Is 195K too many miles for a dependable 4Runner

[RobS10]

We have never owned anything with more than 125K miles on it before. Is 195K miles on a 3rd Gen getting up there? We have owned our '99 4Runner 4x4 since 2004 and put 125K on it, now at the 195K mark, changed timing belt/water pump+ pulleys twice, and all fluids religiously. We have had a few $$ issues like rear axle seals x 2 and lower ball joints, but no other major issues, and she still runs great. My question for all you higher mileage 3rd Gen owners out there is do you still trust it off road? We have a remote cabin that's 17 miles of dirt road to get to, some not the greatest. A tow out is REEEEELY expensive! My wife thinks it's going to break down with that many miles on it, but have heard otherwise. What's youse guys's experience with this generation 4Runner with this kind of mileage?
BTW, we are looking to eventually pick up a 5th Gen as an additional vehicle, so the '99 will probably NOT see dirt after that.

 

[Brian.]

Maintained, that's probably the half-life of what *I* would be comfortable with (meaning I'd have no issues till 400k miles, unless it showed other signs). But I've run vehicles to over 400k miles without issue beyond normal maintenance and some things you'd expect (lost an alternator at 326k miles once, clutch was going at 411k miles).

Why are YOU doubting it? What's given reason... or is it just the pervasive marketing of "over xxx miles is no longer reliable" BS? Unless you have Reason to doubt the 4r, why would you? If you're honestly concerned, pay a shop to do a through inspection, like a pre-purchase inspection but more involved, and see what they say would be needed to be on comparable grounds to a 50k miles vehicle. That'll cost maybe $300~500 and they'll find probably $2000~4000 worth of work (bushings, shocks, hoses, maybe some gaskets, wheel bearings, maybe brake rotors). *THEN* make a decision on what you'll do.

I see you're in California with the abundance of Money Trees just littering the ground with hundreds. So maybe buying something else isn't a big deal, in which case just got ahead and do it. Happy wife, happy life. Someone else will be MORE than happy to take your 3rd gen and run it for the next 200k miles (if not more).

 

[cl4Rk]

changed timing belt/water pump+ pulleys twice, and all fluids religiously. We have had a few $$ issues like rear axle seals x 2 and lower ball joints, but no other major issues, and she still runs great.

Sounds like you should be good.

A couple things come to mind:

1. If you have an automatic transmission, I would replace the radiator (if it’s original) as relatively cheap insurance against the Strawberry Milkshake.

2. The starter can sometimes fail without warning at this mileage (ask me how I know!) and that would leave you stranded (and depending on the type of failure, could start a fire if you don’t pull the negative battery connection in time).

I’m sure there are a few other preventative measures you could and probably should take, but the mileage alone is not worrisome to me personally.

And like [MENTION=315156]Brian.[/MENTION] said, a comprehensive inspection will give you a laundry list of items from which you can cherry pick high priority jobs, or just sell and move on.

But I expect that the consensus here on this forum is that 200k miles on a well maintained 5vz-fe is not really considered high mileage.

 

[2001 Limited 285K]

Is 195K miles on a 3rd Gen getting up there?

Not even close. Just to speak for myself, I'm closing in on 300K miles and shooting for 500K. Have had to put $4K - $5K into it between 250K miles and now though. Work included:

- Valve cover gaskets
- Timing belt / water pump
- Exhaust pipe + muffler
- Turn signal switcher
- SafeTCap for rear frame rot near muffler
- Starter
- Alternator
- Rack bushings
- LBJs
- Re-seal the oil pan
- Power Steering Flush
- Battery

Some of that's just routine maintenance but I had three oil leaks (timing belt front seal area, valve cover gaskets, oil pan seal) around 250K that took the better part of three years to finally get fixed.

I still get the P440, 441, 446 codes every once in awhile but they're low priority for me since they're so sporadic and easy to clear with an Actron code reader. I also need new tires, but that's a year out from now.

She runs like a dream, has 4WD, and gets pretty good gas mileage. Can't ask for much more, really.

 

[Devbot]

With all due respect your wife sounds more out of the loop than you do if she thinks it's gonna "break down" at that mileage just because it sees some trails. I'd put money down in saying I bet your 3rd gen will outlast your 5th gen - hell, I'll go as far to say it'll last TWICE as long, seeing how they get recalled nearly every damn year.
I put a lift on my vehicle at 285k, nearly at 295k now and just went wheeling last weekend. No rock crawling or cliff climbing, just some dilapidated and run down trails probably very similar to what you're describing. Ate it right up like nothing and still runs like a top. There's many users here in the 300 Club. I think the highest mileage I've seen here is 700k.
Most "major" repair the vehicle has undergone in its lifetime was a new 3rd member replaced which was unnecessarily done. Other than that, routine maintenance all the way. Just replacing things as they wear, tackling one thing at a time. Should be noted LBJs are NOT a costly repair at all and shouldn't be a reason to abandon the vehicle. In general try not to get caught up in the cost of maintenance, that's just part of owning ANY vehicle let alone one that is 20 years old. And seeing as you live in San Fran, and said you have a private cabin, I suspect you can probably afford it better than most.
It really comes down to how dedicated you are to the vehicle. Some people here in the rust belt undergo frame swaps because they love their 4Runners, whereas most people would NEVER contemplate such a level of work. These cars will last as long as you want them to.

