Catalytic Converter/Exhaust systemrepair....

psquared77

psquared77

Member
New to the site....Have an '02 4Runner Sport...had it almost 5 yrs now and keep up with the maintenance pretty well. Got 154,000+ miles and the Check Engine Light came on. Took to the dealership and told me I need a new catalytic converter and replace "cat 1" and "cat 2" but I have no idea what this means. I get the cat converter purpose and will replace to save our collective lungs, but what about these two pipes..cat 1 and cat 2. Dealer saying it will cost $2600?!?!?! to replace.
Can anyone point me in the right direction of what is going on here? Can I just put on a comparable cat coverter and be done? Or do I really need these $2200 pipes? Any info would be appreciated!
 
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people correct me if i am wrong,

i take it u know what cats are and what they do so i wont get into that.

since u took it to the dealer they want to sel u everything, cats really never go bad but what about the oxy. sensor? i would go find another shop and see what they say, or if u can get the codes for the problem people on here might be able to help u out, but i bet the cat is not the problem! dont waste that much money unless u are sure its the cat.

get another look at it and fix the problem, if there is nothing sounding mechanical wrong with it then its not mandatory to be fixed. you should still be able to drive it and i think the dealer ship is just wanting your money
 
Definitely go to your local Autozone or whatever and ask them to read the OBD II error code. Then research that code in the toyota forums (like this one!).
Also, do you have California spec emissions? They have 2 cats instead of one. (and before anyone says something, Cali spec vehicles were sold all over the country, not just CA)
 
As others have suggested, pull your codes. I doubt the cat has to be replaced. Post up the results from the scanner.
 
I got a "second opinion" today from Midas as I was not able to get to Autozone. Midas technician informed me my front O2 sensor is ok, but front catalytic converter is bad and he couldn't tell me about the back O2 sensor......Did say that rear cat is still ok. Also said that Dealership was trying to get me to fix whole thing and take my money....of course!

Midas would do front cat for $800.

Going to Autozone tomorrow to get the codes and come back to the site. This is a great resource and I appreciate everyone that weighed in.....HUGE HELP.
 
i have tried looking for a cat. best place to is to get it on Ebay. $300 front oem cat. you can do it yourself. it only has about 3 top bolts that is pretty tough, the other two bolts is easier. just need a nice long breaker bar. hahaha. you will save big on this job if you do it yourself.
 
Got the codes for the CEL....code that came up was 20420....

So, is it possible that 1 of my 02 sensors is bad and not the actual front cat?? How much and where can I get a new 02 sensor?.....Anyone?
 
That code will be P0420, not with a 2 at the front. Since you are talking about having 2 catalytic converters then this means you have California Spec. emission too.
Basically the ECM observes the electrical waveform of the sensor located behind the cat to determine if the catalyst is functioning normally. Your ECM is getting an abnormal signal. This could be caused by
1. Gas leakage on the exhaust system
2. A bad A/F sensor (bank 1 sensor 1), the sensor before the cat
3. A bad heated oxygen sensor (bank 1 sensor 2), the sensor after the cat
4. Your cat is toast.

Do you have access to a multi-meter? If so I can show you how to test the sensors yourself, its pretty easy.
So if you have bad sensors, they are easy to get and replace, but if your sensors are good, then at least you know 100% for sure before you fork out for a new cat + labor.
 
Wow, that is great information. Unfortunately, I don't have access to a multi-meter, or even where I could get access to one. Sad to admit I don't know what it is. This whole experience is new to me and I learning alot as I go. I don't believe it is a CA vehicle. Bought it certified used at beginning of 2003 in Virginia. I'm a Pittsburgh area native and have no familiarity w/ emissions until I lived in VA

I did have service done in July on the vehicle due to:

"code P1135-Open heater circuit air fuel ratio sensor bank 1, sensor 1. R&R air fuel ratio sensor bank 1 sensor 1 & rechecked. Cks ok."

Also had fuel injection service done in July. The the CEL came back on some time later, but have had no noticeable changes in performance.

1. Can I rule out a malfunctioning A/F ratio sensor since I had it replaced 11K miles ago?

2. Can I get the 02 sensor replaced (since this is the least expensive route) and if that doesn't fix the problem, then know it is the front cat that is bad?

3. How can I, the quick learning auto owner, determine if gas is leaking on the exhaust system? odors, residue, etc.?

All of the information that has been posted in reply to my first post has been enlightening, and truly appreciated. Keep 'em coming.
 
techno said:
That code will be P0420, not with a 2 at the front. ....Basically the ECM observes the electrical waveform of the sensor located behind the cat to determine if the catalyst is functioning normally. Your ECM is getting an abnormal signal. This could be caused by
1. Gas leakage on the exhaust system
2. A bad A/F sensor (bank 1 sensor 1), the sensor before the cat
3. A bad heated oxygen sensor (bank 1 sensor 2), the sensor after the cat
4. Your cat is toast.

