I've been lurking here fore quite some time and on a few other boards for other vehicles I'm considering for purchase. After a year, I've whittled my list down to four vehicles in two categories (SUV vs Wagon). I've driven three of the final four, but the #1 vehicle on my list (4Runner) has as many questions as answers after two different test drives. First, why does the handling and road feel lag so much relative to the JGC, is it the body on frame vs. unibody relatively speaking? Second, the 4Runner shows a smaller passenger compartment on paper, but in reality felt larger than the JGC to me; am I wrong or is this a case of 'figures lie and liars figure' with this measurement? Third, I know some have thrown ARB air lockers in the front and rear diffs, but has anyone converted an SR5 to full-time 4WD like the Limited? Lastly, can the fuel economy number of the 4Runner be improved upon in highway driving given the 22mpg of both the 4Runner SR5 (part-time 4wd) and JGC (full-time awd)? Thanks.
Considering 4Runner SR5; JGC Laredo also in mix
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KCcarguy
New member
I also test-drove a JCG laredo. They are nice vehicles, but I couldn't risk buying an American car. I can't explain why the handling is inferior in the SR-5 vs the JGC, but the Jeep is definitely superior. I'm not positive, but I would guess that the ride-height/ ground clearance of the 4runner is higher, and I'm sure the body on frame construction doesn't help either. I also agree that the 4runner seems larger than the GC, especially the cargo area.
It would be much easier and cheaper to buy a limited than to try some sort of conversion in an SR-5 to full-time 4WD.
Finally, as someone who has learned the hard way, let me warn you not to be tempted by the "better deal" you get with American trucks. They may have more luxury and features for the money, but that cost is made up elsewhere. Like I have told others; before buying a Jeep GC, go test-drive a used one with about 100k miles, then drive a 4runner of similar year/ milage. You will understand the difference.
It would be much easier and cheaper to buy a limited than to try some sort of conversion in an SR-5 to full-time 4WD.
Finally, as someone who has learned the hard way, let me warn you not to be tempted by the "better deal" you get with American trucks. They may have more luxury and features for the money, but that cost is made up elsewhere. Like I have told others; before buying a Jeep GC, go test-drive a used one with about 100k miles, then drive a 4runner of similar year/ milage. You will understand the difference.
JayBe
New member
i was in a similar position a few months back. i was considering the 4runner, JGC, explorer and, oddly, a VW tiguan. i drove a but the explorer because no ford dealer on long island had one in stock available for a test drive at the time. firstly, the tiguan was the most fun to drive and best bang for the buck, but just a hair too small for me (6'4" tall). so my choices narrowed down to the JGC and T4R. i read up on both of them and new about the new V6 and the new body-on-frame design of the JGC and figured this would have came out on top....
I. Was. Shocked.
Firstly, as you said with the interior, it was much smaller than the spec sheet lists. not a lot of trunk room and once i positioned the drivers seat where i wanted, there was no leg room in the back seats behind me. People my size fit behind me with no problem in the T4R.
Secondly, i was very disappointed with performance of the JGC. the acceleration lagged in comparison and the ride felt sub-par, even with independent suspension all around. it was a much more harsh ride. The seats were very uncomfortable as well, both the cloth and the leather. the salesman said it was " german engineering, they prefer function over form". whatever... as far as fuel economy goes, i do mostly city driving and im still getting between 16- 16.5 MPG and im not going by the on board computer. i do the math each fill-up. (miles driven/ gallons to fill-up=xx.xMPG) highway im doing close to 22-23 mpg.
Third, and this just may have been the dealer, but i said i wanted remote start and a sunroof. the jeep salesman's response was " the remote start is no problem and we can add a sunroof. we do it all the time". i'm sorry but if im getting a sunroof, i want it from the factory, not some dude with a sawz-all in the shop. also, the road test was a little odd. he gave me the keys and a plate and said see you in a little bit. never rode with me or anything. both my girlfriend and i felt that was a little strange.
anyway, i couldnt be happier with my decision. everyone whos seen the truck has loved it and said they cant believe its a toyota.
I. Was. Shocked.
Firstly, as you said with the interior, it was much smaller than the spec sheet lists. not a lot of trunk room and once i positioned the drivers seat where i wanted, there was no leg room in the back seats behind me. People my size fit behind me with no problem in the T4R.
