Hopefully getting 2019 T4R TRD Premium with KDS thoughts?

[Ripper238]

So its been about 15 years since i had my Expedition and i think its time for a true SUV.
After 4 tire blow outs in just the passed few months and a falling apart suspension as well as cracked windshields in my Mazda 3 I just cant see it being a good idea to keep it anymore. Plus i want to get back into some off roading and camping again.

I have watched tons of YouTube videos and reading other posts and i think the T4R is by far the most reliable and capable choice if i want an enclosed back i could sleep in. I also want to buy before the 4R gets all the tech garbage for 2020. So i want to verify others thoughts on a few things.


A few questions.

- I'm planing on getting a TRD premium with KDSS (want better on/off road manners). It seems those who have KDSS appear to like it and it provides better on/off road handling and articulation. This will be a huge change from my car, but i have driving large devilry trucks for years so hopefully KDSS will add to the on highway handling.

- I live in the NE where we can get some snow. I was wondering if the stock tires are adequate? It also looks like i can only use 4H in combination with Multi-terrain Select (sand/mud)? 4L can be used with A-trac, crawl control and the lower speed Multi-terrain settings.

- Is the 4R really that reliable? Some say its a 25 year car, reports of ones with 300k+. One guy said he bought his at 42k with 40k miles and got an offer to buy it for 40k a year later. Crazy....
Il be financing this thing and its a big chunk of change, but if its that reliable and long lasting it would be worth every penny.

- I'm assuming an extended warranty is just throwing money away for things i could do to it.

I'm not planing on doing much to it, just a 2-3" lift and a front push bar at some point.

Any thoughts or opinions would be great. I may be moving on this soon, but if any other questions pop up ill be sure to ask.

Thanks for this great community and forum!

 

[QuickBen]

I bought a brand new 2018 4runner TRD OR with KDSS in March of 2018. Here are my thoughts / answers to your questions:

1. Drive one with a KDSS first. Frankly, I don't think its VERY noticeable, but I do get a big silly smile on my face every time I hear it cranking when I turn the vehicle on and off. It seems to reduce body roll a fair amount, but even with the KDSS, the 4runner feels like a big ole pick up truck in the corners. If anything, even with the KDSS, the 4runner is less agile than my 2012 F150 was. I've never been wheelin in a 4runner without KDSS so I can't give you any input on what it does for me on the trails.

2. In my opinion the stock duellers that come on the trucks are WORTHLESS. However at least here in the Southeast, our Toyota distributor has several appearance packages that come with some Goodyear Wranglers on them. Those tires would probably serve you fine, but if the model you purchase has duellers, I'd plan on getting those replaced before you even make it back to the dealership.

3. Obviously I only have a 2018 so can't tell you about longevity, but that was part of my decision too. The engine in these things is absolutely ancient in terms of modern technology, but Toyota has kept putting it in there because it is a PHENOMENAL engine. Properly maintained, yes, they are fully expected to go 300K and beyond.

Personally my biggest regret is that I bought my 4Runner brand new though. The benefit of buying brand new is obviously that its warranted (which I forsee getting very little value out of.. this thing is a tank) and that maintenance is covered through I think 50K miles (which is pretty nice). I'd guess by the end of the day the maintenance will be worth about $1500 though.

With the new model year coming out, I'm gonna guess the 2019s are actually going to lose a lot more value a lot more quickly than the past model years have. In fact, the announcement has already shaved a fair amount off of my car. A few months ago I probably could have gotten $37k on a trade in - local BMW dealership quoted me $34,400 this weekend (16k miles).

Fact of the matter is, for well over $40K, the 2019 4runner is a WOEFULLY outdated vehicle. It is underpowered and comes with the same equipment, options, and tech as a 2008 ford explorer. Its also INSANE to me that they are putting adaptive cruise control in base model corollas and its not even an option on a TRD OR.

Definitely don't let me ruin your excitement for the car, but in my opinion, its a very bad time to buy a brand new 4runner. I'd either wait until next years model or buy a used one. Even with a tech update coming for 2020, dealers still will NOT budge on a 4runner price. They just don't have to. So you'll be paying damn close to sticker value for a car that is probably going to lose about $5k as soon as those 2020s start hitting the streets.

