Building, Driving and Adventuring the MTN4RNR

[danielhfranks]

Summer is coming to an end, and I have added a few new posts to my website.

A Mammoth Weekend:
Getting back into the groove can be hard. But with good people, good beers and some good adventure, it gets easy to fall right back into it.
​

Glad to see there are some other MTBers on here. Personally got 2 trips up to Mammoth this year to ride the park and had a blast. Now trying to figure out where that camp site is on google maps​

 

[MTN4RNR]

Glad to see there are some other MTBers on here. Personally got 2 trips up to Mammoth this year to ride the park and had a blast. Now trying to figure out where that camp site is on google maps

The 4R and Santa Cruz make a great pair. I rode with [MENTION=134661]Xtremluck[/MENTION] that weekend at Mammoth, and had a blast. I also like bringing it on shorter solo trips because in a pinch you can get out on bike (break down, stuck, etc). I can get farther on bike in a shorter time compared to being on foot.

 

[danielhfranks]

Agreed! Never know when you may need to ride back to town vs walk. I've also got the 1up rack and can't tell you how many people ask about it. Best rack there is, hands down

 

[TX4RNRGUY]

Im new here and have been lurking around for a few days and came across this build thread and I have to say I am hooked lol, Im on page 25 so far and your build and attention to detail in your work is awesome, Thanks for taking the time to keep this updated. I will probably spend all my free time over the next few days reading the rest of it.

 

[MTN4RNR]

Agreed! Never know when you may need to ride back to town vs walk. I've also got the 1up rack and can't tell you how many people ask about it. Best rack there is, hands down

Yep. I get comments all the time. I just took the whole thing apart for a good cleaning and it is as good as new now!

Im new here and have been lurking around for a few days and came across this build thread and I have to say I am hooked lol, Im on page 25 so far and your build and attention to detail in your work is awesome, Thanks for taking the time to keep this updated. I will probably spend all my free time over the next few days reading the rest of it.

Glad that you are enjoying the read! I have been having a great time with it the last few years. Enough so to start a website about it! Enjoy and shoot me any questions if you have them.

 

[rpearce1475]

If you ever want to meet up to ride or wheel with a fellow mountain biker/4 Runner owner hit me up! I'm by Joshua Tree

 

[MTN4RNR]

If you ever want to meet up to ride or wheel with a fellow mountain biker/4 Runner owner hit me up! I'm by Joshua Tree

Excellent! I am not down there much, but I am happy to reach out if I am down there for an exploring weekend :thumb3:

 

[MTN4RNR]

GWVR and Your 4Runner

A common theme with the modern overland/off-road vehicle is having enough gear to get you out of any situation and enough amenities with you to make camping comfortable.

This makes exploration convenient, but it comes at a cost that is often overlooked. Overall vehicle weight adds up quickly when you start piling on accessories, and the 5th generation 4Runner is no exception….

For the full article, head over to Trail4Runner.com or click the link here

 

[MTN4RNR]

Cooper ST Maxx -- 55k miles in...

Photo shows tires at 55k miles

With a new 4Runner in my life and a lot of places to see, I knew that the first and most important upgrade was a new set of tires. I wanted a tire that would cover rugged terrain in varying conditions while still remaining civil enough on the road for the long hauls from where I live to where the dirt starts.

I have had my Coopers for 55k miles as some of you know. They have taken me to some great places and they are STILL GOING! To read my long-term review of these tires click here.

 

[sekurt]

Interesting, your take on the Coopers. Really I had a very mixed love, hate, love, ultimately HATE for these tires. I had 255's in E which probably was my ultimate mistake. They towed absolutely outstandingly but also absolutely sucked for most other applications outside of snow duty. Aired down the sidewalls were still so stiff that it didn't really make much difference. They pulled so hard to the right that 3 months later after getting rid of them my left hand thumb is just starting to feel better from having to fight the correction. I had them for just under 50k and they do last a long time, just over 8/32nds left when they went to the grinder.

The tires I replaced with are Nitto Ridge Grapplers in 285/70x17 in a nice forgiving C rating. They are Lexus quiet in comparison, absolutly track 100% straight, so far are great in rain, and tow decently. I just got them installed middle of August so not a lot of adventure to report on yet. The few fire roads I've been on aired down is by comparison Maybach smooth.

For the small price difference vs. the Coopers I just cannot compare the 2, different leagues. Very interesting reading your unbiased review of your experience with them. I suspect it will help many others decide "if" its a long term path they want to pursue. My left thumb, kidneys, dash, and everything else on and in my truck only wish I'd had an unbiased review like yours 3 years ago.