Do you have access to a multi-meter? If so I can show you how to test the sensors yourself, its pretty easy.
So if you have bad sensors, they are easy to get and replace, but if your sensors are good, then at least you know 100% for sure before you fork out for a new cat + labor.
Click to expand...

Techno-

I have been lurking here for quite a while. I have had the engine check lights. Disconnect the battery, lights go away for a month or so. However, last two times I disconnected the battery, the lights (check engine) came on right away. Dealer pulled the codes and I also have the P0420. For a lot of money, my next born, and a first round draft pick they will replace a whole bunch of stuff.

Here is my plan.

The local Meineke said they will install any parts that I purchase online.

I was going to order the two Oxygen Sensors on line (suggestions Toyota original or aftermarket anyone?). If those are unsuccessful I will then order the two Cats (again aftermarket or original suggestions?). I know I can save by having Meineke install and getting internet discount.

How difficult, with a multi meter is it to check the O2 sensors electrically so I can zero in quicker without just going through the parts replacement process?

My runner has 130,000 miles, 2002. My goal is to keep it 10 years (2012) so I want to do a good service, not just the cheapest.
 
This is just for the 02 sensor, not an A/F sensor. Since you're talking about having two 02 sensors I'm assuming you do NOT have California spec emissions......
To inspect the 02 sensor, crawl under the car and disconnect the sensor at the electrical connection a few inches from the actual sensor. Looking at the plug with the 2 little ridges that are close to each other at the bottom, measure the resistance between the top two terminals.
Resistance should be
11 - 16 ohms at 68
 
shootmymime said:
cats really never go bad
Click to expand...

He said it, techno. P nut also said that he "doubts the cat needs to be replaced," implying the same thing.

One of the reasons that the dealership might be trying to get him to replace the cat and the piping is that there could be something wrong with the pipes or they are rusted, etc. The reason why aftermarket places are quoting cheaper is because most of them just hack out the cat and weld in a cheap replacement that probably won't last anywhere near as long as the factory one did.
 
Fair enough.
But keep in mind, the auto maintenance industry is notorious for 'over servicing' people, and since the cat going bad is almost always the last possible cause for problem symptoms, its understandable that some might question what a mechanic 'thinks' the issue might be.
 
techno said:
Fair enough.
But keep in mind, the auto maintenance industry is notorious for 'over servicing' people, and since the cat going bad is almost always the last possible cause for problem symptoms, its understandable that some might question what a mechanic 'thinks' the issue might be.
Click to expand...

Oh I understand that and I am not doubting that. If it is not a person that they know and trust at the dealership I agree with getting a second opinion. What irritates me is when people automatically think all dealerships are "stealerships." That is too much of a generalization IMO.
 
techno said:
This is just for the 02 sensor, not an A/F sensor. Since you're talking about having two 02 sensors I'm assuming you do NOT have California spec emissions......

I have bought sensors from URD. They have good prices and good service. Buy Denso. Do not buy Bosch.
Click to expand...

Thanks Techno - I definetly have a california emission with dual cats. I thought there were two sensors, on in front of the first and one after the second.

JG
 
In that case, the sensor closer to the engine in an A/F sensor. Here's the details for that

To inspect the A/F sensor, crawl under the car and disconnect the sensor at the electrical connection a few inches from the actual sensor. Looking at the plug with the 2 little ridges that are close to each other at the bottom, measure the resistance (with your multimeter) between the top two terminals.
Resistance should be
0.8 - 1.4 ohms at 68
 
techno said:
This is just for the 02 sensor, not an A/F sensor. Since you're talking about having two 02 sensors I'm assuming you do NOT have California spec emissions......
Click to expand...

Update - I read this post to late, and ordered two sensors. I DO HAVE A CALIFORNIA EMISSION.

bought two toyota sensors and brought to a local mechanic to install. Previous code was P0420. He pulls the code and says it is P1135. He says this is for the air fuel ratio sensor, something wrong with a heater in it??? Picks one up for 337.50. I of course have no option to save money, he has vehicle.

Also tells me the front sensor is wrong, but I tell him to put the rear one in anyway, as long as he has it.

I expect vehicle back later today, but I do not expect my problems to be solved. Something drove the P0420 code, and all that I am doing for that code best I can tell is replacing one sensor. Any suggestions on what to do next, or just be patient till I see what works and does not work.
 
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