Secondly, i was very disappointed with performance of the JGC. the acceleration lagged in comparison and the ride felt sub-par, even with independent suspension all around. it was a much more harsh ride. The seats were very uncomfortable as well, both the cloth and the leather. the salesman said it was " german engineering, they prefer function over form". whatever... as far as fuel economy goes, i do mostly city driving and im still getting between 16- 16.5 MPG and im not going by the on board computer. i do the math each fill-up. (miles driven/ gallons to fill-up=xx.xMPG) highway im doing close to 22-23 mpg.
Third, and this just may have been the dealer, but i said i wanted remote start and a sunroof. the jeep salesman's response was " the remote start is no problem and we can add a sunroof. we do it all the time". i'm sorry but if im getting a sunroof, i want it from the factory, not some dude with a sawz-all in the shop. also, the road test was a little odd. he gave me the keys and a plate and said see you in a little bit. never rode with me or anything. both my girlfriend and i felt that was a little strange.
anyway, i couldnt be happier with my decision. everyone whos seen the truck has loved it and said they cant believe its a toyota.
I agree with KC. The 4 runner is built by Japenese guys who take pride in their work and build trucks to last. American trucks are built by guys that are likely drunk/high on the job and could care less about the quality of their work. I used to own a Jeep and it is the last American vehicle I will ever drive.
Just look on the road. How many old Jeeps vs 4 runners do you see? The Jeep may have more options for the money but likely won't last nearly as long as the Toyota. Also, the resale on a Toyota is much better than a Jeep.
In the end it really depends on what you will be happy driving and what fits your needs the best.
Good lick with your new purchase.
Just look on the road. How many old Jeeps vs 4 runners do you see? The Jeep may have more options for the money but likely won't last nearly as long as the Toyota. Also, the resale on a Toyota is much better than a Jeep.
In the end it really depends on what you will be happy driving and what fits your needs the best.
Good lick with your new purchase.
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Jeep has a fully independent rear suspension. That will impact how it rides, especially over uneven roads. That is probably a bigger difference than body on frame vs. unit body construction. Also, I think the GC suspension is tuned more for on road performance. The SR5 has a pretty soft suspension, which while nice off road, isn't as responsive on road. The TE gets nice, thick sway bars if you opt for KDSS which really improves on road handling. In order to maintain good articulation off road, the SR5 is fitted with narrow sway bars.
Personally, I don't mind the SR5 suspension. There is definitely brake dive, but that is only really noticeable if you are stabbing the brakes (and honestly, I'm aware that I'm in a 4600lbs SUV... I don't want to be in a situation where I'm stabbing the brakes anyway). I drive turny, WV mountain roads and the SR5 does just fine as far as handling threshold. It doesn't drive like a sports car, but like I said before, it is an off road capable, 4600lb SUV. No amount of suspension tricks will make it handle like a sports car. That said, suspension is a relatively cheap, easy thing to tune to your liking via the aftermarket.
As far as interior space, I've been really impressed with everything I can fit in my 4Runner. I regularly have 4 adults in mine and I always get comments of how comfortable it is. My one friend has deemed my 4Runner the best road trip vehicle ever thanks to the reclining back seats. We stuff the back of the truck with camping gear all the time and it always fits more than I expect it to.
From what you've posted, it sounds like a Limited would fit your needs best. It has full time 4WD and Xreas (which helps on road handling).
Personally, I don't mind the SR5 suspension. There is definitely brake dive, but that is only really noticeable if you are stabbing the brakes (and honestly, I'm aware that I'm in a 4600lbs SUV... I don't want to be in a situation where I'm stabbing the brakes anyway). I drive turny, WV mountain roads and the SR5 does just fine as far as handling threshold. It doesn't drive like a sports car, but like I said before, it is an off road capable, 4600lb SUV. No amount of suspension tricks will make it handle like a sports car. That said, suspension is a relatively cheap, easy thing to tune to your liking via the aftermarket.
As far as interior space, I've been really impressed with everything I can fit in my 4Runner. I regularly have 4 adults in mine and I always get comments of how comfortable it is. My one friend has deemed my 4Runner the best road trip vehicle ever thanks to the reclining back seats. We stuff the back of the truck with camping gear all the time and it always fits more than I expect it to.
From what you've posted, it sounds like a Limited would fit your needs best. It has full time 4WD and Xreas (which helps on road handling).