 

[MTN4RNR]

Interesting, your take on the Coopers. Really I had a very mixed love, hate, love, ultimately HATE for these tires. I had 255's in E which probably was my ultimate mistake. They towed absolutely outstandingly but also absolutely sucked for most other applications outside of snow duty. Aired down the sidewalls were still so stiff that it didn't really make much difference. They pulled so hard to the right that 3 months later after getting rid of them my left hand thumb is just starting to feel better from having to fight the correction. I had them for just under 50k and they do last a long time, just over 8/32nds left when they went to the grinder.

The tires I replaced with are Nitto Ridge Grapplers in 285/70x17 in a nice forgiving C rating. They are Lexus quiet in comparison, absolutly track 100% straight, so far are great in rain, and tow decently. I just got them installed middle of August so not a lot of adventure to report on yet. The few fire roads I've been on aired down is by comparison Maybach smooth.

For the small price difference vs. the Coopers I just cannot compare the 2, different leagues. Very interesting reading your unbiased review of your experience with them. I suspect it will help many others decide "if" its a long term path they want to pursue. My left thumb, kidneys, dash, and everything else on and in my truck only wish I'd had an unbiased review like yours 3 years ago.

Your experience with right pull is interesting. Mine is there, but nothing that I would consider annoying or as you described, painful. Makes me wonder if there is a difference between the two tire sizes in relation to pull. I have read that it's due to the tread pattern, and that some experience it more than others. I do wish that the 255/80 was available in a Load C or D as it would make the ride a bit smoother. The 275/70 that I have on now are Load E, and while I am ok with the ride quality, I feel that a C/D rated tire would still be strong enough for off-road capability but it would give back some comfort.

Just out of curiosity, what tire pressures were you running when you were experiencing the harsh ride? What did you air down to?

The Nittos would be another option with their 255/80 option on the Trail Grapplers. I have looked at them in the past and have been impressed.

 

[sekurt]

Your experience with right pull is interesting. Mine is there, but nothing that I would consider annoying or as you described, painful. Makes me wonder if there is a difference between the two tire sizes in relation to pull. I have read that it's due to the tread pattern, and that some experience it more than others. I do wish that the 255/80 was available in a Load C or D as it would make the ride a bit smoother. The 275/70 that I have on now are Load E, and while I am ok with the ride quality, I feel that a C/D rated tire would still be strong enough for off-road capability but it would give back some comfort.

Just out of curiosity, what tire pressures were you running when you were experiencing the harsh ride? What did you air down to?

The Nittos would be another option with their 255/80 option on the Trail Grapplers. I have looked at them in the past and have been impressed.

I suspect that due to the narrow size it increased the pulling sensation. At freeway speeds it really was annoying. Funny how you can become used to something, in this case something very annoying, and put up with it for so long as second nature.

I played with the pressures quite a bit. I found for towing that 38 cold worked wonderfully, it would settle out near 42 once warm. For general every day driving 34 was about right. Still way too harsh for comfortable driving over urban railroad tracks, pot holes, cracks, etc, but usable. Aired down I never really got any satisfactory results. 15-20 really felt nearly the same as 34. I think that the 255's in E are just overkill on our rigs. My truck is right at 5900 with me inside, full tank and no gear, other than what's installed to include a full Trekboxx system. These skinny E code tires are suitable for ¾ ton and larger Suburbans and full size pickup trucks, not necessarily our 4Runners. I'm still just in disbelief how much smoother and quieter the Nittos are, and more importantly how true they track.

The only reason I went with the 255's in E was due to my running set after set of 235/85x16 KO's on a ¾ Suburban. They were just awesome on that truck, of course I also ran them at 85psi. I mistakenly thought I could relive the same experience on the lighter 4Runner.

 

[The Waco Kid]

I suspect that due to the narrow size it increased the pulling sensation. At freeway speeds it really was annoying. Funny how you can become used to something, in this case something very annoying, and put up with it for so long as second nature.

I played with the pressures quite a bit. I found for towing that 38 cold worked wonderfully, it would settle out near 42 once warm. For general every day driving 34 was about right. Still way too harsh for comfortable driving over urban railroad tracks, pot holes, cracks, etc, but usable. Aired down I never really got any satisfactory results. 15-20 really felt nearly the same as 34. I think that the 255's in E are just overkill on our rigs. My truck is right at 5900 with me inside, full tank and no gear, other than what's installed to include a full Trekboxx system. These skinny E code tires are suitable for ¾ ton and larger Suburbans and full size pickup trucks, not necessarily our 4Runners. I'm still just in disbelief how much smoother and quieter the Nittos are, and more importantly how true they track.

The only reason I went with the 255's in E was due to my running set after set of 235/85x16 KO's on a ¾ Suburban. They were just awesome on that truck, of course I also ran them at 85psi. I mistakenly thought I could relive the same experience on the lighter 4Runner.

