As stated, if you could do your lift all over again, what would you do differently? I'm not saying if you had unlimited cash, but for those who already have had their lift on for a while and knowing how you use it, what would you have done differently from the beginning? Would you go higher, lower, different parts? It would help to know what your current setup is, and what you may do differently. I'm looking to do my lift soon and want to avoid wasting money!
If you could do your lift all over again, what would you do?
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Billynath1988
Senior Member
Dont cheap out, realize you get what you pay for and try to do it right the first time.
That said, Decide how you will most use your 4runner, how much offroading will you do, do you tow?, will you consistently carry weight? are you just going for looks and bigger tires? Do you live in salt states?
The high end suspensions are all similar in quality and performance unless your really pushing the limits all the time. For me, customer service was more important. And radflo has been good to me where ive seen others fall short.
I run JBA high caster upper control arms, Radflo 2.5 ext travel coil overs with resi's and 700# springs up front with Radflo ext travel 2.5's in the rear on 5th gen Radflo springs and a day star spacer. 285/75/17 nitto ridge grapplers
It rides stiff when empty even with my armor, but when loaded up with gear or people its the better then a brand new vehicle. Ive had it on for going on 3 years now and offroaded many times, road tripped and I daily drive it. Stay up on maintenance, have realistic expectations and you will be more then happy.
To answer your question, if I had more money to spend I might have went kings, and Id probably add more parts, because for me its an endless project/hobby but this is mostly a case of the grass is always greener. More often then not my suspension puts a big smile on my face and surprises me when im really putting it to the test.
That said, Decide how you will most use your 4runner, how much offroading will you do, do you tow?, will you consistently carry weight? are you just going for looks and bigger tires? Do you live in salt states?
The high end suspensions are all similar in quality and performance unless your really pushing the limits all the time. For me, customer service was more important. And radflo has been good to me where ive seen others fall short.
I run JBA high caster upper control arms, Radflo 2.5 ext travel coil overs with resi's and 700# springs up front with Radflo ext travel 2.5's in the rear on 5th gen Radflo springs and a day star spacer. 285/75/17 nitto ridge grapplers
It rides stiff when empty even with my armor, but when loaded up with gear or people its the better then a brand new vehicle. Ive had it on for going on 3 years now and offroaded many times, road tripped and I daily drive it. Stay up on maintenance, have realistic expectations and you will be more then happy.
To answer your question, if I had more money to spend I might have went kings, and Id probably add more parts, because for me its an endless project/hobby but this is mostly a case of the grass is always greener. More often then not my suspension puts a big smile on my face and surprises me when im really putting it to the test.
derekdevasia
New member
I think I would have gone with coilovers over getting the Bilstein 5100's. Just being able to compensate for additional weight without having to swap over springs. Height wise, I would still go 3 inches.
Currently running 5100's all the way around, with Toytech/Eibach coils in the front, and toytec super flex in the rear.
Currently running 5100's all the way around, with Toytech/Eibach coils in the front, and toytec super flex in the rear.
bombventure
New member
I would’ve avoided a spacer lift and went straight for a new shock & spring setup to get the lift out of that vs spacers. Also because my front springs are starting to sag at 123k.
Nothing wrong with the spacers in my opinion, but for me and where the mileage is on my 4R, I figure now it would’ve been best to do it this way because I’m more than positive the springs I have are OEM and I’m not sure how old my current front shocks are, they were on the 4R when I purchased it. I’m at 123k now, so I wouldn’t say I regret going the route I did because it does exactly what I need it to do and it worked for my budget at the time. I wasn’t really wanting to put down the extra cash for new shocks/springs on top of new tires and wheels, especially since I knew the shocks had at least been changed before I got the 4R at 111k miles. I also at the time didn’t think I’d be taking my 2wd off-road much but I was wrong and overestimated a lot of the terrain I wanted to explore, so a ‘proper’ lift is in the future for me regardless.
Like mentioned above it really all depends what you plan on using your 4R for, what you plan on carrying with you on trips, where you take the 4R, how much offroading, etc.