Edit: I hadn't even read about the the all updates coming in 2020. Now that I've seen them, I'd double down on my previous statement that you should wait and buy a 2020. Push button start, 8 inch touch screen, and apple car play are all things that should have been added to the 4runner in 2016. Adaptive cruise control, lane departure, and automatic high beams are all REALLY nice safety features. If you've never driven a car with adaptive cruise control and lane departure.. you should probably go test drive a corolla. Its some incredibly useful and enjoyable tech, and the 4runner is about the only new car you can buy right now that doesn't have that stuff for a reason - its just GREAT tech.

 

[Ripper238]

With the new model year coming out, I'm gonna guess the 2019s are actually going to lose a lot more value a lot more quickly than the past model years have. In fact, the announcement has already shaved a fair amount off of my car. A few months ago I probably could have gotten $37k on a trade in - local BMW dealership quoted me $34,400 this weekend (16k miles).

Fact of the matter is, for well over $40K, the 2019 4runner is a WOEFULLY outdated vehicle. It is underpowered and comes with the same equipment, options, and tech as a 2008 ford explorer. Its also INSANE to me that they are putting adaptive cruise control in base model corollas and its not even an option on a TRD OR.

Definitely don't let me ruin your excitement for the car, but in my opinion, its a very bad time to buy a brand new 4runner. I'd either wait until next years model or buy a used one. Even with a tech update coming for 2020, dealers still will NOT budge on a 4runner price. They just don't have to. So you'll be paying damn close to sticker value for a car that is probably going to lose about $5k as soon as those 2020s start hitting the streets.

Edit: I hadn't even read about the the all updates coming in 2020. Now that I've seen them, I'd double down on my previous statement that you should wait and buy a 2020. Push button start, 8 inch touch screen, and apple car play are all things that should have been added to the 4runner in 2016. Adaptive cruise control, lane departure, and automatic high beams are all REALLY nice safety features. If you've never driven a car with adaptive cruise control and lane departure.. you should probably go test drive a corolla. Its some incredibly useful and enjoyable tech, and the 4runner is about the only new car you can buy right now that doesn't have that stuff for a reason - its just GREAT tech.

Thank you for sharing your experience and thoughts. Ill keep an eye out on the tires it comes with, they may be able to do a swap since i want different rims than what it has. Also sounds like the KDSS will do exactly what i want it to do.

I did also look at used but even a 2017 with 25k was going for 39800, so it made much more sense to buy new.

As for the updates for the 2020, i am not thrilled. The adaptive cruse from my understanding of the Toyota's is not very good and leaves way to big of a gap and doesn't compensate well. Also the lane departure seems to go off to much. I wouldn't mind apple and android auto, but i would still mount and use my phone since this tech still isn't on par with my Android phone independently. So other than these updates being an advantage for me to resell they provide very little to me. Which puts me in this odd place. lol

 

[JP421]

Thank you for sharing your experience and thoughts. Ill keep an eye out on the tires it comes with, they may be able to do a swap since i want different rims than what it has. Also sounds like the KDSS will do exactly what i want it to do.

As for the updates for the 2020, i am not thrilled. The adaptive cruse from my understanding of the Toyota's is not very good and leaves way to big of a gap and doesn't compensate well. Also the lane departure seems to go off to much. I wouldn't mind apple and android auto, but i would still mount and use my phone since this tech still isn't on par with my Android phone independently. So other than these updates being an advantage for me to resell they provide very little to me. Which puts me in this odd place. lol

The only thing I would want from the 2020 is the android/apple auto.

I came from a loaded Titanium trim Ford. I miss the climate control the most but not as much as I would have guessed. I do hate entune, I hated it in my Subaru too.

You don't buy a 4runner for comforts, you buy it for dependability and off road capability. Looks and overall usefulness are up there as well for some.

