Help, I need a come to Jesus talk...

[LUVDA4RUNNER]

So, for the past few years I have been planning on getting a new 5th gen T4R. I will be trading in my PF. The car I want is on the lot. I am suppose to go see the dealer tomorrow and write up the papers for a price and my trade in and put $500 down to hold the black limited I am planning to buy until after I am finished refinancing my house.

I am having second thoughts...

I drove a new Ford Explore this weekend. I actually liked it. Now, I am in no way bashing the T4R, but I want to talk about a few of the things that are going back and forth in my mind regarding my future decision.

I have always wanted a black T4R. I love the new design. I love its capabilities. What I don't like so much is the price.

The Explorer, I can get for a couple grand cheaper for the same options, and actually a few more. They are quoting me around $40K for a Limited TR4 w/Nav and 3rd row. I am told I would be looking at around $38K for a Explorer Limited w/the Explorer I want after discount.

The Limited Explore w/AWD Secect terrain, Leather, dual panel sun roof, ford sync, touch, and a sweet Sony HD stereo system. It comes w/3rd row seating, the leather is of nicer quality, 2nd row leg room not as much as TR4. It has some crazy high teck technology going on w/the speedometer/dash. I drove one this week and it has a nice view out of the front seat, looks like you are driving a truck based SUV, but man does it handle nicely (like a car) and virtually no road noise.

I am looking to purchase this as a car that I am going to keep for 10 years.
So the TR4 has the edge there.

Anymore, I am unsure if i need the low gear transfer case that the TR4 has, mostly going through snow and minimal off road, dirt roads, no rock crawling.

Gas mileage is pretty similair among the 2 of them. Does the Limited TR4 w/Full time 4wd get less mpg then say a SR5?

When I test drove the TR4, the steering was so loose, there was a lot of give in the steering wheel even compared to my PF. I have read about this on the internet and seen videos, it was just such a difference driving the Explorer.

Anyway, if you guys have any advice give it to straight. Please no flaming if possible as this is not meant to be anything negative against the TR4 or anybody here. I am just trying to decide which car would fit me best in the long run.:thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks:

 

[T4Fun]

I am looking to purchase this as a car that I am going to keep for 10 years.
So the TR4 has the edge there.:

i think you just said a contradictory statement there...4runner does not drive like a car...if you want the car based drive, get the explorer, but who know about reliability on this new model...there are already recalls on the ford f series and some other ford models sharing similar parts..

 

[Casper421]

Anyway, if you guys have any advice give it to straight. Please no flaming if possible as this is not meant to be anything negative against the TR4 or anybody here. I am just trying to decide which car would fit me best in the long run.:thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks:

I got a question for you, whats your User name? The 4runner takes my vote! :trophy: Its reliable, rugged, and very capable. And it will last forever!!

 

[Quentin]

Buy what you think fits your needs better and what you like better. I am planning on having the T4R for 10+ years. A car based "SUV" with a transverse mounted engine and trans that will practically need the whole front end disassembled to do any work on it doesn't fit my criteria of maintainability.

 

[angrydog]

I vote for the 4Runner especially since you said you would like to keep it in the long run. Sure ford has more tech, but that's more stuff you have to worry about fixing in the long run. I believe the new explorer is uni-body so it drives like a car, but the 4Runner is a body on frame rig. Don't take it the wrong way, My SR5 without the XREAS Suspension (Limited has Xreas) is smoother than my '03 Pathfinder LE.

If this vehicle was for the short term, I actually would vote for the Ford because they came a long way in the past 5 years. Since you mentioned long term, I'll definitely suggest the 4Runner.

 

[CApilot78]

So, for the past few years I have been planning on getting a new 5th gen T4R. I will be trading in my PF. The car I want is on the lot. I am suppose to go see the dealer tomorrow and write up the papers for a price and my trade in and put $500 down to hold the black limited I am planning to buy until after I am finished refinancing my house.

I am having second thoughts...

I didn't drive the explorer, but I wanted to get a Tahoe. I ended up with the 4runner for the reliability.

I think the 4runner has some real "faults". I think the truck rides to soft, there is a lot of body roll, it nose dives, etc. It is missing a lot of "options" that should be included in a truck this price - seat memory!!!!!

People have been "bashing" the reviews, and I agree with some of their points (it is a truck based SUV, etc). The 4runner is not perfect. I think the ride and 4wd system in the SR5 took a big step back from the 4th gen.

