Considering Trading-In the 4Runner

W

wilsoncwil

New member
I love my 4Runner and was planning on keeping it for awhile but I discovered a couple of things over the weekend that are making me seriously think about trading it in.

Saw a commercial for the 2007 Camry, it said it will have 268 hp!!! WTF?? A grandma car like the Camry and the feminine RAV4 will have more hp than most of our man-ly 4Runners!!!

Then while parked next to my friend's new 2006 Pathfinder my 4Runner looked like a midget next to it. Afterwards I challenged my friend to a race and even though I was able to beat him off the line he was still able to keep up with me and his is only a V6! If the Pathfinder didn't have that ugly rear window I would probably get it.

My first choice for a replacement would be a GX but even that is way under-powered compared to its competition. I will never purchase an American SUV so I guess by the process of elimination leaves me with the BMW X5 4.4L (probably have to pull some equity out of my house to be able to afford it).
 
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Well here's my cynical opinions....

The new Pathfinder is a giant, featureless box, bigger than the 4runner for sure but frankly that's why I didn't buy one. Oh, and the fact that it's butt-ugly. But I do agree that the Pathfinder's V6 is a great engine. Shame about the rest of the truck.

And as for engine size... read more closely. Take the Rav4... 269HP V6, but that 269HP is at 6200 RPM (which is probably redline territory and unattainable with the tranny) and the torque is lower than the 4runner. The V6 4Runner is 245HP @ 5200RPM and 282lb of torque at 3400 RPM (vs 246lb @ 4200 RPM for the Rav4). The torque on the V8 4Runner is even more impressive. Torque is more useful than engine-revving horsepower.

And as for the Camry... it's a sedan, so of course it'll be faster than any truck. Most sedans are. The Rav4 will probably be a bit faster too, but only because it's so small and light. But if I wanted raw speed I'd probably buy a sports car, not a wannabe toy SUV.

OK, opinionated rant over!
 
I sat in a Pathfinder when I went to the NY Auto Show and I was anything but impressed. The interior is nowhere near the quality of Toyota's and the exterior is ugly. After sitting in the Pathfinder, I realized how much I loved my 4Runner! I also saw the RAV4 and Camry there and I was impressed with both. I like the new designs of both but I would not even think of giving up my 4Runner for them! I will definitely take the new V6 RAV4 and Camry out for a spin the next time my truck is in for service though. :p
 
What the original poster needs to realize is that in the automotive industry the name of the game is one-ups-man-ship.
Some manufacturers seem to think that bigger physical size or more horsepower is what sells vehicles. For some of the vehicle buying public that is what keeps them coming back for more. For others, bigger is not necessarily better or even attractive.

Others in this thread have done a good job of illustrating that the important measurement of an engine is not just horsepower but torque and where in the RPM curve max torque is achieved. Personally, my V8s 235hp is more than adequate for my needs. Some people I know brag about the 310hp their V8s are rated at. Funny part of it is, their V8s have less torque and at a higher (less useful) RPM. Less torque, the poorer low end performance and the fact that they get 2-3mpg less than my 4Runner keeps me smiling when they start their HP bragging.

BTW, if the OP feels the need to trade the 4Runner in for more power he should be real sure he is actually getting more power. Also, it might be a good idea to start leasing your vehicles if you don't already do so. That way in a year or two when you get the itch for more horsepower you can scratch that itch and not take a financial bath on a trade in.
 
wilsoncwil said:

Then while parked next to my friend's new 2006 Pathfinder my 4Runner looked like a midget next to it. Afterwards I challenged my friend to a race and even though I was able to beat him off the line he was still able to keep up with me and his is only a V6! If the Pathfinder didn't have that ugly rear window I would probably get it.
Click to expand...

4Runner is longer and wider. Pathfinder it 2" taller, longer wheel base. But the Pathfinder is a pretty square looking design. I don't like the IRS.

Are you both 2WD? I don't care if it is faster. The V8 has tq down low for normal driving, and for towing. My engine may see +3k rpm once a week.
 
Re: Re: Considering Trading-In the 4Runner

Bluto said:
My engine may see +3k rpm once a week.
Click to expand...

That must really help your mileage. I pass too many cars on my way to work in the morning to keep the rpms down. Of course, I only have a V6.
 
I wouldn't suggest an X5. I have been in one and its not as nice as eveyone makes it seem. The ride is not as soft as my v8 limited. and the pick-up is about the same. For the extra that youll be paying I say just get a v8 limited or the gx. My mom has a rx300 and even that is not as nice as the 4runner. Just my 2cents.
 
wilsoncwil said:
I love my 4Runner and was planning on keeping it for awhile but I discovered a couple of things over the weekend that are making me seriously think about trading it in.

