Blew up my V8, Starting Over

[scribb]

Yes, the 4th Gen 4runners have a transmission cooler, so hopefully heat won't be an issue.

The cams coming from Kelford will be ordered with a set of matching springs. We had a short conversation about that between the builder and Kelford. No extra machining necessary, they'll fit into the stock seats.

I've been in discussions with a tuner in New Zealand who has done a bunch of parallel ECU wirings, and is providing some info to my tuner in California. (He has a YouTube channel here: YouTube. Endlessly informative and entertaining.) The stock ECU will stay in place and run the transmission and emissions sensors, while the second ECU will be wired up behind the dash.

We're currently focused on a Link Xtreme ECU. Not cheap at about $1350, but according to the NZ tuner, it's the way to go to avoid lots of headaches and troubleshooting problems down the road. I'm hoping to be able to wire it up to a 2-din PC, or perhaps an android/bluetooth app so I can have in-dash monitoring and possibly map selection.

Definitely wondering about the injectors, but the verdict is out for the moment. Will take that as it comes. Saw an interesting thread recently about Rx8 injectors being swappable with much higher flow, but haven't seriously looked into that yet.

Hoping to see the cams/springs ship in the next two weeks. From there it will be 1-2 weeks to finish the build. Then I need to haul it back from Modesto, assemble everything and put it back in the truck. Then put the truck on a flatbed to Sac for the wiring and tuning. I'm hoping 4 weeks, but expecting more like 8, just being realistic. If I can have it back by the time the snow starts melting up in the Sierra Buttes, I'll be pretty happy.

Got a mountain of small issues to finish up. One dilemma I'm trying to figure out is the exhaust. I'm going with the Thorly short headers and URD MK3 exhaust. The headers don't come with cats, and I don't want to sacrifice my existing cats, as I'm half expecting I may need to throw the stock exhaust back on to pass smog--plus I don't think putting 14 year old cats on a new exhaust system is a great idea.

So I'm trying to figure out what cats to put on the headers, and whether I should put the new system on the motor when I reinstall it and hope for the best, or put the stock on to tune and smog and then put the headers on. I'd hate to put the headers on, not pass, then have to put the stock back on, pass smog, and do it all over again. But given everything I'm doing now, I guess it's not that big of a deal. Plus, it looks like if I keep all the heat shielding off the stock exhaust, it'll be a lot easier to get it on and off.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Yes, the 4th Gen 4runners have a transmission cooler, so hopefully heat won't be an issue.

The cams coming from Kelford will be ordered with a set of matching springs. We had a short conversation about that between the builder and Kelford. No extra machining necessary, they'll fit into the stock seats.

I've been in discussions with a tuner in New Zealand who has done a bunch of parallel ECU wirings, and is providing some info to my tuner in California. (He has a YouTube channel here: YouTube. Endlessly informative and entertaining.) The stock ECU will stay in place and run the transmission and emissions sensors, while the second ECU will be wired up behind the dash.

We're currently focused on a Link Xtreme ECU. Not cheap at about $1350, but according to the NZ tuner, it's the way to go to avoid lots of headaches and troubleshooting problems down the road. I'm hoping to be able to wire it up to a 2-din PC, or perhaps an android/bluetooth app so I can have in-dash monitoring and possibly map selection.

Definitely wondering about the injectors, but the verdict is out for the moment. Will take that as it comes. Saw an interesting thread recently about Rx8 injectors being swappable with much higher flow, but haven't seriously looked into that yet.

Hoping to see the cams/springs ship in the next two weeks. From there it will be 1-2 weeks to finish the build. Then I need to haul it back from Modesto, assemble everything and put it back in the truck. Then put the truck on a flatbed to Sac for the wiring and tuning. I'm hoping 4 weeks, but expecting more like 8, just being realistic. If I can have it back by the time the snow starts melting up in the Sierra Buttes, I'll be pretty happy.

