Did I get a lemon?

[jmferg]

Two months I got a 2001 1-owner Cali truck with 136,000.
I read all the 3rd gen buyers guides and looked this thing over with a fine tooth comb. Drove and ran smoother than my wife's 15' Malibu.
Bought it, left the dealer and the check engine/vsc off/trac lights all came on.
In the last 3,800 miles I've driven it, I've had to following items have failed.
Intake gaskets, water pump, radiator, front brakes.
Now it idles terribly, leaks oil, and the steering "sticks" and will pull you off the road. The dealer won't do anything despite the fact it came with a 6 month/6,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty
I keep seeing everyone say how great these rigs are with a little maintenance, but it won't be long before I am putting a $1 of maintenance for every mile I've driven it. Is this just me or have I just found the sweet spot of failures for these vehicles.




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[johnbyebye]

There are bad batches with every vehicle unfortunately. Sorry to hear you're having trouble with yours.

How well did the previous owner take care of it?

 

[jgue467]

While that does sound like the End of the world, it really isn't.

Did you mean intake gaskets or valve cover gaskets? The latter fail on nearly everyone of these 3.4s. Water pump may not have been changed when timing belt was or was the belt even changed? The radiator is nearly 17 years old, do you Really expect it to keep going much longer? The brakes are Normal wear items, again we have to expect them to wear out and need repairs.

Yours may just need a little TLC along with a minor tune-up for the idle issues and having the power steering flushed for the sticking issue, that worked for mine.

Again, yeah maybe a little 'lemony' but all in all still a good rig. Luck and enjoy the Holidays. :cowboy:

 

[JRZEE2000TR4LTD]

Two months I got a 2001 1-owner Cali truck with 136,000.
I read all the 3rd gen buyers guides and looked this thing over with a fine tooth comb. Drove and ran smoother than my wife's 15' Malibu.
Bought it, left the dealer and the check engine/vsc off/trac lights all came on.
In the last 3,800 miles I've driven it, I've had to following items have failed.
Intake gaskets, water pump, radiator, front brakes.
Now it idles terribly, leaks oil, and the steering "sticks" and will pull you off the road. The dealer won't do anything despite the fact it came with a 6 month/6,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty
I keep seeing everyone say how great these rigs are with a little maintenance, but it won't be long before I am putting a $1 of maintenance for every mile I've driven it. Is this just me or have I just found the sweet spot of failures for these vehicles.




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Well I'm confused. You have a warranty and also it's only been 2 months since you bought it from a dealer. Why are you paying for all these things that should be covered under the warranty? The things you mentioned sound like the result of a bad repair jobs (oil leaks, bad idle) The truck wasn't doing these things when you bought it right? Sounds to me like your dealer needs to take a more active role in the repair of your truck.

 

[shahsmerdis]

if it came with warranty, and they are not honoring get on them.

But all those things you quoted are pretty easy to do. Hows the water pump bad? did you ask when the water pump was last changed? Bad brakes, they don't magically go, they were bad when you got them, or at least border line.

Sounds like you didnt do all your homework here... you should expect every used car to require a little bit of repairs because who ever is selling it doesn't want to make those repairs. you can't take shit from the dealer, read the fine print of the warranty and call them out on it.

on the brightside, but all those repairs aren't actually too costly. there are plenty of DIY guides on how to do it yourself. I bet your valve cover gaskets are sealing too. Probably you need to do a full tune up (Tbelt, water pump, valve cover gaskets, spark plugs, radiator. might as well service all the brakes too. peace of mind replace it all. especially if you are in the rust states. If you do it yourself, It should be ~1k-1500

Did you check for rust?

edit: also check for pink milkshake, and full all your fluids. when you do your valve covers you will see if the engine is sluged or not. if its not sluged chances are you have plenty left of life left.

 

[LittleCaesar]

Lawyer up if you need to, before time runs out.

When cars and trucks hit fifteen years they are going to need some TLC sooner than later, no matter the lore and legacy they may carry. Things fail, and they need to be repaired. Most members here are good with a wrench and perform many DIY repairs to offset the labor charges they would pay someone else to do the work. If that isn't your cup of tea, buy something newer and take on a car payment if need be.

