Cause for concern in 1GR-FE

[Soulprogression108]

Ok so quick back story. Truck is a 2011 and had full Toyota service record. I bought it with 70k on it and I have done two on time oil changes as well as change every other fluid.

Since I got it the truck has had a whine around 2k rpm more noticeable in lower gears and under load. I did a bunch of research. Apparently it's quite normal for this motor. Maybe not "right" but many claim this.

Now I tried to put it out of my head but it still bothered me a bit. I haven't had time to trace but it does seem louder by driver side. I've read possibly one of the pulleys for the Timing chain system.

Fast forward to yesterday. I do an oil change. Always use Toyota OEM filter and oil.

Oil was black at 5k miles. Concern was there were some metal flakes about size of an ant or a medium grain of sand (3 or so noticeable) and a very small amount of smaller specs. With my old truck at 300k 22RE it was kinda par for the course it was worn out time for a rebuild.

With this now I'm thinking that doesn't seem good. A little more research has pointed that some of these 1GR-FE's have had oil pump failure. This could contribute to the noise I'm hearing, but it could also be causing the Timing Chain System to not get properly lubricated (as well as upper parts of the motor)

I'm checking sound locations today with stethoscope, but want to get some input from anyone that might have experience here. Anyway to check without pulling Timing Cover? If I can determine indeed that the issue is oil pump then I may have to bite the bullet replace oil pump and all the timing guides, chain, idlers, etc. Really don't want to crack this engine with so little miles on it though.

 

[flyrv9]

The 1GR-FE engine is noisy; unless yours is making more noise than normal. Some folks here send an oil sample to Blackstone Labs for analysis. Some have posted their reports and they look pretty detailed. You could also install an analog oil pressure gauge so you could monitor oil pressure more accurately to better see if the oil pump is suspect; if there is a fitting on the engine for one.

 

[ecally]

I’ll be watching this thread. I have a 2023 but that exact noise you describe grates on me, wish I knew exactly what it is.

 

[Humble Leader]

hard to diagnose without a video or assess how bad it is. the 5th gen 4runner engine kind of sounds broken all the time. metal shavings in the oil that are clearly visible though is likely a problem ...

 

[Soulprogression108]

hard to diagnose without a video or assess how bad it is. the 5th gen 4runner engine kind of sounds broken all the time. metal shavings in the oil that are clearly visible though is likely a problem ...

Ya I need to get a good recording. I keep trying but get important calls, or have some other thing come up and the recording sounds bad. I'll try to get one this week. I also picked up a mechanics stethoscope so will poke around with it and see what I can find.

 

[Soulprogression108]

I did get a kit from blackstone labs and will send some of the oil from the last oil change soon. Intrigued to see what they say.

Just want to add that other than this noise the truck runs like a top. Idle smooth and plenty of power.

 

[Yamahamer]

Idle smooth and plenty of power.

Plenty of power? That's pretty subjective. I'd describe it as "adequate" power. Every time I drive my 2016 F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost (over 200 more lb-ft of torque than the Toyota engine) I realize just how down in power that 4Runner engine is.

 

[Bmnorm2]

I did get a kit from blackstone labs and will send some of the oil from the last oil change soon. Intrigued to see what they say.

Just want to add that other than this noise the truck runs like a top. Idle smooth and plenty of power.

You’ll want to catch the oil midstream , like a pee test. Oil analysis is probably the easiest way to start narrowing down where the metal is coming from.

 

[Soulprogression108]

Plenty of power? That's pretty subjective. I'd describe it as "adequate" power. Every time I drive my 2016 F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost (over 200 more lb-ft of torque than the Toyota engine) I realize just how down in power that 4Runner engine is.

Meaning engine doesn’t feel down on power… I get your point. But to me coming from a 94 22re this thing feels like a beast hahaha. Personally I’m content with the power to weight of this vehicle. If I started adding bumpers winch huge tires I’d probably feel different.

 

[Whippersnapper02]

You can always send an oil sample to crackstone crabs for testing but really this engine has been noisy when it was first used in 05.

 

[BTO]

These 4.0L are noisy. Using 0w-20 oil does not help. My Tacoma has essentially the same engine but is spec for 5w-30 and is much quieter.

 

[thatoneguy]

You can always send an oil sample to crackstone crabs for testing but really this engine has been noisy when it was first used in 05.

03!

They're old. But they're proven to work. We've got a member here with like 360k+ miles on a 4.0L with 10k oil change intervals. Everything but the rear main seal is overbuilt.

 

[1000MPH]

Sounds like a diesel.
Howls, whines, clicks, taps, roars.
Hopefully for 400,000 miles.

 

[Soulprogression108]

Sounds like a diesel.
Howls, whines, clicks, taps, roars.
Hopefully for 400,000 miles.

Thanks man, ya I'm getting used to it. It's partly that I had a 2nd gen 22re with flowmaster 40 so the only time I really heard the noises of that thing (other than every time I drove up a hill) was when I was under the hood or when something was really wrong.