It's interesting that was your experience. I have no experience with ST Maxx's but I do have E rated ATPs in stock size. They are notably stiffer, but no intolerable. I run them at 45psi cold, and its comfortable. Anything under 41 and it's absolutely awful. I'm not familiar with what psi you should run on skinnies, but based on my experience, it sounds to me that you were WAY too low. What were the wear characteristics? Granted I don't have much weight in my truck aside from sliders, an aluminum rack, and about 50lbs of gear, so it can't be because I'm running heavy.

 

[MTN4RNR]

I suspect that due to the narrow size it increased the pulling sensation. At freeway speeds it really was annoying. Funny how you can become used to something, in this case something very annoying, and put up with it for so long as second nature.

I played with the pressures quite a bit. I found for towing that 38 cold worked wonderfully, it would settle out near 42 once warm. For general every day driving 34 was about right. Still way too harsh for comfortable driving over urban railroad tracks, pot holes, cracks, etc, but usable. Aired down I never really got any satisfactory results. 15-20 really felt nearly the same as 34. I think that the 255's in E are just overkill on our rigs. My truck is right at 5900 with me inside, full tank and no gear, other than what's installed to include a full Trekboxx system. These skinny E code tires are suitable for ¾ ton and larger Suburbans and full size pickup trucks, not necessarily our 4Runners. I'm still just in disbelief how much smoother and quieter the Nittos are, and more importantly how true they track.

The only reason I went with the 255's in E was due to my running set after set of 235/85x16 KO's on a ¾ Suburban. They were just awesome on that truck, of course I also ran them at 85psi. I mistakenly thought I could relive the same experience on the lighter 4Runner.

I would say that the narrower size and the low everyday pressure of 34psi would have exacerbated the "Cooper right pull". 34 is low for an load range E tire, I will usually run 38-40 with my load range E 275/70 S/T's.

And this is where the great debated on E versus C rated tires comes in. The LR E tire will have better resistance to cuts and punctures over the LR C due to the thicker carcass. But ride quality will be somewhat sacrificed because the tire won't be as supple, as you had experienced. If Cooper offered the S/T Maxx in more LR C variants I would likely consider them over a LR E knowing that I might sacrifice SOME off-road reliability for a smoother ride. For now, I will make that sacrifice and live with the harsher ride. Again, I have just gotten used to it. But who knows what the newer size will feel like. That's why I always have my tires installed at a shop with a return, or "test drive" policy.

It's interesting that was your experience. I have no experience with ST Maxx's but I do have E rated ATPs in stock size. They are notably stiffer, but no intolerable. I run them at 45psi cold, and its comfortable. Anything under 41 and it's absolutely awful. I'm not familiar with what psi you should run on skinnies, but based on my experience, it sounds to me that you were WAY too low. What were the wear characteristics? Granted I don't have much weight in my truck aside from sliders, an aluminum rack, and about 50lbs of gear, so it can't be because I'm running heavy.

I resonate more with your observations. I run at 38-40 psi on the road and find the ride firm, but not teeth shattering. But again, everyone has their preferences for too soft or too harsh.

 

[sn_85]

I would say that the narrower size and the low everyday pressure of 34psi would have exacerbated the "Cooper right pull". 34 is low for an load range E tire, I will usually run 38-40 with my load range E 275/70 S/T's.

And this is where the great debated on E versus C rated tires comes in. The LR E tire will have better resistance to cuts and punctures over the LR C due to the thicker carcass. But ride quality will be somewhat sacrificed because the tire won't be as supple, as you had experienced. If Cooper offered the S/T Maxx in more LR C variants I would likely consider them over a LR E knowing that I might sacrifice SOME off-road reliability for a smoother ride. For now, I will make that sacrifice and live with the harsher ride. Again, I have just gotten used to it. But who knows what the newer size will feel like. That's why I always have my tires installed at a shop with a return, or "test drive" policy.



I resonate more with your observations. I run at 38-40 psi on the road and find the ride firm, but not teeth shattering. But again, everyone has their preferences for too soft or too harsh.

Someone on here said the Falken AT3/W should come out with a 275/70/17 LR-C in early 2019. Could be just a rumor but hope it comes to fruition. Honestly I think 275/70/17 C-rated is the prefect size tire for the 4Runner. Once you get into 285's and up along with E-rated you got to start cutting/trimming/chopping things and dealing with on-road harshness. I know from experience!!! If the AT3/W comes out in that size variant I'll go with that.

