Dual TrueTracs Diffs + ATrac effectiveness?

[Lindenwood]

I understand the theory behind each of these systems. I am just curious if anyone has combined a TrueTrac diff with a vehicle that has brake-driven traction control, and what your experiences were. I have read every thread the first two or three pages of search results from most possible combinations of "truetrac" and "[BLD / ATrac / Trac / Traction Control]," but there isn't actually a whole lot available.

My general thinking is that the ATrac system and Truetrac diffs will complement each other; the diffs should greatly lessen the workload of ATrac over uneven terrain, and the ATrac system should more quickly engage the Truetracs when one wheel begins to lose traction and spin. These are going on my daily driver, so I don't plan on doing a lot of wheel-lifting and other super-aggressive boulder crawling.

*edit to add*

Also, on the occasion it is necessary, I am really not afraid of left-foot braking. But, I am hoping that even the 3rd gen traction control system can take care of most of that for me.

 

[Sleeter]

I understand the theory behind each of these systems. I am just curious if anyone has combined a TrueTrac diff with a vehicle that has brake-driven traction control, and what your experiences were. I have read every thread the first two or three pages of search results from most possible combinations of "truetrac" and "[BLD / ATrac / Trac / Traction Control]," but there isn't actually a whole lot available.

My general thinking is that the ATrac system and Truetrac diffs will complement each other; the diffs should greatly lessen the workload of ATrac over uneven terrain, and the ATrac system should more quickly engage the Truetracs when one wheel begins to lose traction and spin. These are going on my daily driver, so I don't plan on doing a lot of wheel-lifting and other super-aggressive boulder crawling.

*edit to add*

Also, on the occasion it is necessary, I am really not afraid of left-foot braking. But, I am hoping that even the 3rd gen traction control system can take care of most of that for me.

Well my trail has a locking rear-diff and a-trac and is very capable. They definitely complement each other. That said I have taken a stock SR5 with only A-trac through way more than I thought was possible. If I had to pick one system rear-locker or a-Trac I'm pretty sure I'd go with a-trac. Having A-trac and a locker is more-better but not by as large a margin as i would have expected. It's hard to quantify in terms but in hindsight I'm glad I spent the money and have the ability to lock the rear.

Hope that helps.

 

[Lindenwood]

Well my trail has a locking rear-diff and a-trac and is very capable. They definitely complement each other. That said I have taken a stock SR5 with only A-trac through way more than I thought was possible. If I had to pick one system rear-locker or a-Trac I'm pretty sure I'd go with a-trac. Having A-trac and a locker is more-better but not by as large a margin as i would have expected. It's hard to quantify in terms but in hindsight I'm glad I spent the money and have the ability to lock the rear.

Hope that helps.

I do also have a TRDP so I am definitely both familiar and appreciative of ATrac . But, I am planning to add these TrueTracs (which are actually LSDs, rather than lockers) to my 3rd gen Daily Driver, so I am hoping to get some insight into specifically what i can expect with TrueTracs coupled with ATrac .

Really, at this point, unless somebody bursts in with some really good data expounding on why they wouldnt be a good combo, I am comfortable enough with my Truetrac + ATrac hypothesis that I am pretty willing to be the guinea pig!

Thank you, though!

 

[delloro]

I understand the theory behind each of these systems. I am just curious if anyone has combined a TrueTrac diff with a vehicle that has brake-driven traction control, and what your experiences were. I have read every thread the first two or three pages of search results from most possible combinations of "truetrac" and "[BLD / ATrac / Trac / Traction Control]," but there isn't actually a whole lot available.

My general thinking is that the ATrac system and Truetrac diffs will complement each other; the diffs should greatly lessen the workload of ATrac over uneven terrain, and the ATrac system should more quickly engage the Truetracs when one wheel begins to lose traction and spin. These are going on my daily driver, so I don't plan on doing a lot of wheel-lifting and other super-aggressive boulder crawling.

*edit to add*

Also, on the occasion it is necessary, I am really not afraid of left-foot braking. But, I am hoping that even the 3rd gen traction control system can take care of most of that for me.

True Trac to fit a Toyota?

 

[Lindenwood]

True Trac to fit a Toyota?

Yes. ECGS has standard models to fit the rear, and machines the one for the front to fit with the slightly different ADD diff.

 

["krax"]

Also, on the occasion it is necessary, I am really not afraid of left-foot braking. But, I am hoping that even the 3rd gen traction control system can take care of most of that for me.

Left-foot braking is a proven technique with LSDs. You can either keep a constant RPM going and release brake as necessary, or modulate the brake and throttle together, but either way will let you crawl pretty well.

 

[AK2AZ]

ATRAC + TrueTrac = ?

Did you do the deed and install the True Trac with the ATRAC system? I’m getting ready to spend some coin on a light to moderate off road vehicle that meets the brides requirements for comfort (To get some things I give up some things.). Your theory on ATRAC and TrueTrac, especially in an AWD version with the center locking diff sounds reasonable. I have read some negative comments about the robustness of TrueTrac diffs but they were older. . . . Circa 2012. Looking forward to learning form other’s excitement.

 

[Bumbo]

Well my trail has a locking rear-diff and a-trac and is very capable. They definitely complement each other. That said I have taken a stock SR5 with only A-trac through way more than I thought was possible. If I had to pick one system rear-locker or a-Trac I'm pretty sure I'd go with a-trac. Having A-trac and a locker is more-better but not by as large a margin as i would have expected. It's hard to quantify in terms but in hindsight I'm glad I spent the money and have the ability to lock the rear.

Hope that helps.