Got a mountain of small issues to finish up. One dilemma I'm trying to figure out is the exhaust. I'm going with the Thorly short headers and URD MK3 exhaust. The headers don't come with cats, and I don't want to sacrifice my existing cats, as I'm half expecting I may need to throw the stock exhaust back on to pass smog--plus I don't think putting 14 year old cats on a new exhaust system is a great idea.

So I'm trying to figure out what cats to put on the headers, and whether I should put the new system on the motor when I reinstall it and hope for the best, or put the stock on to tune and smog and then put the headers on. I'd hate to put the headers on, not pass, then have to put the stock back on, pass smog, and do it all over again. But given everything I'm doing now, I guess it's not that big of a deal. Plus, it looks like if I keep all the heat shielding off the stock exhaust, it'll be a lot easier to get it on and off.

Doug Thorley is about to come out with long tube headers, in case you haven't heard. Tri-Y and they bolt on to the factory y pipe section. No cats.

Calling all V8 owners that want a high flow Y-pipe!!! I can do it. Need your help!

Doug Thorley Headers (@dougthorleyheaders) • Instagram photos and videos

 

[scribb]

Doug Thorley is about to come out with long tube headers, in case you haven't heard. Tri-Y and they bolt on to the factory y pipe section. No cats.

I did see that. With a good y pipe that would be ideal, but I'd have to remove it all every two years to smog. I'm trying to get to a system that needs minimal adjustment between the 2-year smog tests. I'm trying to figure out if I can get something set up with the headers and cats that will pass a lazy inspector. I know... probably a fools errand (cams, ecu, headers... sheesh) but I'm trying. Trying to keep things looking visually correct as much as possible.

 

[Inv4drZm]

I did see that. With a good y pipe that would be ideal, but I'd have to remove it all every two years to smog. I'm trying to get to a system that needs minimal adjustment between the 2-year smog tests. I'm trying to figure out if I can get something set up with the headers and cats that will pass a lazy inspector. I know... probably a fools errand (cams, ecu, headers... sheesh) but I'm trying. Trying to keep things looking visually correct as much as possible.

Got ya. Makes sense.

Just saw this GX470 on instagram too. He's planning internals + supercharger with his 4.7. Along with transmission upgrades. You seem to know what you're doing but if you wanted to check out what someone else is doing might be worthwhile to send him a message and get some details.

Snoopy GX470 (@snoopy_gx470) • Instagram photos and videos

 

[4RunnerAquasport]

Where the hell have I been. Subscribed!

 

[scribb]

Got ya. Makes sense.

Just saw this GX470 on instagram too. He's planning internals + supercharger with his 4.7. Along with transmission upgrades. You seem to know what you're doing but if you wanted to check out what someone else is doing might be worthwhile to send him a message and get some details.

Ha. I only ~seem~ like I know what I'm doing. I'll definitely check it out. Thanks for the link.

 

[scribb]

Got ya. Makes sense.

Just saw this GX470 on instagram too. He's planning internals + supercharger with his 4.7. Along with transmission upgrades. You seem to know what you're doing but if you wanted to check out what someone else is doing might be worthwhile to send him a message and get some details.

Snoopy GX470 (@snoopy_gx470) • Instagram photos and videos

Damn. That's in another league. Love the long travel suspension.

 

[gamefreakgc]

Yes, the 4th Gen 4runners have a transmission cooler, so hopefully heat won't be an issue.

The cams coming from Kelford will be ordered with a set of matching springs. We had a short conversation about that between the builder and Kelford. No extra machining necessary, they'll fit into the stock seats.

I've been in discussions with a tuner in New Zealand who has done a bunch of parallel ECU wirings, and is providing some info to my tuner in California. (He has a YouTube channel here: YouTube. Endlessly informative and entertaining.) The stock ECU will stay in place and run the transmission and emissions sensors, while the second ECU will be wired up behind the dash.

We're currently focused on a Link Xtreme ECU. Not cheap at about $1350, but according to the NZ tuner, it's the way to go to avoid lots of headaches and troubleshooting problems down the road. I'm hoping to be able to wire it up to a 2-din PC, or perhaps an android/bluetooth app so I can have in-dash monitoring and possibly map selection.