Saw a commercial for the 2007 Camry, it said it will have 268 hp!!! WTF?? A grandma car like the Camry and the feminine RAV4 will have more hp than most of our man-ly 4Runners!!!

Then while parked next to my friend's new 2006 Pathfinder my 4Runner looked like a midget next to it. Afterwards I challenged my friend to a race and even though I was able to beat him off the line he was still able to keep up with me and his is only a V6! If the Pathfinder didn't have that ugly rear window I would probably get it.

My first choice for a replacement would be a GX but even that is way under-powered compared to its competition. I will never purchase an American SUV so I guess by the process of elimination leaves me with the BMW X5 4.4L (probably have to pull some equity out of my house to be able to afford it).
Click to expand...
OK, OK, take a deep breath. There are plenty of things you need to realize here. First of all, you're worried about a Pathfinder. Its in its first year build which means it will have its fair share of problems. It looks like a minivan on steroids and the interior is far from that of the 4Runner. Have you driven your friends, or any Pathfinder? I haven't either, but here's what I've heard: The ride quality suffers compared to the 4Runner, the build is poor with large gaps in body panels, the engine is very loud inside the cabin, among other cheap Nissan related issues. Secondly, as far as racing him, sure he may be able to keep up, the 0-60 times are only a couple tenths apart but you still beat him, right!?!? Throw 5 people and some cargo and/or strap a 4000 lb trailer on the back and race again and see who wins and by how many car lengths. Keep in mind too, that his power isn't easily accessible. If he's driving up a hill and wants to gain speed his truck will probably need to downshift, where the 4Runner with the torquey V8 can just pull from any rpm. If being the fastest stock SUV for under $30k isn't enough there are some cheap and simple modifications you can do to increase power and torque and reduce your 0-60 times; Cat Back exhaust, Intake and tuning the ECU's air/fuel ratio for better performance to name a few. Additionally, you can add headers, or even a supercharger to give you more power and waste his gay Pathfinder. If you are worried about his truck looking bigger than yours throw a lift kit and some bigger tires on, then take him off-road and wheel him all over the place. All of these mods can be done for less than the incremental cost you'd see by trading in for an X5 4.4i.

Like someone said earlier, the V6 in the Camry and RAV 4 is a fantastic engine (same one that is in the IS 350). But yes, this power and torque is generally unattainable and useless unless you plan on driving at redline all day long. Don't kid yourself, the 4.7L VVT-i V8 is a more powerful engine.

If you do decide to trade in make sure you thoroughly test drive and research any other candidates as the 4Runner is by far the best SUV under $40k. If you are looking for more power, the only place to go is to the Heep Hemi 5.7L, which is a gas muncher and not even proven to be faster than the 4Runner (meaning, I or anyone else on this forum hasn't raced one or reported it) Here are some other foreign options for performance SUV's (if that is what you are interested in):

Audi Q7 V8 (Not out yet, $$$)
BMW X5 4.4i ($$$, maintainence whore, slightly faster than 4Runner)
Honda Pilot (Slow, car frame unibody)
Infinity FX45 ($$$, fast, more of a tall car than a SUV)
Land Rover LR5 ($$$, Slow, Note: Land Rover is owned by Ford)
Range Rover Sport Supercharged ($$$$$, 400 HP and same 0-60 as 4Runner haha suckers!!)
Lexus GX470 (slightly slower than the 4Runners, $$, nice and capable off-road)
Mercedes Benz ML 500 ($$$, slightly faster than 4Runner)
Porsche Cayenne (V6 is slow, V8 S is slightly faster than 4Runner but expensive, Twin Turbo is super-fast and super-expensive)
Saab SUV (dressed up trailblazer, V8 version is slower than 4Runner)
Volvo XC90 V8 (slightly faster than 4Runner, $$)
VW Touraeg (V8 is slower than 4Runner, $$$)

So basically if you want more performance out of an SUV you're going to have to jump into the luxo-SUV category, which isn't going to be cheap. The 4Runner is one of the best performing SUV's out there for the money.

Do yourself a favor and keep the 4Runner and mod it up.
 