I think it’s a pretty safe assumption that with the rear locker engaged, a-trac isn’t doing anything that could possibly help in the rear. It would be assisting in the front only.

Any application of braking on a rear wheel would be braking the locked wheel as well. Its not slipping so it should not have much to do.

 

[Bumbo]

I do also have a TRDP so I am definitely both familiar and appreciative of ATrac . But, I am planning to add these TrueTracs (which are actually LSDs, rather than lockers) to my 3rd gen Daily Driver, so I am hoping to get some insight into specifically what i can expect with TrueTracs coupled with ATrac .

Really, at this point, unless somebody bursts in with some really good data expounding on why they wouldnt be a good combo, I am comfortable enough with my Truetrac + ATrac hypothesis that I am pretty willing to be the guinea pig!

Thank you, though!

Correct, the TrueTracs are mechanical limited slip (Torsen style). Really good design and my preference over a clutch style LSD.

I haven’t personally experienced TrueTracs/ATRAC combo, but my differential guy thinks the a-trac / truetrac combo is highly capable and extremely worthy combo. Considering the way ATRAC works, I think your thought process / assumptions are pretty on point.

I have thought of the same for desert / sand driving. I like the idea not having to run open diffs all the time, but I am still a little concerned about that occasional wheel off the ground. It’s a tough call for those who are not highly aggressive rock crawlers.

 

[Smitty19TRD]

I have not done this in a 4Runner because I have a TRDOR; but, I loved it in my JKU Sport.
It had BLD which worked fine in FL. No rock crawling and rarely have wheels in the air. When I did need traction or had a wheel in the air, the BLD did its job but it did have quite a bit of slip to work. Adding tru-tracs front and rear was great. The BLD didn't work as hard and it wasn't needed as much. The great thing about the combo is the BLD helps an LSD overcome its weakness of unloading when a tire is off the ground and was much less slip and drama as with the BLD alone.
I would imagine the A-trac would work the same, if not better. Just my opinion but I think A-trac is better than Jeep's BLD.

 

[Drift Monkey]

Did you ever install these [MENTION=148869]Lindenwood[/MENTION]

 

[Drift Monkey]

I might be giving this a try up front on mine - I figure adding a torsen/helical LSD up front with my existing rear e-locker (FJ) would be a potent setup.

To be fair, rear locked/front atrac has gotten me everywhere I've needed (even on rocks), but I figure adding a mechanical way to transfer torque would be useful (and give atrac a break). In a front wheel up scenario, I'd imagine atrac would activate just enough to preload the LSD to transfer torque to the wheel with grip - an automatic way of "left foot braking" if you will.

 

[delloro]

Yes. ECGS has standard models to fit the rear, and machines the one for the front to fit with the slightly different ADD diff.

I still can't find them but maybe we are not on the same page. 5th Gen 4runner?

After 10 years production, still not enough demand for any mechanical LSD components?

 

[rdruss]

I would think it all comes down to what reacts to loss of traction quickest/first; ATRAC or Trutrac? How would you know? Does anyone know who has this combo? If ATRAC reacts quicker than Trutrac it's a waste of $$ correct?
Not knocking it, just would like to know.

 

[delloro]

I would think it all comes down to what reacts to loss of traction quickest/first; ATRAC or Trutrac? How would you know? Does anyone know who has this combo? If ATRAC reacts quicker than Trutrac it's a waste of $$ correct?
Not knocking it, just would like to know.

TrueTrac won't overheat your brakes, and works even when not in 4Lo.

 

[rdruss]

TrueTrac won't overheat your brakes, and works even when not in 4Lo.

No argument there, but which works quicker, ATRAC or TT?

 

[Fern]

No argument there, but which works quicker, ATRAC or TT?

ATRAC can actually help engage the TT from what I have heard. I have gotten up stuff with ATRAC that guys with lockers have struggled with. Throttle control and line choice is the key.

 

[delloro]

No argument there, but which works quicker, ATRAC or TT?

TT always works, there is nothing to engage. The issue is that when one wheel has no traction whatsoever, TT can let that wheel spin until that free wheel gets some resistance. That resistance can come from tapping the brakes, or ATRAC.

So, when all 4 wheels are on the ground, TT will always be engaged and working, regardless of 4hi/4lo and in the rear, regardless even of 2wd/4wd. When one wheel is in the air, the TT cannot be relied upon to work without external help.

ATRAC works pretty quickly when needed, but not as quickly as TT usually does.

TT plus ATRAC is complementary, never slower than ATRAC by itself, usually instantaneous, and seamless.

 

[Shotgunut]

This is the setup my Toyota mechanic has in his tundra and recommended to me.
Luckily for me EATON has no interest in making this for the 8.2 (10+ 4runner)
I called a guy from their tech and he said not enough people are interested in a true track.
Barney 1 800-328-3850 then press 1 tell him we all should get one. Please.

 

[timothylynn7]

TT always works, there is nothing to engage. The issue is that when one wheel has no traction whatsoever, TT can let that wheel spin until that free wheel gets some resistance. That resistance can come from tapping the brakes, or ATRAC.

So, when all 4 wheels are on the ground, TT will always be engaged and working, regardless of 4hi/4lo and in the rear, regardless even of 2wd/4wd. When one wheel is in the air, the TT cannot be relied upon to work without external help.

ATRAC works pretty quickly when needed, but not as quickly as TT usually does.

TT plus ATRAC is complementary, never slower than ATRAC by itself, usually instantaneous, and seamless.

I had a trutrac in the front end of my old jeep because I ran out of money for a locker with my build. Not worth it. With my limited experience with the ATRAC system I’ve been impressed. Just gotta work it a little.


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