I've spent some time using an endo scope and got a look inside the timing chain cover. The chain and tensioner look well brand new, and from what I can see the guides are intact and in good shape. I am pretty sure one sound is the whine that other users have experienced from the timing chain idler gear which starts to fail and makes the engine sound like it's super charged.

The other sounds I think are mostly the noise of this Dual VVTI 4.0 beast.

The metal I'm waiting for blackstones response on and I'm going to do another oil change and see what the magnetic plug picks up and if anything else is in oil.

I think the metal flakes may either be from the failing TC idler gear or from what I could see inside the TC cover is cast and there's a lot of imperfections on surfaces just like you can see on the outside of the engine. I suspect it's possible some of these could loosen up and come off.

I also think I've narrowed down another sound I notice particularly when I put it in gear. And that is my idler pulleys on the v belt are starting to go. Definitely not rolling super smoothly. Not terrible, but I need to pull the belt again and put in gear and see if the sounds there. I'm really hoping that's it and not some engine internals.

 

[02SE]

03!

They're old. But they're proven to work. We've got a member here with like 360k+ miles on a 4.0L with 10k oil change intervals. Everything but the rear main seal is overbuilt.

The Single VVTi 1GRFE used from 2003-2009, and to 2015 in the Tacoma, is significantly different than the Dual VVTi 1GRFE used in 2010-2024 5th gen 4Runners, and 2010 and up FJ Cruisers.

Different block, crankshaft, cylinder heads, and intake and exhaust, etc, etc. It's so different, that I think Toyota should have changed the model designation of the engine more significantly than they did.

 

[thatoneguy]

The Single VVTi 1GRFE used from 2003-2009, and to 2015 in the Tacoma, is significantly different than the Dual VVTi 1GRFE used in 2010-2024 5th gen 4Runners, and 2010 and up FJ Cruisers.

Different block, crankshaft, cylinder heads, and intake and exhaust, etc, etc. It's so different, that I think Toyota should have changed the model designation of the engine more significantly than they did.

Yes, I've always been aware of that, but to me it's still the same general engine in the same engine family at the same displacement. If someone truly knows the exact nitty-gritty of how significant the changes are, exact measurements and all, I'd be interested. Such as how significant the block changes actually were.

In reliability discussions, generally nobody separates the single VVTI and dual VVTI 4.0L's as to be considered independently; we're all pretty comfortable putting them all under the 4.0L umbrella.

 

[02SE]

Yes, I've always been aware of that, but to me it's still the same general engine in the same engine family at the same displacement. If someone truly knows the exact nitty-gritty of how significant the changes are, exact measurements and all, I'd be interested. Such as how significant the block changes actually were.

In reliability discussions, generally nobody separates the single VVTI and dual VVTI 4.0L's as to be considered independently; we're all pretty comfortable putting them all under the 4.0L umbrella.

At one time I researched the differences. IIRC they shared some common bearing shells.

The Dual VVTi block had improvements for cooling, the liner cross-hatching was improved, and they were more securely attached to the block casting.

So while the Single VVTi 1GRFE, and Dual VVTi 1GRFE, are both 4.0 liter V6 Toyota engines, they share almost nothing in actual parts.

I find that most people, especially if they aren't Toyota enthusiasts, are unaware of that.

 

[Soulprogression108]

Well looks like some good news from Blackstone anyway. All readings are below average. That with the inspection I did with endoscope is really pointing me towards over all OK inside TC at least. I'll be doing another oil change soon to see what shows up and will check with magnet and see what's on the drain plug.

I'm pretty certain I've got the annoying whining idler gear issue and that my accy belt pulley's are starting to go bad. Double checking that and will replace if they need it. The TC idler gear is just a bummer but seems like many have this and have 150-300k miles on the engine. Shame to do the work to crack the front cover to replace a $20 part and possibly have the issue return in 40k.

Feeling a little better. Gotta say seeing the metal flake in oil and hearing some interesting sounds really had me stressing for a bit. I'm hoping all is well. Truck has really good maintenance records and low miles so would be sad to think there's a major issue.

 

[1000MPH]

It’s easy to release tension on the serpentine, spin the idlers and pull if necessary. I got a set when Toyota had a 25% parts sale. This year I splurged for a full tensioner that I hope I never need.
This is the pdf for changes on the 1GR-FE:

 

[15Limited]

The 1GR-FE engine is noisy; unless yours is making more noise than normal. Some folks here send an oil sample to Blackstone Labs for analysis. Some have posted their reports and they look pretty detailed. You could also install an analog oil pressure gauge so you could monitor oil pressure more accurately to better see if the oil pump is suspect; if there is a fitting on the engine for one.

Early in ownership, especially when driving on hilly roads, I couldn't help but notice how bad this engine sounds from inside. It made me seriously consider different headers but I didn't want to deal with warranty challenges. You get used to it, but never happy about it IMO.