That being said, I think the 4runner is the right vehicle for my needs. I plan on putting a lift and bigger tires. And that will also stiffen the ride. And the reliability is unmatched. I wanted an SUV to last me for 10 years, and I knew there is no other car that will do that except the 4runner.

 

[westwind77]

Honestly you are trying to compare 'apples to oranges' - the new Explorer is just a glorified Taurus. I was shocked and disappointed that Ford took a 'backward' step with the Explorer, I was hoping they would 'beef it up' more, but they went the opposite direction with it. Last years model of the Explorer could go 10x's the places that the new model could.

There are just too many differences to name, it comes down to what YOU really want. Drive both, weigh YOUR pros & cons, make the choice that is right for YOU. Most of us here will push you to the 4R, for obvious reasons, but the Explorer might be the best bet for you personally. Most people know if they really need the 4R vs just getting some other run of the mill crossover, and if you don't, you probably don't.

 

[LUVDA4RUNNER]

I vote for the 4Runner especially since you said you would like to keep it in the long run. Sure ford has more tech, but that's more stuff you have to worry about fixing in the long run. I believe the new explorer is uni-body so it drives like a car, but the 4Runner is a body on frame rig. Don't take it the wrong way, My SR5 without the XREAS Suspension (Limited has Xreas) is smoother than my '03 Pathfinder LE.

If this vehicle was for the short term, I actually would vote for the Ford because they came a long way in the past 5 years. Since you mentioned long term, I'll definitely suggest the 4Runner.

To me the main things are reliability, price, and safety. Gas mileage is also on my mind as this is likely to increase this year. Does anybody know if the Limited full time 4WD has lower MPG average than say as SR5 w/part time 4WD? Thanks for your thoughts all are appreciated.

 

[angrydog]

I would say the difference between the part-time 4WD found in the SR5 and the full-time found in the Limited is about 1MPG.


Right from the Toyota website:

Mileage estimates (city/highway/combined) SR5: 17/22/19 Limited: 17/22/19

So according to the EPA, there is no difference.

 

[SeattleMike]

To me the main things are reliability, price, and safety. Gas mileage is also on my mind as this is likely to increase this year. Does anybody know if the Limited full time 4WD has lower MPG average than say as SR5 w/part time 4WD? Thanks for your thoughts all are appreciated.

That information is easily found on the Toyota website.

 

[DocMT]

If reliability is your #1 concern, I'd think the 4Runner has an advantage. But in all honesty, nobody knows how well the Explorer will hold up. It might be great...Ford has stepped up on their reliability quite a bit over the last few years.

As for the others things you said, if you don't like the way the 4Runner drives or handles, definitely put a lot of weight on that. It's not a car and it won't drive like one. The Explorer isn't exactly a car either, but it will drive more like one.

Low range gearing? Most people never even use it. But it's nice to have if you need it.

If I were you, I'd definitely test drive and research other vehicles in this class, although I don't even see the 4Runner and Explorer in the same class anymore.

 

[fxoffroad]

It reads like you really want the Explorer and if you're having second thoughts - it probably makes sense for you to take some time and figure out what you really want. Neither vehicle is going to a great deal, if you end up wishing you would have bought the other vehicle.

Did you notice you wrote an entire paragraph about the Explorer features??? Pretty cool stuff - and let's face it, Ford definitely has got its game on.

I'm wondering if your "big" concern is about how the Ford will hold up in 10 years compared to a Toyota. And that's a tough call... on one hand Ford seems to have completely reworked their game - on the other, historically, Toyota shines in the longevity department.

I average about 19.8 mixed w/ my Limited and I definitely get on it a lot. Sounds like you don't need the low range/gear.

Ultimately... I would suggest you think about it some more... maybe see if you can take each vehicle home on Saturday and keep through Monday AM to really get a sense of each.

Good luck.

So, for the past few years I have been planning on getting a new 5th gen T4R. I will be trading in my PF. The car I want is on the lot.

 

[Glock_19]

I had great luck with my 97 Explorer. I sold it at 120,000 miles, but never had a single problem with it. I've only had my 4Runner a short time but I also love it, and other family members have had great experiences with Toyota. So I think either way you can't really go wrong.

As far as Ford's commitment to reliability it has definitely increased in recent years. You should check out the videos that are linked in this thread: http://www.toyota-4runner.org/general-discussions/79346-pretty-cool-series-videos.html

That engine isn't in the Explorer, but it does show Ford has stepped up their game.