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The first time I saw the new 4Runner, I wanted a plain TE, but the dealers around here loaded them up with KDSS and Nav so they were priced the same as a Limited. I don't want KDSS, Nav or leather. I also don't necessarily want a Limited with AWD either, just was asking in case I get a bug up my six to do some modding later on; I grew up in western Michigan 25 miles from Lake Michigan, so I don't feel the need to have the false sense of security most people get from AWD, hell, when winter weather comes I just put on my snow tires on my 2k7 VW GLI and I haven't been stuck yet. I just want a vehicle I can reliably put 200k miles on via on/off-road adventures around this country and the 4Runner SR5 seems to fit the bill the best, but with a few drawbacks.
JayBe
New member
granted its only been a few months, but i absolutely love my SR5. i seriously couldnt be happier. i feel it comes pretty well equipped for being a base model. i dont need all the goodies such as AWD, leather, nav... i like having a beefy lever for my transfer case, i have a garmin gps, i personally like the cloth better. dont get me wrong, leather is nice, just not a necessary. i cant wait to play in the snow with it haha.
TxCJ3Pilot
New member
Trust me, stay AWAY from any Chrysler made junk!
JayBe
New member
Hahaha it's basically a cheaply built Mercedes Benz GL350. dont get me wrong, i enjoyed my wrangler while i had it, it just didnt cut it as a road trip/ future family vehicle. and as i said, the JGC rode like crap. i was shocked at how poorly i rode, especially with the new suspension and unibody design.
Semper4Runner
New member
My previous vehicle was a 2004 JGC Limited.... The only nice thing about it was it's all-time 4WD when the weather got rough, and its 4-low when it got really rough....
HOWEVER, everything else about it was TERRIBLE!!! Air conditioner/Heater went out, payed over $1k to have it fixed, and around the same time within a 2 week span, 3 of the 4 window regulators (little bitty piece of plastic) broke, requiring replacement of the whole mechanical assembly (motor and all) to be replaced at about $300 a piece for parts only. Only reason the 4th window regulator didn't break was because I refused to use that particular window for fear that I'd have to fork out another $300 to fix it. My radio/nav/AC/anything with a blinking light would just go crazy from time to time. ON OFF ON OFF ON OFF HOT COLD HOT COLD HOT COLD ON OFF ON OFF ON OFF!!!! Terrible!
The worst part about this is that I did my research and found that most of the problems I had, especially the AC and the Windows, were VERY common. Not only with that specific year, but across a span of 3 or more generations. They're pawning off this whole "german engineering" bull**** and trying to sell the fact that it's made on a Mercedes chassis.... I'm not buying it.
I love my SR5. Wouldn't trade it for a fully loaded JGC for anything.
HOWEVER, everything else about it was TERRIBLE!!! Air conditioner/Heater went out, payed over $1k to have it fixed, and around the same time within a 2 week span, 3 of the 4 window regulators (little bitty piece of plastic) broke, requiring replacement of the whole mechanical assembly (motor and all) to be replaced at about $300 a piece for parts only. Only reason the 4th window regulator didn't break was because I refused to use that particular window for fear that I'd have to fork out another $300 to fix it. My radio/nav/AC/anything with a blinking light would just go crazy from time to time. ON OFF ON OFF ON OFF HOT COLD HOT COLD HOT COLD ON OFF ON OFF ON OFF!!!! Terrible!
The worst part about this is that I did my research and found that most of the problems I had, especially the AC and the Windows, were VERY common. Not only with that specific year, but across a span of 3 or more generations. They're pawning off this whole "german engineering" bull**** and trying to sell the fact that it's made on a Mercedes chassis.... I'm not buying it.
I love my SR5. Wouldn't trade it for a fully loaded JGC for anything.
KCcarguy
New member
That pretty much settles it. If you plan on long-term ownership, you need a 4runner. A Jeep will not give you reliable service for 100k miles, let alone 200k. $35k is a lot of money, spend it wisely.
robotkiller
New member
Toyota will be around forever, the 4runner should run forever and, in Trail trim at least, will look good forever.
Jeep could conceivably close shop in the next 5-10 years, JGC reliability doesn't inspire confidence for the long run and it's station wagon on roids look will be dated in 5-10 years.
Personally, I'll be happy to own a 4runner til the wheels fall off.
Question: Is there any concern over the electronics in the TE vs the mechanically simpler SR5? I like the mechanical simplicity of the 4 Runner over the JGC (mechanical lever for engaging 4wd and solid axle rear suspension), but like I said above I originally wanted a TE due to the electronic adjustments. I'm trying to be consistent in this evaluation process in order to distill this process to it's essence and make a decision I will not regret later on. Thanks for all of your responses so far.