 

[frank_socal]

I'm going on 315K miles and it runs great off-road.

 

[RobS10]

Maintained, that's probably the half-life of what *I* would be comfortable with (meaning I'd have no issues till 400k miles, unless it showed other signs). But I've run vehicles to over 400k miles without issue beyond normal maintenance and some things you'd expect (lost an alternator at 326k miles once, clutch was going at 411k miles).

Why are YOU doubting it? What's given reason... or is it just the pervasive marketing of "over xxx miles is no longer reliable" BS? Unless you have Reason to doubt the 4r, why would you? If you're honestly concerned, pay a shop to do a through inspection, like a pre-purchase inspection but more involved, and see what they say would be needed to be on comparable grounds to a 50k miles vehicle. That'll cost maybe $300~500 and they'll find probably $2000~4000 worth of work (bushings, shocks, hoses, maybe some gaskets, wheel bearings, maybe brake rotors). *THEN* make a decision on what you'll do.

I see you're in California with the abundance of Money Trees just littering the ground with hundreds. So maybe buying something else isn't a big deal, in which case just got ahead and do it. Happy wife, happy life. Someone else will be MORE than happy to take your 3rd gen and run it for the next 200k miles (if not more).

Thatnks for the input. A lot has to do with the wife just wanting something new, and the old school thinking that we grew up with that cars start to become money pits after 100K. That is a Legacy fear, based on older American cars that we grew up with, and this is our first Toyota.

 

[RobS10]

With all due respect your wife sounds more out of the loop than you do if she thinks it's gonna "break down" at that mileage just because it sees some trails. I'd put money down in saying I bet your 3rd gen will outlast your 5th gen - hell, I'll go as far to say it'll last TWICE as long, seeing how they get recalled nearly every damn year.
I put a lift on my vehicle at 285k, nearly at 295k now and just went wheeling last weekend. No rock crawling or cliff climbing, just some dilapidated and run down trails probably very similar to what you're describing. Ate it right up like nothing and still runs like a top. There's many users here in the 300 Club. I think the highest mileage I've seen here is 700k.
Most "major" repair the vehicle has undergone in its lifetime was a new 3rd member replaced which was unnecessarily done. Other than that, routine maintenance all the way. Just replacing things as they wear, tackling one thing at a time. Should be noted LBJs are NOT a costly repair at all and shouldn't be a reason to abandon the vehicle. In general try not to get caught up in the cost of maintenance, that's just part of owning ANY vehicle let alone one that is 20 years old. And seeing as you live in San Fran, and said you have a private cabin, I suspect you can probably afford it better than most.
It really comes down to how dedicated you are to the vehicle. Some people here in the rust belt undergo frame swaps because they love their 4Runners, whereas most people would NEVER contemplate such a level of work. These cars will last as long as you want them to.

Thanks! "Cost of owning the vehicle" is my philosophy exactly, when you weigh the cost of a NEW one.
Despite where we live, my wife and I are by no means high income, just grew up here and lucky to have bought a place many years before housing costs got stupid .

 

[RobS10]

Not even close. Just to speak for myself, I'm closing in on 300K miles and shooting for 500K. Have had to put $4K - $5K into it between 250K miles and now though. Work included:

- Valve cover gaskets
- Timing belt / water pump
- Exhaust pipe + muffler
- Turn signal switcher
- SafeTCap for rear frame rot near muffler
- Starter
- Alternator
- Rack bushings
- LBJs
- Re-seal the oil pan
- Power Steering Flush
- Battery

Some of that's just routine maintenance but I had three oil leaks (timing belt front seal area, valve cover gaskets, oil pan seal) around 250K that took the better part of three years to finally get fixed.

I still get the P440, 441, 446 codes every once in awhile but they're low priority for me since they're so sporadic and easy to clear with an Actron code reader. I also need new tires, but that's a year out from now.

She runs like a dream, has 4WD, and gets pretty good gas mileage. Can't ask for much more, really.

Sounds familiar ;-). We've been through two timing belts/water pumps, batteries, two starters, valve cover gaskets (looks like may need another set), rear axle seals and the Cat is getting weak.

 

[RobS10]

Sounds like you should be good.

A couple things come to mind:

1. If you have an automatic transmission, I would replace the radiator (if it’s original) as relatively cheap insurance against the Strawberry Milkshake.

2. The starter can sometimes fail without warning at this mileage (ask me how I know!) and that would leave you stranded (and depending on the type of failure, could start a fire if you don’t pull the negative battery connection in time).

I’m sure there are a few other preventative measures you could and probably should take, but the mileage alone is not worrisome to me personally.

And like [MENTION=315156]Brian.[/MENTION] said, a comprehensive inspection will give you a laundry list of items from which you can cherry pick high priority jobs, or just sell and move on.

But I expect that the consensus here on this forum is that 200k miles on a well maintained 5vz-fe is not really considered high mileage.