 

[5thToy]

As far as longevity goes, The 4Runner has more vehicles reaching 300K miles than any other, and is 4th ranked vehicle overall in terms of percentage reaching 200K miles. That's a strong endorsement. Perspective is in order however. In the study linked below, the percentage of 4Runners reaching the 300k mark was 0.3 %, and those reaching 200K miles 4.2 %.

Will your vehicle go 200,000-plus miles? | Get the latest car news, car reviews, auto show updates, and racing news from Autoweek. News for the auto enthusiast.

 

[commbubba19]

Thank you for sharing your experience and thoughts. Ill keep an eye out on the tires it comes with, they may be able to do a swap since i want different rims than what it has. Also sounds like the KDSS will do exactly what i want it to do.

As for the updates for the 2020, i am not thrilled. The adaptive cruse from my understanding of the Toyota's is not very good and leaves way to big of a gap and doesn't compensate well. Also the lane departure seems to go off to much. I wouldn't mind apple and android auto, but i would still mount and use my phone since this tech still isn't on par with my Android phone independently. So other than these updates being an advantage for me to resell they provide very little to me. Which puts me in this odd place. lol

just depends on which TSS they use. My wife's highlander has the normal TSS and it's decent. Isn't too abrupt and you can adjust distance to the vehicle in front of you. Doesn't mean you can be oblivious. You still may need to intervene at times. Plus it stops working under 30 or so mph.

Lane departure is about expectations. I see it as a safety thing that if i'm distracted and start to veer into the lane over, it stops me and bumps me back. Other people prefer a system that literally holds the car in the lane and requires very little driver input. Not sure if TSS 2.0 will give that level of lane keep assistance.

I agree though that 19 and older values will likely take a hit after the 20's are released. However that could be used to your advantage in purchasing a 19 and negotiating an even lower price.

My old '15 4R wallowed and nose dived horribly until i put on 5100's. Not sure if KDSS improves any of that.

Based on what you've explained, I'd say you'd be perfectly content with a new 19 4R. Just try to get the best deal possible and don't worry about trade in or resale. Sounds like you plan to keep it forever.

 

[Ripper238]

just depends on which TSS they use. My wife's highlander has the normal TSS and it's decent. Isn't too abrupt and you can adjust distance to the vehicle in front of you. Doesn't mean you can be oblivious. You still may need to intervene at times. Plus it stops working under 30 or so mph.

Lane departure is about expectations. I see it as a safety thing that if i'm distracted and start to veer into the lane over, it stops me and bumps me back. Other people prefer a system that literally holds the car in the lane and requires very little driver input. Not sure if TSS 2.0 will give that level of lane keep assistance.

I agree though that 19 and older values will likely take a hit after the 20's are released. However that could be used to your advantage in purchasing a 19 and negotiating an even lower price.

My old '15 4R wallowed and nose dived horribly until i put on 5100's. Not sure if KDSS improves any of that.

Based on what you've explained, I'd say you'd be perfectly content with a new 19 4R. Just try to get the best deal possible and don't worry about trade in or resale. Sounds like you plan to keep it forever.

Ill be sure i get the best deal i can, i was already able to get them to take $2300 MSRP. Im still a little early to be buying a 2019 and get a super good deal but a 4R with KDSS is a little harder to find.

Yup, I plan to keep it forever. When things go ill just upgrade the parts.

 

[Mutant138]

So its been about 15 years since i had my Expedition and i think its time for a true SUV.
After 4 tire blow outs in just the passed few months and a falling apart suspension as well as cracked windshields in my Mazda 3 I just cant see it being a good idea to keep it anymore. Plus i want to get back into some off roading and camping again.

I have watched tons of YouTube videos and reading other posts and i think the T4R is by far the most reliable and capable choice if i want an enclosed back i could sleep in. I also want to buy before the 4R gets all the tech garbage for 2020. So i want to verify others thoughts on a few things.


A few questions.

- I'm planing on getting a TRD premium with KDSS (want better on/off road manners). It seems those who have KDSS appear to like it and it provides better on/off road handling and articulation. This will be a huge change from my car, but i have driving large devilry trucks for years so hopefully KDSS will add to the on highway handling.