Question: Why are SR5s and TEs so highly optioned/priced here in Central Indiana versus what I've seen on the forum in other areas of the country (Rockies and Northeast)?
Question: Why are SR5s and TEs so highly optioned/priced here in Central Indiana versus what I've seen on the forum in other areas of the country (Rockies and Northeast)?
I wouldn't be worried about the electronics. Other than KDSS, the different terrain modes, and the electronically actuated locking rear diff, the SR5 and TE are pretty much identical as far as electronics go. The TE still has a shiftable transfer case, just like the SR5. Both have "smart" ABS that is used for ATRAC.
As a recovering '07 GTI owner, I do understand your concern about electronic issues. Mine gave me fits until the day I watched it drive away with the new owner. :lol: My 4Runner is at 19k miles and has been rock solid. Love this truck.
It is always a struggle to find exactly what you want. Talk to your dealer about finding what you want. They can usually watch the port lists to see what is coming in and grab something pretty close to what you want. It took my dealer 3 months to find what I wanted and even then it was missing one option.
03_4x4Runner
Senior Member
The only thing the 4runner has over the Jeep is possibly better reliability. The Jeep has many more options/features for the same price.
If it means ANYTHING, my wife's boss just bought a 2011 jeep wrangler sport and after a wopping 50 miles and before he pulled into his driveway on the way home from signing the paperwork at the dealer the transmission self imploded rendering the jeep useless and undriveable. After FIGHTING with the dealer (they wanted to replace or rebuild the trany), they agreed to give him a new jeep. Could be isolated but............
webby
New member
Yeah, but reliability is like THE biggie. And it also translates into much higher resale, no matter how long you keep the Toyota.
Once you have owned a Toyota, and experienced the extreme reliability that they offer, the bar has been set. Any lesser reliability is just not acceptable anymore. I doubt that I will ever buy anything but a Toyota from here on out. I'm right good spoiled.
TOYSTRY
New member
I own a 2011 T4R but if I didn't own a dog and could do it again I'd buy a 2011 GJC. While Toyota may have a history of longevity (which they do), the GJC for the money has way more toys and luxury features that I'm use to...
Couple things to note:
- The fuel economy isn't that good on the T4R. I haven't had better than 17.8 mpg since I've owned it (15,000 miles). Simply put, the 4.0 V6 in the T4R is lacking in mpg'sand hp for my taste:
- GJC 3.6L V6: 16/23 mpg
- GJC 5.7L V8: 14/20 mpg
- T4R 4.0L V6: 17/23 mpg
- GJC V6: 290hp, 260trq
- GJC V8: 360hp, 390trq
- T4R V6: 270hp, 278trd
- T4R interior feels bigger than the GJC. I was dead set on a GJC until I sat in one. The back seat and cargo area isn't as big (I own a 110 lb dog and couldn't see him fitting comfortably in the back without the rear seats folded down). The flipside to that is the GJC's interior puts the T4R's to shame. Mercedes designed the vehicle before they sold off the company to FIAT so being a previous Mercedes owner, you can see clearly the level of attention put towards the interior. In short, if you've ever owned a luxury vehicle, going to a T4R interior is like taking a step back 10 yrs.
- GJC has a lot of electronic gizmo's that the T4R doesn't so it's inevitable that you will incur more cost in the long run should something go wrong with some of the fancy gadgets the GJC has over the more rustic T4R gizmos. T4R has always been better off-road than a GJC as well.
- T4R's are tried and true throughout the years...........I owned a 1st generation and loved it, wanted a 3rd generation and bought a Tacoma instead but they too were tried and true. Simply put, Toyota's are dependable. The 2011 GJC's haven't been tested for more than a year so it's hard to say. Jeep/Chrysler/Dodge as a whole don't have a great track record over the years but you need to ask yourself this "How long do you plan to keep the vehicle". If 4-6 yrs is the max, I'd say go for the GJC, if 10+ is your goal, I'd say go T4R.
Final note. I've owned 4 Toyota's and 3 Jeep Wranglers/CJ's over the last 20 yrs so I'm partial to both. While it may appear that I'm bashing the vehicle I own I also appreciate the vehicle I own because it serves my needs EXACTLY. If I went the GJC as I originally wanted I would have been a lot more nervous about it because it has all those luxury features that the dog would drool on, scratch and rip. In the end, only you know what you want but if luxury is more important to you then longevity then go GJC, if not, go vice versa.