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Re: Re: Considering Trading-In the 4Runner

OUTRNNR said:
OK, OK, take a deep breath. There are plenty of things you need to realize here. First of all, you're worried about a Pathfinder. Its in its first year build which means it will have its fair share of problems. It looks like a minivan on steroids and the interior is far from that of the 4Runner. Have you driven your friends, or any Pathfinder? I haven't either, but here's what I've heard: The ride quality suffers compared to the 4Runner, the build is poor with large gaps in body panels, the engine is very loud inside the cabin, among other cheap Nissan related issues. Secondly, as far as racing him, sure he may be able to keep up, the 0-60 times are only a couple tenths apart but you still beat him, right!?!? Throw 5 people and some cargo and/or strap a 4000 lb trailer on the back and race again and see who wins and by how many car lengths. Keep in mind too, that his power isn't easily accessible. If he's driving up a hill and wants to gain speed his truck will probably need to downshift, where the 4Runner with the torquey V8 can just pull from any rpm. If being the fastest stock SUV for under $30k isn't enough there are some cheap and simple modifications you can do to increase power and torque and reduce your 0-60 times; Cat Back exhaust, Intake and tuning the ECU's air/fuel ratio for better performance to name a few. Additionally, you can add headers, or even a supercharger to give you more power and waste his gay Pathfinder. If you are worried about his truck looking bigger than yours throw a lift kit and some bigger tires on, then take him off-road and wheel him all over the place. All of these mods can be done for less than the incremental cost you'd see by trading in for an X5 4.4i.

Like someone said earlier, the V6 in the Camry and RAV 4 is a fantastic engine (same one that is in the IS 350). But yes, this power and torque is generally unattainable and useless unless you plan on driving at redline all day long. Don't kid yourself, the 4.7L VVT-i V8 is a more powerful engine.

If you do decide to trade in make sure you thoroughly test drive and research any other candidates as the 4Runner is by far the best SUV under $40k. If you are looking for more power, the only place to go is to the Heep Hemi 5.7L, which is a gas muncher and not even proven to be faster than the 4Runner (meaning, I or anyone else on this forum hasn't raced one or reported it) Here are some other foreign options for performance SUV's (if that is what you are interested in):

Audi Q7 V8 (Not out yet, $$$)
BMW X5 4.4i ($$$, maintainence whore, slightly faster than 4Runner)
Honda Pilot (Slow, car frame unibody)
Infinity FX45 ($$$, fast, more of a tall car than a SUV)
Land Rover LR5 ($$$, Slow, Note: Land Rover is owned by Ford)
Range Rover Sport Supercharged ($$$$$, 400 HP and same 0-60 as 4Runner haha suckers!!)
Lexus GX470 (slightly slower than the 4Runners, $$, nice and capable off-road)
Mercedes Benz ML 500 ($$$, slightly faster than 4Runner)
Porsche Cayenne (V6 is slow, V8 S is slightly faster than 4Runner but expensive, Twin Turbo is super-fast and super-expensive)
Saab SUV (dressed up trailblazer, V8 version is slower than 4Runner)
VW Touraeg (V8 is slower than 4Runner, $$$)

So basically if you want more performance out of an SUV you're going to have to jump into the luxo-SUV category, which isn't going to be cheap. The 4Runner is one of the best performing SUV's out there for the money.

Do yourself a favor and keep the 4Runner and mod it up.
Click to expand...






VERY WELL SAID!!!!!
 
I made the mistake of assuming I'd be happy with a smaller car with superior HP once. I was in a post Katrina gas panic and I traded my 4.7 V8 230 HP Grand Cherokee for a 250 HP 6 cyl. Outback. Despite being smaller and lighter than the GC, the Outback just couldn't keep up with my driving style and after 3 months I traded it for the 4Runner. I found that a torquey V8 is much more important to a satisfying driving experience than any amount of HP.
 
The advertised Max HP and max TQ are not necessarily an indicator what is faster.

Unless you can have an INTEGRATION of the power band (either HP or Torque -since they mean the same after integration), you can not really tell who is faster being both similar weight.

Vvt technology greatest increment is not the max HP but the total increment in the power band (read fat curve).
 
I'll take those Revo's off your hands before you trade her in. Also, if you do go that route, sell it private party, you'll get more money, which coincidentally is the main reason for buying my Runner, more bang for the buck and higher resale instead of a POS [choose all that apply: Nissan, GMC, Chevy, Volvo, Ford, Dodge, Whatever] SUV in the same price range.

There's forums for all those other trucks too; just Google "lemon law."
 
