Brake failure, solid pedal

caperatheart

New member
Had a brake failure, abs and brake lights came on, high pitched alarm going off. no movement in brake pedal. can get it to stop vehicle if just coasting but have to push extremely hard. Mechanic says " abs pump and says part is 4000 bucks" had codes read and they are as follows:

c1223- malfunction in abs control
c1251- pump motor is locked/open circuit
c1252- hydroboost pump motor malfunction
c1256- accumulator low pressure malfunction
c1336- 0 point calibration of yaw rate sensor undone
c1340- open circuit in center diff lock signal

any help would be appreciated
2003 4runner sr5 (canadian) 6cyl, 139,000 km
 
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$4k sounds a little high, but the part alone is $1800 from the dealer. You may be able to find a used part at a junk yard or ebay for $1000, but you don't know what you are getting.
 
i think hes right. there has been a failure somewhere in the master cylinder/abs/power brake assembly.
and they are spendy. i think you can get a used one for significantly less than that tho.
 
I believe a new one from the dealer is about 2k+ (we quoted I believe 2.7K to the warranty company) but they can be found for about $1.8k online brand new.

The total job should be a bit under $3k for the entire job including bleeding.
 
Thanks, I think I will try to find one on Ebay. they inflate the prices way to much here in Nova Scotia. We had to replace the fan for the heater, around here they wanted over $400 for a new one, and 150 for a used one at a scrape yard, got a new one on Amazon for $97. even with shipping was still better price than used here. :ybrick:
 
Why would anyone buy a used part like this for brakes is beyond me maybe for a trail rig but nothing I would drive on road for any length MHO
 
Why would anyone buy a used part like this for brakes is beyond me maybe for a trail rig but nothing I would drive on road for any length MHO

A lot of times only part of the assembly fails, but Toyota sells only the whole assembly. Then there are salvage vehicles that have good parts but the vehicle is damaged beyond repair.

I'm a little wary of used parts myself for critical applications. But to be honest with you, for the most part the a known good unit with a fair amount of miles is a more affordable choice than $1800 for a brand spanking new unit for most people. I would offer my old Hydraboost unit for the OP, but I still have not found a replacement O-Ring for the Master Cylinder, which is all that is wrong with the unit. It was an extended warranty job so I kept the unit tore it down to inspect what failed and decided it would benefit a member later down the road once I find a new o-ring (you cannot get JUST the o-ring from Toyota and I do not know what material it is made from as Brake O-Rings are different than regular O-Rings used in most of the vehicle.)
 
Exhaust manifolds, hydroboost for the brakes, front differential mount, head gasket failure, etc. etc. What I'm starting to notice is that it's the BIG and expensive stuff that dies on these "legendary quality" Toyotas.

So, somebody asked why you would ever buy used parts for something as important as brakes. My question is why would Toyota use a hydroboost system for something as important as brakes? No other vehicles in this class did, and you never ever hear of failures with those traditional systems.
 
Exhaust manifolds, hydroboost for the brakes, front differential mount, head gasket failure, etc. etc. What I'm starting to notice is that it's the BIG and expensive stuff that dies on these "legendary quality" Toyotas.

So, somebody asked why you would ever buy used parts for something as important as brakes. My question is why would Toyota use a hydroboost system for something as important as brakes? No other vehicles in this class did, and you never ever hear of failures with those traditional systems.

A front differential mount shouldn't be at all too expensive fist off...

As for the headgasket issue its a smaller percentage than Hemi engines dropping valve seats; but I agree with you that Toyota needs to remedy the issue since they knew enough to update the headgasket design and its just a slap to their customers and reputation. The hydraboost units are another oddball thing they need to better manage. There's 11 pages in the FSM on how to tear the unit down and replace individual components. Yet, there are no real diagnostic methods other than "eliminate everything else," you can't buy parts seperate from the dealer, there's very little support for the assembly beside replacement of the entire unit.

Toyota is not the only manufactuer who uses it; almost all the hybrid utilize this system; GM actually was the first to introduce it on the Cadillacs in the day and still use it on some of their vehicles; many other brands use it. The system allows much better control, pressures, and compactness than most traditional vacuum assisted units; particularly in conjuction with features like VSC and ATRAC which the 4Runner, FJ Cruiser, Land Cruiser, Prado, ect ect advertise.

But you're right to note a growing trend in failures of large expensive equipment on vehicles. The big thing to note is that while the 4Runner seems to have a very small sliver of issues with the Head Gaskets, HydraBoost, and transfercase; compared to other vehicles its rather small. I regularly see Jeep Grand Cherokees, BMW X series, Dodge SUVs, ect that come in with piles of expensive failures that seem to just happen all at once.

My point is, you bought a MODERN vehicle; it doesn't matter if you bought the cheapest trim level. These cars are so packed with tech, that when it goes its always going to be expensive to fix no matter what. ABS issue on a vacuum assisted modern car? $1.5k+ in parts alone, Alternator? $680 (just did a '09 Corolla this week), Instrument Cluster? 1k+ (Lexus LX470 from '05 is 2k for the instrument cluster from the factory). You want cheap parts buy an OLD car. People think buying a 2003 is going to save them from the insane prices of modern repairs... it won't.