- I live in the NE where we can get some snow. I was wondering if the stock tires are adequate? It also looks like i can only use 4H in combination with Multi-terrain Select (sand/mud)? 4L can be used with A-trac, crawl control and the lower speed Multi-terrain settings.

- Is the 4R really that reliable? Some say its a 25 year car, reports of ones with 300k+. One guy said he bought his at 42k with 40k miles and got an offer to buy it for 40k a year later. Crazy....
Il be financing this thing and its a big chunk of change, but if its that reliable and long lasting it would be worth every penny.

- I'm assuming an extended warranty is just throwing money away for things i could do to it.

I'm not planing on doing much to it, just a 2-3" lift and a front push bar at some point.

Any thoughts or opinions would be great. I may be moving on this soon, but if any other questions pop up ill be sure to ask.

Thanks for this great community and forum!

I sleep in my truck all the time. Ton's of space.

KDSS is fantastic if it's not a dedicated trail rig that you want Long Travel on. I have it and would get it again. Remember that 3" is about the max you can lift with kdss. I will be going 2.75" to keep all the geometry in check and prevent binding/premature wear.

Stock tires are pretty trash. I would get them swapped at the dealer (Really wish I had). Maybe work it into the deal.

Stupid reliable. 3rd Gen I sold had 278K and drove like it was new.

Extended warranty seems like a waste to me but I'm not a financial planner.

 

[TheGoat4R]

2020 4Runner

Does anyone know of the 2020 will be body on frame?

 

[5thToy]

Does anyone know of the 2020 will be body on frame?

No change other than Toyota Safety Sense and a new head unit. 6th Gen is still a ways off and no one knows what it will be.

 

[Ripper238]

What do you think would be fair discount price on the 2019 I'm looking for with this modestly updated new version for 2020 since it may affect the value a little more than normal?

Like what you have seen as far as end-of-year deals from Toyota on 4Runners?

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[llDemonll]

How much are people paying for the NEW 4Runner?

has lots of info on pricing.

If you're buying brand new you have a huge advantage. just get a quote from dealers, call around and tell them you're buying a car that day and make them bid against each other.

 

[QuickBen]

I actually read an article today that claimed the 6th gen will be 2022, with first cars hitting the lots in late 2021: Next-Gen 2022 Toyota 4Runner Coming and Enthusiasts Offer Redesign Suggestions | Torque News

No idea if that is a reliable source.

I hear you on the tech stuff. If its not for you definitely don't let my post talk you out of it. My problem is mostly that I drove a new X3 this weekend and that kinda opened my eyes to what $40K in a crossover SUV gets ya!!

If you do plan on keeping it forever, I'd say that is a big "pro" to buying a 2019 if it has all the bells and whistles you think you need. My original plan to try to keep it forever was a big part of why I bought new as well. 4Runner is one of those cars that you never know what kind of torture its been through if its used.

IMO, the ~5% number on 4runners making it to 200K is probably driven down a lot by accidents, poor maintenance, and higher mileage vehicles just getting dumpstered when big maintenance items start coming up. I'd imagine of the cars which are properly taken care of, a hell of a lot more than 5% are making it there!!

 

[Ripper238]

The only thing I would want from the 2020 is the android/apple auto.

I came from a loaded Titanium trim Ford. I miss the climate control the most but not as much as I would have guessed. I do hate entune, I hated it in my Subaru too.

You don't buy a 4runner for comforts, you buy it for dependability and off road capability. Looks and overall usefulness are up there as well for some.

100%

But Entune looks pretty cool, basic but cool. You can control start up and door locks and monitor the R4 with an app. If BT automatically connects to play audio off my car i cant see it being bad?

 

[KWSRStorm]

Youll be happy with it. The only co.plaint is the stock tires. They not bad...but not great.


In terms of tires, i got a 15% off toyota accessories with the new car. I talked to the parts manager and got a deal for them to buy my wheels and tires and i got the trd wheels (with the 15% discount) with 275 70 r17 bfg ko2s. The installed them and the tpms sensors for free.

Might be worth asking what kind of deal you can get if your buying new.