Re: Re: Considering Trading-In the 4Runner

OUTRNNR said:
OK, OK, take a deep breath. There are plenty of things you need to realize here. First of all, you're worried about a Pathfinder. Its in its first year build which means it will have its fair share of problems. It looks like a minivan on steroids and the interior is far from that of the 4Runner. Have you driven your friends, or any Pathfinder? I haven't either, but here's what I've heard: The ride quality suffers compared to the 4Runner, the build is poor with large gaps in body panels, the engine is very loud inside the cabin, among other cheap Nissan related issues. Secondly, as far as racing him, sure he may be able to keep up, the 0-60 times are only a couple tenths apart but you still beat him, right!?!? Throw 5 people and some cargo and/or strap a 4000 lb trailer on the back and race again and see who wins and by how many car lengths. Keep in mind too, that his power isn't easily accessible. If he's driving up a hill and wants to gain speed his truck will probably need to downshift, where the 4Runner with the torquey V8 can just pull from any rpm. If being the fastest stock SUV for under $30k isn't enough there are some cheap and simple modifications you can do to increase power and torque and reduce your 0-60 times; Cat Back exhaust, Intake and tuning the ECU's air/fuel ratio for better performance to name a few. Additionally, you can add headers, or even a supercharger to give you more power and waste his gay Pathfinder. If you are worried about his truck looking bigger than yours throw a lift kit and some bigger tires on, then take him off-road and wheel him all over the place. All of these mods can be done for less than the incremental cost you'd see by trading in for an X5 4.4i.

Like someone said earlier, the V6 in the Camry and RAV 4 is a fantastic engine (same one that is in the IS 350). But yes, this power and torque is generally unattainable and useless unless you plan on driving at redline all day long. Don't kid yourself, the 4.7L VVT-i V8 is a more powerful engine.

If you do decide to trade in make sure you thoroughly test drive and research any other candidates as the 4Runner is by far the best SUV under $40k. If you are looking for more power, the only place to go is to the Heep Hemi 5.7L, which is a gas muncher and not even proven to be faster than the 4Runner (meaning, I or anyone else on this forum hasn't raced one or reported it) Here are some other foreign options for performance SUV's (if that is what you are interested in):

Audi Q7 V8 (Not out yet, $$$)
BMW X5 4.4i ($$$, maintainence whore, slightly faster than 4Runner)
Honda Pilot (Slow, car frame unibody)
Infinity FX45 ($$$, fast, more of a tall car than a SUV)
Land Rover LR5 ($$$, Slow, Note: Land Rover is owned by Ford)
Range Rover Sport Supercharged ($$$$$, 400 HP and same 0-60 as 4Runner haha suckers!!)
Lexus GX470 (slightly slower than the 4Runners, $$, nice and capable off-road)
Mercedes Benz ML 500 ($$$, slightly faster than 4Runner)
Porsche Cayenne (V6 is slow, V8 S is slightly faster than 4Runner but expensive, Twin Turbo is super-fast and super-expensive)
Saab SUV (dressed up trailblazer, V8 version is slower than 4Runner)
VW Touraeg (V8 is slower than 4Runner, $$$)

So basically if you want more performance out of an SUV you're going to have to jump into the luxo-SUV category, which isn't going to be cheap. The 4Runner is one of the best performing SUV's out there for the money.

Do yourself a favor and keep the 4Runner and mod it up.
Click to expand...

Well put!!!!! That is a perfect summary of all of the other SUV's. My parents had a 2003 V8 X5 and my 2003 4Runner Sport had absolutely no problem keeping up with it. Honestly, my parents owned a total of 4 X5's and not one of them only went into the shop for routine maintenance. Every other weeks, a new problem would arise. The X5 is an overrated vehicle. If you want more luxury, definitely go with a Lexus SUV. If you want more speed, go with an FX45.
 
Your 4Runner seemed small next to the Pathfinder? Are you talking about the Pathfinder Armada?

The Pathfinder is smaller than a 4Runner. One of my friends has one and it looks smaller than my 4Runner when they are side-by-side. If I looked up the stats, I'd bet the Pathfinder has smaller exterior dimensions compared to the 4Runner.
 
Thanks to everyone for their detailed explanation of why hp is overrated, you have eased my concerns and I think I will keep it for the long run. You guys saved me lots of $$$!!! If it weren't for this forum I probably would have gone forward and traded it in.

Yes, the regular Pathfinder is an ugly box, I wasn't thinking when I said I would get one over the 4Runner.
 
wilsoncwil said:
Thanks to everyone for their detailed explanation of why hp is overrated, you have eased my concerns and I think I will keep it for the long run. You guys saved me lots of $$$!!! If it weren't for this forum I probably would have gone forward and traded it in.

Yes, the regular Pathfinder is an ugly box, I wasn't thinking when I said I would get one over the 4Runner.
Click to expand...
Whew, that was a close one...:dancin:
 
i sensed a disturbance in the force...i am glad young wilsoncwil didn't cross over to the dark side. there is still hope for you young jedi.
 
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