 

[Scramble]

Two months I got a 2001 1-owner Cali truck with 136,000.
I read all the 3rd gen buyers guides and looked this thing over with a fine tooth comb. Drove and ran smoother than my wife's 15' Malibu.
Bought it, left the dealer and the check engine/vsc off/trac lights all came on.
In the last 3,800 miles I've driven it, I've had to following items have failed.
Intake gaskets, water pump, radiator, front brakes.
Now it idles terribly, leaks oil, and the steering "sticks" and will pull you off the road. The dealer won't do anything despite the fact it came with a 6 month/6,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty
I keep seeing everyone say how great these rigs are with a little maintenance, but it won't be long before I am putting a $1 of maintenance for every mile I've driven it. Is this just me or have I just found the sweet spot of failures for these vehicles.




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Obviously the PO owner didn't love the truck the way we do on here. Any vehicle is going to have problems if the maintenance wasn't kept up on.
The PO got sick of all the little things going wrong & instead of fixing them he traded it in for another vehicle. It got auctioned off to a used car lot & you bought it. Get the dealer to honor the warranty or break all of their fvckin' windows. :ak472:

 

[jmferg]

I won't reply to everyone but will try to cover everything.
Yes, I meant valve cover gaskets.

Previous owner just had generic service records such as fluid changes, alignments, details,

The warranty will cover any wear item except for brakes and physical damage. It is through a third party company, not the dealer-but advertised and handled through the dealer. Their rep denied the repair to radiator because he claimed the damage was from a rock. I paid the dealer for a timing belt change and they said said the water pump was shot- they reported it to the company and since that was discovered during another repair, (it was the initial failure) it didn't qualify.
And yes, I know about all the common problem. Oem thin front brakes, pink milkshake, leaky valve cover gaskets, Lower ball joints, rusty undercarriage etc.
I have Toyota lower BJs to go on, B&M trans cooler and Toyota filter
Undercarriage is spotless and I just undercoated it. I checked for evidence of valve cover leak at the dealer thinking they may have just pressure washed it. There was no heat staining on the cylinder heads or exhaust manifolds. I test drove it for over 70 miles hoping over that distance, any potential CEL they cleared would show itself- didn't until I purchased it ironically.
I tried varies stop distances with my hands off the wheel and zero noise, pulsing, or pulling of the wheel. Two weeks later a caliper locked up.

I think I'm just having a bad run a luck

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[johnbyebye]

Man that's frustrating. Buying used vehicles is just one of those things. It sounds like you're taking a much more active role in the care of it though so once you get over this hump I think you'll feel better about the whole thing. For me it's like it comes in waves. Suddenly I'll have to fix a lot of things here and there but then it's quiet for a while.

And if it makes you feel any better, I went over mine with a fine toothed comb as well but somehow missed a transmission issue so it needs to be rebuilt. I feel stupid about it but I quite like my 4runner so it is worth fixing to me.

 

[Beaumont67]

Two months I got a 2001 1-owner Cali truck with 136,000.
I read all the 3rd gen buyers guides and looked this thing over with a fine tooth comb. Drove and ran smoother than my wife's 15' Malibu.
Bought it, left the dealer and the check engine/vsc off/trac lights all came on.
In the last 3,800 miles I've driven it, I've had to following items have failed.
Intake gaskets, water pump, radiator, front brakes.
Now it idles terribly, leaks oil, and the steering "sticks" and will pull you off the road. The dealer won't do anything despite the fact it came with a 6 month/6,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty

I keep seeing everyone say how great these rigs are with a little maintenance, but it won't be long before I am putting a $1 of maintenance for every mile I've driven it. Is this just me or have I just found the sweet spot of failures for these vehicles.

Look very clean ^^ worth the effort / zero rust to deal with, is a huge plus.

Sorry - one can't lack any due diligence, especially buying from a used car dealer.

Prior to purchase, any used vehicle:
3 general areas of inspection, that should be additionally sought out / in used vehicle market:
1) Hire out or use a code reader yourself / often error codes are erased, and will reappear 25-50 miles down the road. Hiding bad O2 sensors, is one - reader will show # times error cleared / I learned this lesson once, an $800 e-test fail (20 years ago).
2) Rust and structural integrity should be checked, on a hoist.
- some Southern dealers buy cheap Northern vehicles, to flip
3) Take SUV to a good mechanic to get really checked over.
- check Mechanics from a compression test, transmission condition, expensive oil leaks identified, to worn out brakes & steering components

Due diligence is defined as the care a reasonable person should take before entering into an agreement or a transaction with another party.
- factor in a 15 y/o used vehicle purchase with unknown maintenance from a used car crook
- is sometimes a recipe for trouble