HTH
Let the flames begin
:flamewar:
Couple things to note:
- The fuel economy isn't that good on the T4R. I haven't had better than 17.8 mpg since I've owned it (15,000 miles). Simply put, the 4.0 V6 in the T4R is lacking in mpg'sand hp for my taste:
- GJC 3.6L V6: 16/23 mpg
- GJC 5.7L V8: 14/20 mpg
- T4R 4.0L V6: 17/23 mpg
- GJC V6: 290hp, 260trq
- GJC V8: 360hp, 390trq
- T4R V6: 270hp, 278trd
- T4R interior feels bigger than the GJC. I was dead set on a GJC until I sat in one. The back seat and cargo area isn't as big (I own a 110 lb dog and couldn't see him fitting comfortably in the back without the rear seats folded down). The flipside to that is the GJC's interior puts the T4R's to shame. Mercedes designed the vehicle before they sold off the company to FIAT so being a previous Mercedes owner, you can see clearly the level of attention put towards the interior. In short, if you've ever owned a luxury vehicle, going to a T4R interior is like taking a step back 10 yrs.
- GJC has a lot of electronic gizmo's that the T4R doesn't so it's inevitable that you will incur more cost in the long run should something go wrong with some of the fancy gadgets the GJC has over the more rustic T4R gizmos. T4R has always been better off-road than a GJC as well.
- T4R's are tried and true throughout the years...........I owned a 1st generation and loved it, wanted a 3rd generation and bought a Tacoma instead but they too were tried and true. Simply put, Toyota's are dependable. The 2011 GJC's haven't been tested for more than a year so it's hard to say. Jeep/Chrysler/Dodge as a whole don't have a great track record over the years but you need to ask yourself this "How long do you plan to keep the vehicle". If 4-6 yrs is the max, I'd say go for the GJC, if 10+ is your goal, I'd say go T4R.
Final note. I've owned 4 Toyota's and 3 Jeep Wranglers/CJ's over the last 20 yrs so I'm partial to both. While it may appear that I'm bashing the vehicle I own I also appreciate the vehicle I own because it serves my needs EXACTLY. If I went the GJC as I originally wanted I would have been a lot more nervous about it because it has all those luxury features that the dog would drool on, scratch and rip. In the end, only you know what you want but if luxury is more important to you then longevity then go GJC, if not, go vice versa.
HTH
Let the flames begin
:flamewar:
JayBe
New member
TOYSTRY, have you driven the new GJC? I know the Pentastar V6 puts out 290HP/ 260LBS-TQ vs. the 270/278 of the T4R. But after driving both back to back, i can honestly say, you'd think it was the other way around. The Toyo accelerated quicker and was able to down shift to pass much quicker than the Jeep. The two dealers are right down the road from each other so i was able to take them both Jeep just feel nearly as smooth as the Toyo. Believe me, I'm not a Toyota fan-boy. I've never owned a toyota before this and never imagined myself buying one but I honestly couldnt be happier.
Now, I'm going to bed b/c im taking Felix on his first road trip to Hershey park in the morning. Night everyone
Now, I'm going to bed b/c im taking Felix on his first road trip to Hershey park in the morning. Night everyone
Balcs1
New member
I also narrowed it down to the same Two
You can over examine it all you want like I did. I can explain my perspective of the two vehicles for you...Do you want an suv that handles pavement Nicely on day to day driving, Blends in Perfectly with all the other cross overs and minivans that all business men and the Soccer Moms are driving? You might?? The jeep looks like all the others, it's not a bad thing, the interior is almost to nice to get dirty, Seriously. or Do you want to Have a RIG that looks like no Other SUV copes with the pavement reasonably is totally reliable, handles the offroad Awesome and has decent aftermarket out there to customise it now, vs. waiting another year or two? I chose the TE 4Runner because I wanted a (RIG), and the Jeep came in second for me because it's UniBody and being too modern and classy for what I want in my Arsenel a vehicles. You may want the class, I wanted longevity in a Toyota because I plan on Keeping it for Years maybe give it to one of my kids and use it offroad while Hunting deep in the Bush, If I get it dirty or mud out the interior I will just clean it up. Oh well. If I had the Plush ass Jeep I would probably not want to hammer it inside and out because I would feel like I am in a Mercedes Benz Sedan/Wagon and wouldn't want to Scratch it. Too Plush, No Thanks! Maybe for my Wife and Kids...I have 10k on my 5th and feel like I made the right choice for what I wanted. I am referring to the TE not the Limited or the SR5. I had some really Bad Stock Dunlop tires though, I am not sure what Jeeps come with. Ace the Tires and you are good to go.