 

[2010TE4Runner]

I drive a 2010 Explorer for 10 hrs a night at work. I am not impressed at all. Just hit 18k and the check engine and power train failure lights are popping on and off randomly. Dealer resets them and cannot find a problem.

Its such a nice feeling to get into my 2010 Trail and drive home at the end of the shift.

 

[LUVDA4RUNNER]

It reads like you really want the Explorer and if you're having second thoughts - it probably makes sense for you to take some time and figure out what you really want. Neither vehicle is going to a great deal, if you end up wishing you would have bought the other vehicle.

Did you notice you wrote an entire paragraph about the Explorer features??? Pretty cool stuff - and let's face it, Ford definitely has got its game on.

I'm wondering if your "big" concern is about how the Ford will hold up in 10 years compared to a Toyota. And that's a tough call... on one hand Ford seems to have completely reworked their game - on the other, historically, Toyota shines in the longevity department.

I average about 19.8 mixed w/ my Limited and I definitely get on it a lot. Sounds like you don't need the low range/gear.

Ultimately... I would suggest you think about it some more... maybe see if you can take each vehicle home on Saturday and keep through Monday AM to really get a sense of each.

Good luck.

Thanks for everyones thoughts.
Yes, they are 2 different cars. I guess I have to decide which I like better, so I will need to test drive both again.
I have just always wanted a 4Runner, but after driving it, I just had a few reservations. A better test drive is needed.
Also, I have been told I can get the Explorer for 2K less, I am not sure if that is true. If they are the same $, I would go with the 4R.
Good thing is the Toyota and Ford dealerships are next to each other.

Anybody have any comments on the steering of the T4R. That is one of the main things that sticks out in my mind from the test drive. I could take my finger and move it a few directions left and right w/o the car moving. Is that purposeful by Toyota?

Thanks again guys.

 

[Ryan F.]

I was commenting to my son today that I felt that Ford had come a long way. However, you want to keep this vehicle for 10 years. This is crucial. Really, if you can forsee 7 years from now....What vehicle do you see lasting without constantly being in the shop. Seriously. This point totally tips you in the 4 Runner's favor. As for some of the criticaly comments...I really disagree. I'm not saying that people are wrong, I'm just saying that I come from a lifetime of cars, and 1) The 4 Runner handles great, 2) The brakes are great, and 3) I must have always belonged in a truck based vehicle because I LOVE the way it rides. I have owned nothing but Toyotas (with the exception of a Dodge Dart my parents gave me when I moved out), and this is the finest of a bunch of fine cars I have owned. Great stuff. Enjoy your 4 Runner--I know you will end up that way.

 

[angrydog]

Anybody have any comments on the steering of the T4R. That is one of the main things that sticks out in my mind from the test drive. I could take my finger and move it a few directions left and right w/o the car moving. Is that purposeful by Toyota?

Thanks again guys.

The steering wheel is a hit or miss for some. In my case, I love it! To answer your question; yes, it is supposed to turn effortlessly which I love!

 

[Ryan F.]

The steering wheel is a hit or miss for some. In my case, I love it! To answer your question; yes, it is supposed to turn effortlessly which I love!

I've got nothing on the steering. I'm weird about on center feel, and I love the feel.

 

[Quentin]

The steering wheel is a hit or miss for some. In my case, I love it! To answer your question; yes, it is supposed to turn effortlessly which I love!

I like the slow rack in the 4Runner. A quick rack in a big, top heavy SUV means more chance to flip the thing. I love the quick rack in the MINI, but it isn't going to end up on the roof if a deer jumps out in front of me and I turn the wheel too hard. The steering means the 4Runner is really simple to drive on the interstate, too. There isn't another car I've driven for a 4 hr trip to my parents' house that leaves me feeling as good. No stress at all.

 

[Ryan F.]

I like the slow rack in the 4Runner. A quick rack in a big, top heavy SUV means more chance to flip the thing. I love the quick rack in the MINI, but it isn't going to end up on the roof if a deer jumps out in front of me and I turn the wheel too hard. The steering means the 4Runner is really simple to drive on the interstate, too. There isn't another car I've driven for a 4 hr trip to my parents' house that leaves me feeling as good. No stress at all.

Spot on post. I take my son to the Dr. in Seattle--120 mile round trip. I show up feeling great, and come home looking for the next adventure in my 4 Runner. I just can't say enough about how fun this thing is. Usually, when I get a new ride, I get all protective, and worry about something happening. In this ride, I don't even think about it. I want to drive it all of the time.