Definitely wondering about the injectors, but the verdict is out for the moment. Will take that as it comes. Saw an interesting thread recently about Rx8 injectors being swappable with much higher flow, but haven't seriously looked into that yet.

Hoping to see the cams/springs ship in the next two weeks. From there it will be 1-2 weeks to finish the build. Then I need to haul it back from Modesto, assemble everything and put it back in the truck. Then put the truck on a flatbed to Sac for the wiring and tuning. I'm hoping 4 weeks, but expecting more like 8, just being realistic. If I can have it back by the time the snow starts melting up in the Sierra Buttes, I'll be pretty happy.

Got a mountain of small issues to finish up. One dilemma I'm trying to figure out is the exhaust. I'm going with the Thorly short headers and URD MK3 exhaust. The headers don't come with cats, and I don't want to sacrifice my existing cats, as I'm half expecting I may need to throw the stock exhaust back on to pass smog--plus I don't think putting 14 year old cats on a new exhaust system is a great idea.

So I'm trying to figure out what cats to put on the headers, and whether I should put the new system on the motor when I reinstall it and hope for the best, or put the stock on to tune and smog and then put the headers on. I'd hate to put the headers on, not pass, then have to put the stock back on, pass smog, and do it all over again. But given everything I'm doing now, I guess it's not that big of a deal. Plus, it looks like if I keep all the heat shielding off the stock exhaust, it'll be a lot easier to get it on and off.

Yeah swapping parts every 2 years isn't much fun. I have to swap intakes, the rest is hidden well enough or has CARB EO #'s so I pass.

I think you might be downplaying how picky smog shops are. There's a sticker under the hood that tells the tech how many oxygen sensors there are and how many cats there are. If any of those are missing or not 3-way ceramic converters it's an insta-fail. Also if your cams have too much valve overlap you might have trouble with tailpipe testing if your vehicle requires it. Then there's the issue of the Computer check with a standalone wired in. I just don't know if that's going to work.

I do have a "lazy smog shop" here in Sac if you run into issues. Could I ask who your tuner is in Sac though? That's right in my backyard. I'm looking for a local dyno to test out some parts & tunes to see what makes the most power but having trouble finding a place. They keep closing...

URD should have recommendations for injectors. They make lots of performance parts for all years of 4Runners and Gadget has a wealth of knowledge.

 

[scribb]

That's some crazy timing... I just got off the phone with Gadget, ordering my exhaust and headers. And yeah, he's definitely knowledgeable. Immediately told me what minor changes I'd need to make switching from the original block to a Sequoia block after I found out an oil gallery had been obliterated by the broken rod.

One issue I'm trying to navigate right now is the forward cats. I'm keeping my original manifolds and cats intact to switch if needed, and looking for a set to put on the Thorley headers. I can't justify buying new OEM manifolds just to cut off the cats, but Gadget is saying there aren't any good replacements. Since I'll be simming the cat feed to the ECU, that probably won't be a problem, but I am looking for replacement cats that aren't garbage. If anyone has any experience with replacement cats that have lasted a few years, I'd love to hear what you used.

I'll DM you the name of the tuner in Sac that I'm working with. I don't have an issue publicizing his work, but I want to get a little further down the road to see how things shake out before endorsing.

Regarding the standalone ECU and computer check, my newfound mentor in NZ has a lot of experience parallel wiring OEM and standalone ECUs and says it can be done. I guess we'll see how it works out.

 

[Ed_C]

One issue I'm trying to navigate right now is the forward cats. I'm keeping my original manifolds and cats intact to switch if needed, and looking for a set to put on the Thorley headers. I can't justify buying new OEM manifolds just to cut off the cats, but Gadget is saying there aren't any good replacements. Since I'll be simming the cat feed to the ECU, that probably won't be a problem, but I am looking for replacement cats that aren't garbage. If anyone has any experience with replacement cats that have lasted a few years, I'd love to hear what you used.