Nothing wrong with the spacers in my opinion, but for me and where the mileage is on my 4R, I figure now it would’ve been best to do it this way because I’m more than positive the springs I have are OEM and I’m not sure how old my current front shocks are, they were on the 4R when I purchased it. I’m at 123k now, so I wouldn’t say I regret going the route I did because it does exactly what I need it to do and it worked for my budget at the time. I wasn’t really wanting to put down the extra cash for new shocks/springs on top of new tires and wheels, especially since I knew the shocks had at least been changed before I got the 4R at 111k miles. I also at the time didn’t think I’d be taking my 2wd off-road much but I was wrong and overestimated a lot of the terrain I wanted to explore, so a ‘proper’ lift is in the future for me regardless.
Like mentioned above it really all depends what you plan on using your 4R for, what you plan on carrying with you on trips, where you take the 4R, how much offroading, etc.
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alextmullis
New member
I wouldnt have wasted time with Bilsteins. If you don’t off-road, sure they’re fine but are not great
Not sure how directly applicable this is. I drove a 2010 lifted tacoma, with OME coils and bilstien 5100's before I sold it for my current '03 T4R. I had 2 issues with my Tacoma's suspension:
1) better, firmer than stock, but still bouncy and brick like. Supposedly this was more of a tacoma thing, that we don't experience in 4runners.
2) Stock UCA's. SUCKED. I was lifted barely 2" and my alignment just wasn't the same. I definitely felt the "floaty" sensation people talk about with lifted trucks plus stock UCA's. Bump steer was significantly increased.
3) Paying someone else to install, without doing my research on them: they broke one of my ABS sensors, didn't align well, and were terrible to work with. I didn't do my research on a good shop, got too lazy to install myself, and just had a random shop do it. Biggest mistake of all. Installing shocks and springs is not complicated, I could have done it myself, enjoyed the work, and gotten a quality alignment from my regular mechanic, and had a much less stressful install process.
Overall, while my truck drove and tracked near straight, and it handled tightly, but steering and handling was in some ways NOT improved over stock.
After that experience, I will never again lift a toyota with any sort of lift, without
1) upgrading to adjustable UCA's
2) spending $$ on a good, EXACT alignment after the fact
3) choosing softer valved shocks meant for loads and offroading
4) installing the lift myself
Have a full Dobinsons kit in my garage, waiting to be installed on my T4R, including Dobinsons UCA's. Expecting much better results.
1) better, firmer than stock, but still bouncy and brick like. Supposedly this was more of a tacoma thing, that we don't experience in 4runners.
2) Stock UCA's. SUCKED. I was lifted barely 2" and my alignment just wasn't the same. I definitely felt the "floaty" sensation people talk about with lifted trucks plus stock UCA's. Bump steer was significantly increased.
3) Paying someone else to install, without doing my research on them: they broke one of my ABS sensors, didn't align well, and were terrible to work with. I didn't do my research on a good shop, got too lazy to install myself, and just had a random shop do it. Biggest mistake of all. Installing shocks and springs is not complicated, I could have done it myself, enjoyed the work, and gotten a quality alignment from my regular mechanic, and had a much less stressful install process.
Overall, while my truck drove and tracked near straight, and it handled tightly, but steering and handling was in some ways NOT improved over stock.
After that experience, I will never again lift a toyota with any sort of lift, without
1) upgrading to adjustable UCA's
2) spending $$ on a good, EXACT alignment after the fact
3) choosing softer valved shocks meant for loads and offroading
4) installing the lift myself
Have a full Dobinsons kit in my garage, waiting to be installed on my T4R, including Dobinsons UCA's. Expecting much better results.
OzarkRunner
New member
This. I would have completely skipped over the initial 5100 and Moog spring lift I started with and went straight for the coilovers. The original lift wasn't bad, but it never gave me confidence. I don't wheel it hard (rough forest roads at worst), but the coilovers ride so much better.
fordracing19
New member
I did the Toytec Ultimate kit first. The Bilsteins were junk. I then went Icon with CDCV front and back and removed both sway bars. I like it so much better. Wish I wouldn't of cheaped out the first time since it failed after 5k miles.