I probably could have gotten a smidge more if i sold them on here or craigslist, but then id have to buy all new wheels and tires and store the old ones till they sold. The 10% difference wasnt worth it.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

 

[sunmoses12]

I second this. The 4runner is for dependability and off road capability. I have no qualms with my 4Runner Trd Pro '18. The cool features would be nice but often you can get aftermarket parts if you really want those extra features.

The only thing I would want from the 2020 is the android/apple auto.

I came from a loaded Titanium trim Ford. I miss the climate control the most but not as much as I would have guessed. I do hate entune, I hated it in my Subaru too.

You don't buy a 4runner for comforts, you buy it for dependability and off road capability. Looks and overall usefulness are up there as well for some.

 

[cb1111]

I actually read an article today that claimed the 6th gen will be 2022, with first cars hitting the lots in late 2021: Next-Gen 2022 Toyota 4Runner Coming and Enthusiasts Offer Redesign Suggestions | Torque News

No idea if that is a reliable source.

I hear you on the tech stuff. If its not for you definitely don't let my post talk you out of it. My problem is mostly that I drove a new X3 this weekend and that kinda opened my eyes to what $40K in a crossover SUV gets ya!!

If you do plan on keeping it forever, I'd say that is a big "pro" to buying a 2019 if it has all the bells and whistles you think you need. My original plan to try to keep it forever was a big part of why I bought new as well. 4Runner is one of those cars that you never know what kind of torture its been through if its used.

IMO, the ~5% number on 4runners making it to 200K is probably driven down a lot by accidents, poor maintenance, and higher mileage vehicles just getting dumpstered when big maintenance items start coming up. I'd imagine of the cars which are properly taken care of, a hell of a lot more than 5% are making it there!!

The problem is that you can't compare the X3 to a 4R. The X3 is a boulevard cruiser that is a maintenance headache out the door (at least in the US) that I'd compare more to a RAV4 than a 4R - two completely different leagues. In 5 years, you can buy two X3's for the price of a 5 year old 4R (maybe not quite but close)

Can the Highlander be compared to the 4R? The Highlander is a far better vehicle if you never go off road and don't care about resale value.

 

[mteolus]

Stock Bridgestones are trash.

Brakes are my biggest complaint. Soft at first then too hard. Brakes grab at a medium to hard brake in rush hour traffic. Stock without lift will nosedive. Stock ground clearance is poor. Don't believe the claimed 9.5.

Gas mileage is bad with a lift.

Acceleration requires a lot of foot. $300 fix by getting a Pedal Commander.

Doesn't come with leather but I really like the fake leather.

Radio display is small. Make sure you get the JBL upgrade.

Everything else is great. I like KDSS but it does add weight. 4X4 ability is great. Crawl ratio is not nearly as good as a Jeep Rubicon but for most trails will work. Long enough for 6'0" to sleep fully extended.

Recommend getting sliding rear cargo tray.

Probably 2nd best 4x4 capability next to a Rubicon.

Reliability is well known, one of the main reasons I purchased over a Jeep. I sold my 92 Toyota pickup with four hundred and ten thousand Miles still running. Toyota is made well.

 

[Moses_J]

I love my 19' even after learning about the new features of the 2020. I've never had any of those features on previous vehicles so I don't know any better.

I live in the foothills of North Carolina so KDSS really helps the drive quality on daily winding and curvey roads.

It's been fun watching it change from stock, can't wait to see what's next! Go for it you'll enjoy it.

 

[trd19orp]

I have a 2019 TRD ORP; purchased it ahead of the 2020 model very specifically because I didn't want the TSS bits. I've not driven a non-KDSS model, but if the handling and nose-dive under braking is worse, I'll get KDSS every time. It'll see some offroading, but nothing insane, and I don't plan on lifting it at all (at least at this point). I came from a 2012 Audi A3 with sport suspension, so I'm probably a little extra-sensitive to the handling component. That said, I love the 4Runner, and couldn't be happier.

I've owned numerous Chevy pickups over the years, and am excited to have a covered bed, as well as the anticipated reliability. Can't really complain about any of the Chevys either, but I didn't put hundreds of thousands of miles on them, either - am planning to with this one, though!