PS - my very clean (verfied 1 senior owner) 2000 SR5 4x4, is one of the best used vehicles I've ever purchased.
- one of my best friends, owns a repair garage & has a used car lot
- his work is very honest
- he did the LBJ, new 4 wheel brakes & fixed rear end oil leak & axle bearings
$2,000 retail value, all before the ownership was changed.
- owned for a full year / most reliable, with 84,000 original miles

 

[shahsmerdis]

you didnt buy a lemon you bought a used car.

expect a few things to be wrong with it, that is fine, you use those things to bring the price down. its only a problem if you pay the car thinking XYZ is good.

if you got a sized caliper you might as well change both sides, flush the fluid and change the rotor and pads. and get brand new hardware. maybe even new brake hoses, after 20 years its about time for replacements

it already looks pretty good rust wise

just need a alittle TLC. As long as there was no pink milk shake, (if it looks like stock radiator, and fluid looks dirty then it probably never had it) If it was aftermarket and fluid looks brand new then you should be worried.

but overall, if the engine isnt sluged you should get at least 50k-100k miles before having to worry about little more things

 

[19963.4lsr5]

When I look at a used vehicle I first check the fluids. Is engine oil low, does radiator have coolant up to the bottom of the cap and what condition does it look like. Then I check the readiness monitors with my scanner. If there all set I will continue.

If readiness monitors are not set I'll ask questions to try and figure out why the battery was unhooked (new battery installed?) or codes reset. But usually if all three fail I walk without a test drive.


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[duke808]

I feel your pain. I picked mine up 6 months ago for $3500 (95k mi, 2000) and since then I have put nearly 3 grand into it. All new suspension, water pump, tstat, timing belt, lower control arm, 2 other belts, new driveshaft/Ujoint, lower ball joints, transmission flush, idle valve cleaning.

NOW it runs good. It's almost 17 years old. Still beats a new $35k loan!

I agree with the others. Get the dealer to honor the warranty. Or... like someone above suggested, grab yourself a lawyer.

 

[JRZEE2000TR4LTD]

I won't reply to everyone but will try to cover everything.
Yes, I meant valve cover gaskets.

Previous owner just had generic service records such as fluid changes, alignments, details,

The warranty will cover any wear item except for brakes and physical damage. It is through a third party company, not the dealer-but advertised and handled through the dealer. Their rep denied the repair to radiator because he claimed the damage was from a rock. I paid the dealer for a timing belt change and they said said the water pump was shot- they reported it to the company and since that was discovered during another repair, (it was the initial failure) it didn't qualify.
And yes, I know about all the common problem. Oem thin front brakes, pink milkshake, leaky valve cover gaskets, Lower ball joints, rusty undercarriage etc.
I have Toyota lower BJs to go on, B&M trans cooler and Toyota filter
Undercarriage is spotless and I just undercoated it. I checked for evidence of valve cover leak at the dealer thinking they may have just pressure washed it. There was no heat staining on the cylinder heads or exhaust manifolds. I test drove it for over 70 miles hoping over that distance, any potential CEL they cleared would show itself- didn't until I purchased it ironically.
I tried varies stop distances with my hands off the wheel and zero noise, pulsing, or pulling of the wheel. Two weeks later a caliper locked up.

I think I'm just having a bad run a luck



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So the radiator was rock damage. Ok.
I don't understand the "initial failure", but I'm not the smartest guy. Weird because it's pretty much standard to do the WP with the TB so if you agreed to pay for the TB I would hope that you would have wanted them to do the WP also.

When and why were the intake gaskets done? Upper or lower? Reason being is the uppers are done during the VC gaskets. This should have been covered under the warranty right? I would think the VC gaskets would be covered too.

EDIT: I just realized you meant VC gaskets in the OP. But I still think that should have been covered under the warranty.

I had the same exact issue with my brake caliper right after I bought it. Also covered under the warranty right? What does "thin" OEM pads mean?

What was the cause of the CEL?

Sorry for all the questions. Just trying to sort it all out and understand what's happening. I hate to say it but your probably going to have to address a few more things before it's all said and done. I would take the rear drums off and look for wetness/ "greasiness" in there. That's definitely a repair you want to avoid.

 

[jmferg]

Again I'll try to answer most questions. Mainly I felt like venting because I haven't made it 1 oil change interval in and almost every 3rd problem has shown itself.

