were early 2000's.

 

[amalik]

I don't think German are as bad as Swedish... but aren't these things (Along with VW's) expensive as heck to maintain? Relative to our Japanese world?

One of my family member's Benz is in for a $1,400 transfer case replacement. That's a used transfer case at a SMALL shop.

New TC with the Dealer was a $7,500 quote.

Another friend of mine works at Meineke. He was telling me about a full AC rebuild on a Benz as well, ~$2k it ran the customer.

 

[PhillyBoy]

I don't think German are as bad as Swedish... but aren't these things (Along with VW's) expensive as heck to maintain? Relative to our Japanese world?

One of my family member's Benz is in for a $1,400 transfer case replacement. That's a used transfer case at a SMALL shop.

New TC with the Dealer was a $7,500 quote.

Another friend of mine works at Meineke. He was telling me about a full AC rebuild on a Benz as well, ~$2k it ran the customer.

I have taken into account the cost of running/maintaining the S4, given my meager teacher salary lol. Sadly there really isn't anything else out there catching my eye. I guess I'm looking for every reason to justify this purchase. I know any car could have a problem, but I don't want to get myself into a money pit type situation.

 

[lelandr]

I don't think German are as bad as Swedish... but aren't these things (Along with VW's) expensive as heck to maintain? Relative to our Japanese world?

I've had both German & Swedish cars, and among those in the know, this is somewhat of a misnomer. Keep in mind that a lot of people expect these cars to be more expensive & many shops are just too happy to oblige. Basic maintenance items are similarly priced. Usually, they have longer intervals as well.

With German cars, the big parts are usually very durable, unless abused. Doing your own maintenence makes them very reasonable to own. Stay with the volume cars. Audi A4s & A6s carry the company, so focus on those. Use the Internet to figure out good models/generations from less reliable ones.
[MENTION=57828]PhillyBoy[/MENTION], keep in mind that Audis & BMWs generally have the same two transmission suppliers, in the cars anyway: ZF & Getrag. My wife's previous A6 had the same 6-speed slushbox as droves of 3 & 5 series. The ZF fluid can be pricey at dealers, but enthusiasts have found more economical sources.

Aside from being more fun to drive, manuals are much easier to maintain. They are inherently more robust. Servicing? Fill plug out. Drain plug & old oil out. Drain plug in. Oil in. Fill plug in. Beer.

 

[AKmoney]

In my experience you have to separate "maintenance costs" from "repair costs".

Using my E90 335i as an example, maintenance costs in and of themselves aren't all that high. Oil changes are slightly pricey (7 quarts of synthetic + $10 filter) but if you do them yourself it's not too bad. Brake jobs are again a little pricey as you generally replace the rotors at the same time as the pads (a BMW thing) but the work itself is easy and no different than doing it on any other car. Brake fluid should be flushed every 2 years. Not much else stands out...

Repair costs are a different story. Parts can be expensive and the Germans have a tendency to make things overly complex and/or over-engineered. For example: E90 BMWs use an electric water pump. Good for circulating coolant to turbos after you shut the engine off but bad when the motor and/or the electric motor dies, stranding you on the side of the road. Repair cost at an independent mechanic: $900. My car, being the first year of the N54 turbo engine had a few design warts pop up. The turbos had to be replaced to fix noisy wastegates. This was done under warranty, thankfully. Out of warranty I'm sure it would have put a small dent in my retirement.

All this being said, since I passed the 50K mile warranty expiration threshold I've spent about $2,500 on what I consider non-maintenance repairs over roughly 3 years. I'm at 90K miles now. That's not that bad, really.

Keep in mind, Japanese cars aren't perfect either. If the transfer case actuators ever die on my 4Runner I'm looking at cutting a $2K check. Cars are complex these days.

At the end of the day, I say go for it. The B8 S4 has been out for several years. 2013 should be long enough for Audi to get most of the major issues debugged. I'm thinking about replacing my 335i with one myself. I'm also looking at 987 Caymans and 997 911s... Toyota makes the best trucks but the Germans make the best cars