We're on our third starter. I think the shop put in a heavier duty one last time, it spins faster than the earlier replacement one did when brand new.

 

[Devbot]

Thanks! "Cost of owning the vehicle" is my philosophy exactly, when you weigh the cost of a NEW one.
Despite where we live, my wife and I are by no means high income, just grew up here and lucky to have bought a place many years before housing costs got stupid .

All in all it could be MUCH worse, we have great parts availability with these vehicles and there's not much that's an unreasonably expensive fix (aside from some 01-02 parts.) And there's certainly no shortage of these trucks out there to use for donor parts if need be, and also means information for practically any fix is readily available. Great aftermarket that only keeps increasing, etc. There are way worse cars to try and hold onto for sure
I can relate, was born near Seattle and both houses I lived in as a kid are now worth 6-7x what we had them for. Just since pandemic started the average cost has risen well over $100k in my area. Outrageous, but I digress :blah:

 

[Endlessblockades]

I was gonna say that a lot of folks in 'San Fran' driving 3rd Gens are still union/working class types and are only still here due to a variety of reasons like lucky/timely property acquisition, cryptocurrency, or generational succession. I'm a rent-controlled renter. It IS a very fair assumption, however, that if someone has moved here in the last 5 years, has a 5th Gen and a cabin that they are not living paycheck-to-paycheck like me! Those people are rather unlikely to be on tr4.org asking questions unless they also happen to have extremely good taste.
Keeping the 4Runner going is like holding onto property during a major downturn - don't let it go due to unfounded worries! Trying to buy in again will be very painful.....

 

[JoeT4R]

[MENTION=140914]RobS10[/MENTION] Rob, I definitely understand your way of thinking. However I bought my current 3rd gen in 2013 with 191K on it, bone stock. Built it up over the last couple of years, to include normal maintenance and even the more in depth things like timing belt, water pump, radiator replacement, LBJ's, etc. I'm gonna hit 300K in the next two months I'd say. Quite honestly, if you've owned it for this long I'd say keep the thing and wheel it as often as you can! Especially if you have other means of reliable transportation. And just like what [MENTION=549924]Devbot[/MENTION] said, I couldn't say it any better, these rigs will last as long as you want them to! I really think the 3rd gen community is blessed to have such incredible vehicles... they're more than SUV's, they're an investment in something worth while

 

[3bears]

I did not see a radiator listed, you should do that soon. My current 4runner is at 280k, and after a few more repairs will trust it to go into some real out back ( we have roads up here with no cell or cb radio reception)

surely in your area is a good independent toyota mechanic,,,, not a dealer. YOu can ask on the forums for recomendations if needed. I would have them really ceck it out for you and give thier reccomendations.

you can also try this part of the forum....however, im not sure what part San Fran is considered....north or south....so you might have to change to a different club


https://www.toyota-4runner.org/so-cal/

 

[Endlessblockades]

There is a shop on Geary in the Inner Richmond near Park Presidio/12th Ave called the Toy Shop. They get great reviews, recommend using OEM parts without being told, will happily install whatever you bought online (lift suspension, for example) and are quite a bit cheaper than the dealer. I've had them do 2 axles and shocks and springs install and LBJs. There are plenty of other shops - that's just my experience - it has been good. You have to show up there to talk. They don't have time to chat about options on the phone.
[MENTION=124615]3bears[/MENTION] SF is most def NorCal! and natives call it Frisco - Herb Caen was wrong. Saying 'San Fran' is like going to Reno NV and saying 'NevAHHda'. Instantly pegs you as a transplant.

 

[FD7683]

Still a baby under 200K as long as all maintenance has been done.

 

[RobS10]

"1. If you have an automatic transmission, I would replace the radiator (if it’s original) as relatively cheap insurance against the Strawberry Milkshake"
Yikes! Is this a common issue?

 

[cl4Rk]

"1. If you have an automatic transmission, I would replace the radiator (if it’s original) as relatively cheap insurance against the Strawberry Milkshake"
Yikes! Is this a common issue?

Not very common, but it does happen, and it’s catastrophic when it does happen. If you have an automatic transmission and an original radiator, you should consider replacing it.

 

[Brian.]

"1. If you have an automatic transmission, I would replace the radiator (if it’s original) as relatively cheap insurance against the Strawberry Milkshake"
Yikes! Is this a common issue?

The issue is mitigated with consistent fluid changes and sticking to the proper fluids (no just dumping in any old antifreeze)... but yeah, it's one of the leading non-accident reasons for totaled 4runners (if not the absolute leader).

Radiator Assembly - Toyota (16410-AZ011)

Shows as $109.29 from my local dealer (internet pricing, before taxes), I'm not a fan of plastic tanked radiators so went with the $200 all-aluminum Champion radiator (CC1998). Just a lttle additional piece of mind for me, though it has issues too (fit can be wonky).

 

[RobS10]

I used to work at a gas station in high school and never forget a car that came in with a cracked block. The oil looked like butterscotch pudding. I'll ask our mechanic about this for sure (I quit doing most maintenance a few years ago when we found an ex-Toyota factory mechanic opened up a shop 1 block from my work. He's honest and very reasonable)