Coolant was good- a little dirty but no signs of pink milkshake. Original radiator too. Oil was full, and clean, trans fluid was at proper level, a little darker than I would like but have everything to perform a full flush and cooler install.
It was a 1 owner car that was a corporate and then the owner purchased and traded it in at the Lexus/Toyota dealer for a new vehicle. Seemed a little more legitimate than any ole used car lot. The body and undercarriage was spotless- zero signs of leakage or seepage
The only reason I caught the radiator leak was because I bought and installed a scan gauge a week after purchase. The truck was running about 212 and I had them pressure test it. The leak was so small it was pressurizing the coolant into a vapor or mist-there was no wet spots or evidence of leakage until a pressure test was conducted will parked.

And poor oem brakes was referring to the thin front rotors. And yes I replaced the entire front setup while also doing the TBU at the same time.

Currently I have completed or had the Toyota dealership do the following
Oil change with synthetic penszoil and wix filter
New radiator
New t stat
New waterpump
New front brakes
New maf and air filter

I still have the following to do/install
Flush power steering and brake systems
Flush trans and install new filter and stand alone B&M cooler
Flush diffs with redline fluid
Change t case fluid
Rear diff breather mod
Toyota lower BJs

I have the check engine/vsc off/vsc track lights on. It had a new gas cap so PO already tried that. I replaced the maf and air filter with no luck. I am sure it is a vacuum leak due to the idling issues. Just need to smoke test it to find the source. The intake gaskets are not the source because I do not hear any "sucking" sounds from under the hood.
It's goes back the 27th to check on replacing the leaky valve cover gaskets. I talked the the sales manager who I personally dealt with about getting this repair covered


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[WallyWest]

Have you pulled codes for the check engine light? If the PO got a new gas cap I assume the code is for EVAP? Not a huge deal, mine has been on for a year now and I just ignore it. I have other stuff to do and it hasn't affected gas mileage.

The rest, pretty common failures on a 4Runner. I guess I'm somewhat lucky as mine has 165k and apparently zero maintenance done before I bought it. I still have the timing belt/water pump to do, had a leak in the transfer case, some rust underneath I've been treating, and needed all the routine maintenance caught up. But for the last year and a half it's been my DD and never broke down.

Too late now I guess but you should have put Tundra brakes on the front.

Catch up on all the basic maintenance items and you should be able to mostly ignore it for the next 100k miles. The frame looks good, that's the only thing you really worry about.

 

[Dephcon]

I find that only way your going to get any traction with the dealer honoring the warrenty is to take it to the next level. Sounds like you bought it from an actual Toyota Dealership. It might not get you anywhere, but try calling Toyota Corporate and ask about the dealers standing, then explain your issues. They may just hang up on you or they may try to help. Also, make sure you have everything documents and take it to the local paper or news station. Not sure about where you are, but around here we have a hungery news organization and they go after companies that try to take advantage of customers who don't honor work that was paid for, poor service, etc. It brings their shady business practices to light for all the public to view. This is something they don't want to have happen if they wish to continue being in business.

On a side note, chances are, the dealership knew about all the work that needed to be done to the truck and instead of doing it, they just put a for sale sign on it and offered a warranty. So they got you for the price of the vehicle, the price of the warranty and now the price of the repairs. So you may have thought you got a deal paying $???? for the truck + $??? for the warranty and now $???? for all the repairs. Who really won here, definately the dealer. Sounds like everyone in the State needs to know about how this dealership works to me.

 

[ben550]

When I look at a used vehicle I first check the fluids. Is engine oil low, does radiator have coolant up to the bottom of the cap and what condition does it look like. Then I check the readiness monitors with my scanner. If there all set I will continue.

If readiness monitors are not set I'll ask questions to try and figure out why the battery was unhooked (new battery installed?) or codes reset. But usually if all three fail I walk without a test drive.


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Prior to purchase, any used vehicle:
3 general areas of inspection, that should be additionally sought out / in used vehicle market:
1) Hire out or use a code reader yourself / often error codes are erased, and will reappear 25-50 miles down the road. Hiding bad O2 sensors, is one - reader will show # times error cleared / I learned this lesson once, an $800 e-test fail (20 years ago).
2) Rust and structural integrity should be checked, on a hoist.
- some Southern dealers buy cheap Northern vehicles, to flip
3) Take SUV to a good mechanic to get really checked over.
- check Mechanics from a compression test, transmission condition, expensive oil leaks identified, to worn out brakes & steering components

Last time i checked out a vehicle, I brought my scanner and plugged it in. Very few of the categories were "ready" most were incomplete... After looking over the vehicle, checking the vin on the "toyota owners site" and noticing "new parts" on sections of the vehicle... I pieced together that this "1 owner no accident vehicle" was in fact a two owner multiple wreck vehicle... haha