 

[TOUGHasNAILS]

I have been wanting to add some extra fire power to the lighting arsenal of the 4Runner for a while. After the HID install, I found that the stock halogen high beams didn’t really match the low beam output, or color. And I no longer had the function of being able to ‘flash’ my high beams to be able to signal to other drivers because unless the low beams were on, flashing the stock high beams would cause the HID ballasts to flash as well, which is not good for long term reliability. So, aftermarket light bar it was. I decided on the S8 light bar from [MENTION=87816]Baja Designs[/MENTION] because their design is fantastic. Serviceable and exchangeable lenses, great light dispersion with the combo/driving lens, low beam matching 5k light output, and the separately wired amber back-lighting. I wanted a single row, because I wanted to keep it less noticeable. I decided on the upper grille because I wanted to keep it in-line with the headlights, not to block the radiator, and to have the back-lit feature be in the ‘marker light’ position. I bought the LED bar through Apollo Optics .
Switching is controlled by an OEM style switch for now until I add a few more accessories, then I will switch to a consolidated platform (likely a Switch-Pro). Without further delay...​

Parts used:
- Baja Designs S8 20” LED bar purchased from Apollo Optics
- Wiring harness from Apollo Optics
- OEM style “Driving Lights” switch from Slee Offroad
- TRD Pro upper grille
- Drill of choice
- Milwaukee #9 step drill bit
- Supplied hardware from Baja Designs
- Flexo PET wire sheathing
- Scotch Extreme Fasterners
- Mini-blade Add-a-fuse
- Shrink wrap
- Heat gun
- Weather resistant butt connectors
- Dielectric grease
- 14 ga. wire
- Electrical tape
- Zip ties
- Wire crimpers
- Wire strippers
- Alpine Beer Company - Duet

Install:

Remove front access cover.

Remove upper grille and bezel. Remove 2 upper plastic clips and pull outwards.

TRD Pro grille vs. Trail/SR5 grille

Locate 2 existing stock holes (red) that will line up with brackets provided by Baja. Yellow holes noted could fit a set of the S2 lights from Baja based on measurements, but this is unconfirmed.

Mock up placement for new LED bar using the stock holes.

Use a step drill to widen the mounting brackets by approximately ¼” per side, and also the holes on the grille support by approximately ⅛” per side. I didn’t measure these, but I would drill and test fit until I could get the bolts to fit through.

LED bar mocked up and bolted in.

LED bar removed, grille mocked up.

LED bar installed with grille in place.

I left the painted bezel off until the install was finalized to reduce any chance of scratching or damaging it.

Bring in the wiring team…

I laid out the wiring harness as I planned on installing it and cut everything to length. I poked a hole in the existing firewall grommet and fed the unsheathed wire through to take a measurement first, then pulled it out and cut. Harness laid out.

I then wrapped all lines in the Flexo PET sheathing to protect from wear and to consolidate multiple wires into one manageable run.

All connections made were with dielectric grease, weather resistant butt connectors, and shrink wrap. Thanks to [MENTION=65614]Antman[/MENTION] for the advice on how to make a proper connection using proper tools. This shows an un-shrunk (red wire) and a shrunk butt connector (black wire).

Connectors for the supplied male weather tight connector that comes with the S8 LED bar.

Capped, sheathed, shrunk wrapped.

Laying out all sheathed wires.

Hole in firewall grommet, and feeding the wires through.

I chose the closest blank spot, and the easiest to turn on/off without looking to install the switch. This upper panel can be removed by pushing on the left side and the ‘top’ and using the tractional force to pull it towards you. Should pop pretty easily, but remember that there are connected wires behind it, so don’t pull too hard. Remove the blank piece by depressing the upper and lower ‘locks’ and pushing it out. Route the wires up through the blank hole. I used the vise-grips to hold the wires in place so they wouldn’t slip through the hole when I wasn’t looking.

​

See part 2 below

Am I the only person that can't see the pictures of the S8 install?

 

[Baja Designs]

Am I the only person that can't see the pictures of the S8 install?

You're not the only one. Photobucket pulled it's free image hosting and as a result all of the old links went dead. Max might have the old photos saved somewhere. Knowing him, he is probably on an adventure right now or headed out for the weekend!

Baja Designs
www.bajadesigns.com

 

[TOUGHasNAILS]

Yikes

You're not the only one. Photobucket pulled it's free image hosting and as a result all of the old links went dead. Max might have the old photos saved somewhere. Knowing him, he is probably on an adventure right now or headed out for the weekend!

Baja Designs
www.bajadesigns.com

No Bueno

 

[YetiX]

No Bueno

What browser do you use? If you use Chrome, there is an Extension called the Photobucket Hotlink Fix that allows you to see the pictures. I can see them fine.

 

[omaguz]

Hey Max, hope all is well. Do you have a write up on the fog always on mod???