Curious about CA smog checks:
- If they see CARB EO labels under the hood, will they actually cross-reference the numbers to verify they're for the vehicle?
- Will there be an issue if replacement cats that were originally welded were converted to flanges instead?
- If you cover the headers with OEM heat shields, will the inspectors take the time to actuality snoop around to verify there are OEM/OEM type manifolds under there?

Here's my thinking...
- Doug Thorley and JBA have EO #s for their '05-'06 Tundra/Sequoia headers, use the labels/stickers. Unfortunately these headers aren't direct bolt-on to 4Runners.
- Use the 4Runner specific DT shorty headers, weld flanges to the header outlets and cat inlets. Install the cats come inspection time and use test pipes the rest of the time.

 

[gamefreakgc]

Curious about CA smog checks:
- If they see CARB EO labels under the hood, will they actually cross-reference the numbers to verify they're for the vehicle?
- Will there be an issue if replacement cats that were originally welded were converted to flanges instead?
- If you cover the headers with OEM heat shields, will the inspectors take the time to actuality snoop around to verify there are OEM/OEM type manifolds under there?

If the smog tech is "by the book", they will cross-reference the EO #. If you model AND year does not match, you do not pass, it's happened before. Even if the EO # is for the same engine on a different model it will not pass. Now, not every tech is that thorough *wink wink*.

Welds vs flanges is fine though either way. It's common as an anti-theft device to weld on the cats with a sort of reinforcement to make it really hard to cut through. Back when metals prices spiked in 2011 cat thefts out here in California really skyrocketed. My cat was welded before, it passed fine. When I put headers on it has a flange now, also passed just fine.

 

[Ed_C]

I figured as much with the EO #s, pretty sure I'm not the first person to think about/attempt it LOL.

Maybe try hiding the DT shorties even more with not only OEM manifold shields but also with additional ones to ummm...protect the converters from theft....yeah that's it :tongue1:

 

[scribb]

Quick Update

Just a quick update on this monumental project.

Big news is I heard from Kelford yesterday that they got the billet blanks in for the cams, and my cams will be milled next week and shipped. So it seems so far they were as good as their word on timing and scheduling, which is fantastic.

My Thorley shorty headers came in from URD. Thanks, Gadget!

I've been grinding away on essentially a full mechanical overhaul of most of the truck systems, other than the suspension and brakes which were recently done. Since I've driven the truck hard, it's got 150k miles, and I plan to keep it, I'm replacing things that are obvious weak links that should be serviced. Things like bushings, ball joints, hoses, etc. It's adding maybe 15% to the budget, but since I already have the truck apart and it's all easy to get to, it makes sense to do it now and not be left on the trail or the side of the road somewhere.

This weekend I tackled the lower control arms and generally cleaning up the wheel wells--including rust treatment for anywhere I can find surface rust on frame and components. I'm using Purple Power to degrease, then treating with Corroseal, then putting a fresh coat of paint over it. Pretty straightforward, but a lot of elbow grease.

I've also made progress on a grill mod. I liked Paraordnance's approach for the 2005, because it stayed true to the 2005 front end, rather than updating it to 2006. I like the simpler straight line of the lights, and keeping the grill in proportion rather than englarging it. Just personal preference.

I took a slightly different approach, and retained the size and shape of the bottom bar. It was definitely a challenge. I'll post a thread on how I did it--basically I made a Plaster of Paris mold of the bottom bar on one side, and moved it to the middle to create a fiberglass replacement after cutting out the toyota badge. I got the paint and grill material, and new headlights, which I should be able to complete this week. Just need to do a little more sanding to sharpen the lines in the center of the lower bar.

I'm pretty much on track at this point to have everything complete when I get the motor back, so when I get it back from the tuner, it'll basically be a completely fresh mechanical build, ready for the Sierras when the snow melts.

 

[gamefreakgc]

Any plans to put your 4Runner on a dyno after it's all put together and tuned? I'd love to see what kind of potential the 2UZ-FE has, especially one done right like yours.

