Ball Joints

Singtoe

Singtoe

New member
I have been PM-ing with BigJohn about the Aisin hub conversion and an interesting point has been made.

The Tacoma lower ball joint is different then the 4runners.

I went and physically looked at them (on the trucks though) and the Tacoma's ball joint is beefier looking. Even the tie rod mount on the Tacoma is bigger. The nut that holds the tie rod end on to the ball joint is bigger. The Tacoma's nut is 22mm and the 4runner is 19mm. The rubber dust shield on the Tacoma is even more stout.

I think that converting over to Tacoma ball joints and tie rod ends might be cure to all these lower ball joint failures.

Mind you that I did not physically remove them and maybe a quick trip to a parts store so more accurate measurements of the ball and seat can be made.

Anybody work in parts store?
 
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Interesting discovery. That'd be great if they bolt right up... except that I just bought 4runner LBJ's. Oh well. Good to know for the future.
 
Listening...I had been planning to change my lower BJ's this summer as preventative maintenance.
 
So the big question is why?

I hope you can take some pics Singtoe for a side to side comparison. Anyone check out the FSM to see if the torque specs are the same?

By neglecting my right LBJ two years ago, I ended up having to replace the right bearing and right LCA. Not fun. The LBJ removal, piece of cake, with the right tools and knowledge.
 
the why question is simple-catastrophic failures of the ball joint has led to front wheel separation from the vehicle as evidenced by several members of this forum and YOTA TECH.

subscribed Singtoe-you have caught my interest.

But I have to think if Toyota could have used the Tacoma parts interchangeably they would have already done so. For build convenience and profit reasons mainly.

If I were you I would simply buy all the parts (presuming all returnable at no cost if not used) and discuss the install/changeover with a front end/alignment expert. My guess would be that certain angles would change in the front end geometry-thus affecting proper alignment and so on.

It's guys like you pondering the possibilities that lead to good discoveries. Keep at it sir.
 
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Good find! And come to think of it, the Tacos don't seem to have the LBJ failures that we do in our 3rd gens.

Car manufacturers expect pickups to be "abused" more than SUVs so they build them accordingly. It's like the Tundra brakes.. Those trucks don't really weigh any more than our 3rd gens, but since people tend to work and haul stuff with their trucks, Toyota naturally put stronger brakes on the Tundra and gave our "baby movers" weak ass brakes.
 
Well looks like I won't be buying the 4runner replacement LBJs just yet. Keeping my fingers crossed for a good outcome. Thanks for looking into this Singtoe.
Josh
 
Hmmm. Interesting. I went to ToyotaPartSales.com and looked at both the Taco and 4runner LBJ's. The website doesn't list part #'s but it does show the Taco LBJ's costing $84.06 while the 4runner ones were at $77.40. It also shows each one as year specific (96-02) for the 4runner and (95-00) for the Taco. Maybe they are indeed different.
 
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raidernation said:
Hmmm. Interesting. I went to ToyotaPartSales.com and looked at both the Taco and 4runner LBJ's. The website doesn't list part #'s but it does show the Taco LBJ's costing $84.06 while the 4runner ones were at $77.40. It also shows each one as year specific (96-02) for the 4runner and (95-00) for the Taco. Maybe they are indeed different.
Click to expand...

They are definitely different, we just need to determine if they are interchangeable. Someone could swing by a parts store and physically compare them at the counter if it wasn't busy. Hard to know if they would affect alignment until after they're installed though.
 
Being a previous owner of 3 Tacos I had always thought they were the same part. Now that I'm a 3rd gen 4runner owner, I'm shocked to find out they are different. On face value and looking at the diagrams, I have a feeling they are going to be completely interchangeable with one another. But yes, someone check em out in person.
 
thanks man... you posted this thread a day late... the day before i read this thread i had my father inlaw order me some new JDM/OEM LBJs for my runner and yeah... but oh well i got mine installed and my "old" ones were in good shape still so i have spares
 
Is the actual ball joint different though? Wouldn't that be the only part that would make a real difference in long term strength? I'm not an expert at all so forgive me if I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem like ball joints fail anywhere except the actual ball joint, and if the tacoma LBJ in fact has a bigger joint, wouldn't that require additional components to become compatible with our 4runners?
 
i have to take an oil seal back i didnt need tomorrow. i can ask them to pull both ball joints and compare. . .


and take some pics and measurements. . .
 
If the nut is bigger (19 vs 22), then I assume the thread and shaft are bigger too, therefore the hole in the taco lca might be larger. Are they tapered holes? Enlarging them on the 4Runner might be tricky.
 
I went to the parts store and compared ball joints.


The Taco ball joint is much heavier then the 4runner

The tierod mounting hole is bigger on the taco. (the 4runner is 15mm on the small end and the Taco is 18mm on the small end)
The 4 bolt flange mount is the same.
The boll joint mount (ball joint shaft) is the same on both of them
The Thickness of the ball joint mount is thicker (about 1.5mm) This could be engineered or could be a variance in the forging process.
They both have the same size dust seal.

I compared like companies with like products. It happen to be MOOG packaged parts but was made by 555 company in Japan.

They both come with mounting bolts.

The bottom line is that Taco ball joints will fit the 4runner but the outer tie rods will have to be changed too.

Will post pics as soon as they are uploaded to photobucket.
 
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So if the only difference is the TRE and not the actual ball joint, then I see no reason to do a swap.
 
If OTE's are all that are needed, I may be interested in returning my 4runner LBJ's awaiting installation. Anybody taking the plunge?
 
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