Scary story time is over now. :)
 
I had a 1988 GM pickup with the hydraboost brake system. It was awful. Every time you hit the pedal you heard a "WOOSH". My friends with those trucks had the same issues. It was awful. When I test drove this Toyota, the first thing I noticed was the brakes suck. You have to stand on them pretty good to come to a stop. It's just terrible.

I prefer the braking action of a traditional vacuum boost system. Less complicated, more reliable, better performance.

I hope the OP gets his fixed and gets on the road soon. And I hope mine doesn't fail. Seems like most of these are failing around 135,000 miles or so. It's got me pretty nervous.
 
A lot of times only part of the assembly fails, but Toyota sells only the whole assembly. Then there are salvage vehicles that have good parts but the vehicle is damaged beyond repair.

I'm a little wary of used parts myself for critical applications. But to be honest with you, for the most part the a known good unit with a fair amount of miles is a more affordable choice than $1800 for a brand spanking new unit for most people. I would offer my old Hydraboost unit for the OP, but I still have not found a replacement O-Ring for the Master Cylinder, which is all that is wrong with the unit. It was an extended warranty job so I kept the unit tore it down to inspect what failed and decided it would benefit a member later down the road once I find a new o-ring (you cannot get JUST the o-ring from Toyota and I do not know what material it is made from as Brake O-Rings are different than regular O-Rings used in most of the vehicle.)

You should look into EPDM o-rings, I had to replace one in a proportioning valve once and used this, hasn't sprung a leak yet, lol. But seriously, I think this is the type of rubber used in most brake systems :) Check it out when you have time, you should be able to find shops online that stock them in all sorts of sizes, and if not can even custom make you one in any special shape.
 
I had a 1988 GM pickup with the hydraboost brake system. It was awful. Every time you hit the pedal you heard a "WOOSH". My friends with those trucks had the same issues. It was awful. When I test drove this Toyota, the first thing I noticed was the brakes suck. You have to stand on them pretty good to come to a stop. It's just terrible.

I prefer the braking action of a traditional vacuum boost system. Less complicated, more reliable, better performance.

I hope the OP gets his fixed and gets on the road soon. And I hope mine doesn't fail. Seems like most of these are failing around 135,000 miles or so. It's got me pretty nervous.

Toyota programmed the brakes to be rather soft on the 4Runners in terms of feedback and its always bothered me... Its not as bad as GM's trucks (vacuum assisted or otherwise) but it takes getting used to. They probably did it for the majority of "soccer moms" who drive 4Runners. The system actually brakes rather well, the reason most people don't "feel" it does is because of the overly consistent pedal feel which is disconcerting.

For example, I just did an emergency stop the other day because someone pulled into the street too fast; had about less than a hundred feet to stop and came within 10ft of his vehicle. The pedal felt exactly the same through out the entire depression, neither overly firm nor overly soft; but you could feel the point where the brakes physically bit and slowed the vehicle down as you pushed the pedal. Where as in a normal vehicle the majority of that feedback is brought to you by an increasingly difficult pedal to press/increase in resistance.
 
Exhaust manifolds, hydroboost for the brakes, front differential mount, head gasket failure, etc. etc. What I'm starting to notice is that it's the BIG and expensive stuff that dies on these "legendary quality" Toyotas.

So, somebody asked why you would ever buy used parts for something as important as brakes. My question is why would Toyota use a hydroboost system for something as important as brakes? No other vehicles in this class did, and you never ever hear of failures with those traditional systems.
there are a bunch of other vehicles that use this same type of system. i do agree tho, i dont care for the "all in one" units.


also, the "traditional" system you mention fails quite often as well. ive changed TONS of regular master cylinders.

anything, and everything can, and will break.

I had a 1988 GM pickup with the hydraboost brake system. It was awful. Every time you hit the pedal you heard a "WOOSH". My friends with those trucks had the same issues. It was awful. When I test drove this Toyota, the first thing I noticed was the brakes suck. You have to stand on them pretty good to come to a stop. It's just terrible.

I prefer the braking action of a traditional vacuum boost system. Less complicated, more reliable, better performance.

I hope the OP gets his fixed and gets on the road soon. And I hope mine doesn't fail. Seems like most of these are failing around 135,000 miles or so. It's got me pretty nervous.

mine is nothing like that. the brakes are phenomonal, they require VERY little travel, and effort to stop, and stop quickly.
 
Same problem- need advice

I have the codes C1223, C1251, C1252 and C1256 on my 4runner 2003 V8 sport edition. Lost brakes yesterday with same alarm sound, lights on dash.
Dealer says they reset and driving fine now. I cannot see how, if everyone else had to do a huge cylinder replacement. Also, they say we have a rodent in the engine (signs of) so want to check electrical for $357. Thoughts? The car is old, so trying to figure out best next steps.
 

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