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Terminator03
New member
This is a great thread for me since I’ve been researching lift components for a couple of months now, and it’s daunting because there are so many paths to take! Thanks for posting the question!
blackoutt
New member
Same input as others above, if you plan on doing any real offroading (even just 10% of your miles) skip the spacers and 5100s, go straight to a coilover (brand not terribly important), UCA's that allow more caster for a comfortable alignment, AND long travel rear springs even if you don't have long travel rear shocks, just get as long as possible. Rear travel makes up a lot for the lack of front travel. Other than that I would have chucked my rear sway bar at the beginning, does nothing for me except limit travel and rattle. Front others get rid of but I can't stand driving with out it.
Inv4drZm
Senior Member
I don't regret anything I have done so far. I bought a set of 5100s but sold them before installation because I knew I would eventually upgrade to the adjustable coilovers anyway. LT front/rear is of course the next step but I don't think anybody should skip mid travel.
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Inv4drZm
Senior Member
Have you tried removing just the front sway bar and leaving the rear on?
Not that this is more than a theory but I think there is an argument for keeping the rear and removing the front sway bar. The rear will still get a decent amount of travel with the sway bar, but you want the front to be as flexible as possible and keeping the rear sway bar on will put more pressure on the front to flex, you want to flex out both front and rear equally and not keep the IFS flat. If you drive up an RTI ramp not much weight is on the front so the back does a lot of the work. When you get stuck is when you are driving up something with more weight transferred to the rear.
I've always wondered if there is actually a large performance gain by a super drooped rear tire that doesn't have much weight on the ground. On paper, I would prefer a locker to solve that problem.
blackoutt
New member
The logic makes sense but in the real world my rear sway bar links kept coming loose and rattling then I broke a sway bar mounting bolt and didn't miss it so it's never going back on.
I find that the rear of my rig as always way heavier than the front when out on camping/wheeling trips. I should weight F/R sometime to get a distribution but at least in ruts it feels like my rear sticks better. A rear locker with longest travel possible would be best solution, agreed!
Drunner97
New member
I don't think LT is the logical next step for what I do because it pushes things out in the front and some of the trails out here are tight enough as is. If I was to do it all over again, I'd skip the Icons and kings, go straight to a custom valved ADS set up with front secondaries and rear triple bypasses. It's not long travel but it will ride pretty damned cushioned.
The problem with questions like these are not everyone knows what they're going to do with their rig when they start modding it. If I had done the above right off the start, I would have needed to change the valving in the shocks as soon as I started adding plate bumpers, and roof racks, and steel skids, etc, etc. I always tell people to wheel it stock before they start deciding what they want to do. Maybe you like driving fast, but hate the rocks. Or vice versa. You want to crawl but going fast to get to the crawling trails just doesn't matter to you. That's the only way you'll know for sure how to "one and done" your suspension setups before you start modding.
The problem with questions like these are not everyone knows what they're going to do with their rig when they start modding it. If I had done the above right off the start, I would have needed to change the valving in the shocks as soon as I started adding plate bumpers, and roof racks, and steel skids, etc, etc. I always tell people to wheel it stock before they start deciding what they want to do. Maybe you like driving fast, but hate the rocks. Or vice versa. You want to crawl but going fast to get to the crawling trails just doesn't matter to you. That's the only way you'll know for sure how to "one and done" your suspension setups before you start modding.
blackoutt
New member
Also solid advice ^^^
Step 1: build rig to a "just enough" level (even stock) to get out there and see what you want to do, where your shortcomings are, and what you really NEED.
Step 2: iterative build process.
Step 3: iterative go outside process.
Step 4: repeat steps 2-3 as many times as necessary and reassess as needed.
Drunner97
New member
I'm currently evaluating and saving for the 3rd suspension change. haha. The Icons have done well, but it's time for a better ride getting to the crawling trails. I probably won't go as drastic as secondaries and triple bypasses, but I'm definitely looking at ADS over King right now.
Inv4drZm
Senior Member
As if there weren't enough options.
Getting the right wheels could push them back in a couple inches... Walk them in closer to your spindle gussets or you could have even more room with bare spindles. A guy on the FJ forums has a +3.5" build that looks like +2". Pretty sick.
Nothing, but I'm probably in the minority. I may have a simple/cheap 5100/FJ suspension but that's still been good enough for me to clear trails like Fins 'n' Things in Moab. At the same time, it didn't completely destroy on-road ride and handling. That's where my truck is 99% of the time.