 

[4RunnerAquasport]

Any plans to put your 4Runner on a dyno after it's all put together and tuned? I'd love to see what kind of potential the 2UZ-FE has, especially one done right like yours.

Let's start a go fund me for some tuner and dyno time. I'll drop a hunji $$$

 

[AuSeeker]

Just a quick update on this monumental project.

Big news is I heard from Kelford yesterday that they got the billet blanks in for the cams, and my cams will be milled next week and shipped. So it seems so far they were as good as their word on timing and scheduling, which is fantastic.

My Thorley shorty headers came in from URD. Thanks, Gadget!

I've been grinding away on essentially a full mechanical overhaul of most of the truck systems, other than the suspension and brakes which were recently done. Since I've driven the truck hard, it's got 150k miles, and I plan to keep it, I'm replacing things that are obvious weak links that should be serviced. Things like bushings, ball joints, hoses, etc. It's adding maybe 15% to the budget, but since I already have the truck apart and it's all easy to get to, it makes sense to do it now and not be left on the trail or the side of the road somewhere.

This weekend I tackled the lower control arms and generally cleaning up the wheel wells--including rust treatment for anywhere I can find surface rust on frame and components. I'm using Purple Power to degrease, then treating with Corroseal, then putting a fresh coat of paint over it. Pretty straightforward, but a lot of elbow grease.

I've also made progress on a grill mod. I liked Paraordnance's approach for the 2005, because it stayed true to the 2005 front end, rather than updating it to 2006. I like the simpler straight line of the lights, and keeping the grill in proportion rather than englarging it. Just personal preference.

I took a slightly different approach, and retained the size and shape of the bottom bar. It was definitely a challenge. I'll post a thread on how I did it--basically I made a Plaster of Paris mold of the bottom bar on one side, and moved it to the middle to create a fiberglass replacement after cutting out the toyota badge. I got the paint and grill material, and new headlights, which I should be able to complete this week. Just need to do a little more sanding to sharpen the lines in the center of the lower bar.

I'm pretty much on track at this point to have everything complete when I get the motor back, so when I get it back from the tuner, it'll basically be a completely fresh mechanical build, ready for the Sierras when the snow melts.

Very interesting topic, wish you the best of luck.

Any updates on your progress?

 

[gamefreakgc]

I'm very interested to hear how this is going! I'm guessing you might just be waiting for the engine rebuild right now.

 

[scribb]

Yup. Playing the waiting game at the moment, mostly. I'm *hoping* I can get the motor back, installed, and off to the tuners before I head out for vacation mid-June, but it's going to be tight. Just too many uncharted issues to figure out that have made this drag on. But I'll post an update as soon as there's something worthwhile to report.

 

[gamefreakgc]

Yup. Playing the waiting game at the moment, mostly. I'm *hoping* I can get the motor back, installed, and off to the tuners before I head out for vacation mid-June, but it's going to be tight. Just too many uncharted issues to figure out that have made this drag on. But I'll post an update as soon as there's something worthwhile to report.

Better hurry before my 4Runner is faster than yours lol! I tweaked my tune over the past few weeks and I'm over 300 RWTQ on the virtual dyno program I use (calibrated from actual dyno runs I did last year). That's still with the stock exhaust too.

Speaking of exhaust, did you mention if you were changing it? I'm not sure if I should go 2.75" piping or 3". Currently at the Toyota weirdo size of 2.4" but it's crush bent down to 2.25" on the curves. Pretty restrictive.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Yup. Playing the waiting game at the moment, mostly. I'm *hoping* I can get the motor back, installed, and off to the tuners before I head out for vacation mid-June, but it's going to be tight. Just too many uncharted issues to figure out that have made this drag on. But I'll post an update as soon as there's something worthwhile to report.

Here's a built 2UZ, maybe you can get some info from the build sheet picture.

Pretty cool.

RockSolidToys on Instagram: “Hey guys. I have a customer who has this 4.7L for sale. It has been run since it’s been built. He paid $17k to have it built and is asking…”