I own a 2011 T4R but if I didn't own a dog and could do it again I'd buy a 2011 GJC. While Toyota may have a history of longevity (which they do), the GJC for the money has way more toys and luxury features that I'm use to...
Couple things to note:
- The fuel economy isn't that good on the T4R. I haven't had better than 17.8 mpg since I've owned it (15,000 miles). Simply put, the 4.0 V6 in the T4R is lacking in mpg'sand hp for my taste:
- GJC 3.6L V6: 16/23 mpg
- GJC 5.7L V8: 14/20 mpg
- T4R 4.0L V6: 17/23 mpg
- GJC V6: 290hp, 260trq
- GJC V8: 360hp, 390trq
- T4R V6: 270hp, 278trd
- T4R interior feels bigger than the GJC. I was dead set on a GJC until I sat in one. The back seat and cargo area isn't as big (I own a 110 lb dog and couldn't see him fitting comfortably in the back without the rear seats folded down). The flipside to that is the GJC's interior puts the T4R's to shame. Mercedes designed the vehicle before they sold off the company to FIAT so being a previous Mercedes owner, you can see clearly the level of attention put towards the interior. In short, if you've ever owned a luxury vehicle, going to a T4R interior is like taking a step back 10 yrs.
- GJC has a lot of electronic gizmo's that the T4R doesn't so it's inevitable that you will incur more cost in the long run should something go wrong with some of the fancy gadgets the GJC has over the more rustic T4R gizmos. T4R has always been better off-road than a GJC as well.
- T4R's are tried and true throughout the years...........I owned a 1st generation and loved it, wanted a 3rd generation and bought a Tacoma instead but they too were tried and true. Simply put, Toyota's are dependable. The 2011 GJC's haven't been tested for more than a year so it's hard to say. Jeep/Chrysler/Dodge as a whole don't have a great track record over the years but you need to ask yourself this "How long do you plan to keep the vehicle". If 4-6 yrs is the max, I'd say go for the GJC, if 10+ is your goal, I'd say go T4R.
Final note. I've owned 4 Toyota's and 3 Jeep Wranglers/CJ's over the last 20 yrs so I'm partial to both. While it may appear that I'm bashing the vehicle I own I also appreciate the vehicle I own because it serves my needs EXACTLY. If I went the GJC as I originally wanted I would have been a lot more nervous about it because it has all those luxury features that the dog would drool on, scratch and rip. In the end, only you know what you want but if luxury is more important to you then longevity then go GJC, if not, go vice versa.
HTH
Let the flames begin
:flamewar:
You can over examine it all you want like I did. I can explain my perspective of the two vehicles for you...Do you want an suv that handles pavement Nicely on day to day driving, Blends in Perfectly with all the other cross overs and minivans that all business men and the Soccer Moms are driving? You might?? The jeep looks like all the others, it's not a bad thing, the interior is almost to nice to get dirty, Seriously. or Do you want to Have a RIG that looks like no Other SUV copes with the pavement reasonably is totally reliable, handles the offroad Awesome and has decent aftermarket out there to customise it now, vs. waiting another year or two? I chose the TE 4Runner because I wanted a (RIG), and the Jeep came in second for me because it's UniBody and being too modern and classy for what I want in my Arsenel a vehicles. You may want the class, I wanted longevity in a Toyota because I plan on Keeping it for Years maybe give it to one of my kids and use it offroad while Hunting deep in the Bush, If I get it dirty or mud out the interior I will just clean it up. Oh well. If I had the Plush ass Jeep I would probably not want to hammer it inside and out because I would feel like I am in a Mercedes Benz Sedan/Wagon and wouldn't want to Scratch it. Too Plush, No Thanks! Maybe for my Wife and Kids...I have 10k on my 5th and feel like I made the right choice for what I wanted. I am referring to the TE not the Limited or the SR5. I had some really Bad Stock Dunlop tires though, I am not sure what Jeeps come with. Ace the Tires and you are good to go.
