Is everyone running 87 Octane in 2010 4Runner?

The TIS for the 2010 FJ states 260hp on 87 octane or higher.* The TIS for the 2010 4Runner states 270hp on 87 octane or higher. Intake, surge tank, ECU tuning, and exhaust can all make a difference on peak power, so I'm not shocked that there is a difference between the two. Based on the TIS, though, you're getting 270hp on 87 octane fuel.

* The old 1GR shows 239hp on 91 octane, FWIW.
 
The dual vvt-i 1GR-FE in the 5ths senses that a higher octane fuel is used most likely by the knock sensors and vvt-i exhaust sensors and adjust the valve timing to get more power......Nobody else has noticed different HP ratings for the 4runners in reviews?

I have a ScangaugeII....I of course played with different rated fuels and yes you do get an increase in HP.....An updated version of this engine features Dual VVT-i, increasing output to 254 hp (189 kW) and 270 lb·ft (366 N·m) on 87 octane and 285 hp (213 kW) and 289 lb·ft (392 N·m) on 91 octane.

The thick plottens.
 
I have a ScangaugeII ScanGaugeII - Trip Computers + Digital Gauges + Scan Tool in my truck and reading it all the time I always have one plugged in my OBDII port.

I also have a ScanGauge and wasn't aware it had a horsepower readout. That readout would obviously not be terribly accurate (especially given the very high numbers yours is showing), but I'll bet it's at least consistent. That would allow you to fairly reliably note if you are getting consistent increases with higher octane. Handy.
 
I also have a ScanGauge and wasn't aware it had a horsepower readout. That readout would obviously not be terribly accurate (especially given the very high numbers yours is showing), but I'll bet it's at least consistent. That would allow you to fairly reliably note if you are getting consistent increases with higher octane. Handy.
Is yours a ScanGaugeII? Here's how to program it for HP with the new x-gauge software? ScanGaugeII - Add-A-Gauge
and more about other x-gauge features. ScanGaugeII - Add-A-Gauge
A real data logger hooked up to a laptop would be better to track for different fuels though.

I don't think the peak HP numbers are that terribly out of sorts considering I have DT long tube headers that eliminated the front 2 cats but ya they are probably optimistic.Really woke this motor up and can't wait for the TRD CAI to come out any day now.
Here is a good pdf to read on the changes to the 2010 1GR-FE engines found and posted by 1000MPH. FJ'S and 5ths have the same engine.Alot of potential with the new features!http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/70561-2010-sr5-engine-sound.html#post604923
 
87 or higher

well I just switch over to 93 and I could tell the difference I have for some reason a better responce when stepping on the gas pedal and it seems to me it's a bit smoother running
 
The manual say you can use 87 or Higher. Higher octane will burn cleaner less deposit, benefit in a long run, just like oil, regular oil meet all requirements, good enough but syntactic oil is better if you can afford it

Is this true on burning cleaner? Is there any difference in the amount of detergents in the higher octane fuel as well?
 
Is this true on burning cleaner? Is there any difference in the amount of detergents in the higher octane fuel as well?

Why do you have to insult me, If you don't like what I said then you should do whatever you want, it is your money and it is your truck but insulting others in an open forums like this is uncivilized Bros and that not to mention that you have broken this forums 's rules
 
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Why do you have to insult me, If you don't like what I said then you should do whatever you want, it is your money and it is your truck but insulting others in an open forums like this is uncivilized Bros and that not to mention that you have broken this forums 's rules
He asked a question. He neither insulted you not acted uncivilized and I can't see how he broke any rules.
 
Why do you have to insult me, If you don't like what I said then you should do whatever you want, it is your money and it is your truck but insulting others in an open forums like this is uncivilized Bros and that not to mention that you have broken this forums 's rules

Hey man, sorry you took my question as an insult, it was not intended as one. I have just heard varying accounts from people, mechanics included, regarding the deposits left over from different types of gasoline. Some say it doesn't matter, others say higher octane fuels leave less deposits. The reason I ask is that i was having fuel injector issues with a 2nd gen once it got over 100K miles. I was having trouble starting it after not driving it for a day or two. A mechanic told me to fill it up with premium and treat it with fuel injector cleaner, and it seemed to work. He told me with to use premium about once every two months. Another mechanic told me the octane level doesn't matter at all with regards to deposits. Just wondering, again, no offense intended at all.
 
Can someone elaborate?

Does this mean that 7/11, wa-wa, turkey hill, and giant (all sellers of discount gas in my area), actually get blends that are lower in quality than a branded gas station (Exxon, Mobil, etc)..What about Luk-Oil, a chain that is big at least in the mid-atlantic region.

On a side note..... Don't use off brand gas. The gas from 7/11 and other discount retailers is a nasty concoction of gasoline. The way they normally get there gas is actually from the main gasoline manufactures exxon/mobile/chevron etc.... But the gas that those brands sell the discounts stores was from batches of gas that didn't match their quality or yeild specifications. So you may be pumping exxon gas into your tank at that travel stop but its exxon gas that barely meets the federal/local standard for gas and isn't up to par of exxons/etc brand quality.
 
Hey man, sorry you took my question as an insult, it was not intended as one. I have just heard varying accounts from people, mechanics included, regarding the deposits left over from different types of gasoline. Some say it doesn't matter, others say higher octane fuels leave less deposits. The reason I ask is that i was having fuel injector issues with a 2nd gen once it got over 100K miles. I was having trouble starting it after not driving it for a day or two. A mechanic told me to fill it up with premium and treat it with fuel injector cleaner, and it seemed to work. He told me with to use premium about once every two months. Another mechanic told me the octane level doesn't matter at all with regards to deposits. Just wondering, again, no offense intended at all.

I am sorry for taking your honest question in a wrong way. Call me an Idiot. :toilet3:

Back to your question. We all know the higher the octane the more flammable, the result it was burned quicker make the timing more accurately and that why it reduce engine knock. The it more flammable it has less residual leftover and that means less built up on the cylinder heads and around the Valves sockets area. As far as formula, each gasoline brand are different than the next but they have to meet the requirement by the environmental of that local law, different region also has different formula to meet that region law, so it really hard to say if it has more or less detergents or not.
 
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Snow fox, thanks I appreciate the information. I have a follow-up question because i am still confused. I thought higher octane fuels are actually less flammable and more stable which allows them to prevent early combustion and pinging. Perhaps, it's the fact higher octane requires more compression to ignite and thus burns at a higher temperature which minimizes deposits?
 
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I am sorry for taking your honest question in a wrong way. Call me an Idiot. :toilet3:

Back to your question. We all know the higher the octane the more flammable, the result it was burned quicker make the timing more accurately and that why it reduce engine knock. The it more flammable it has less residual leftover and that means less built up on the cylinder heads and around the Valves sockets area. As far as formula, each gasoline brand are different than the next but they have to meet the requirement by the environmental of that local law, different region also has different formula to meet that region law, so it really hard to say if it has more or less detergents or not.

Higher octane isn't "more flammable". The higher the octane, the more it resists compression ignition. Basically, instead of the fuel igniting because it is being compressed with air, it ignites when the spark plug fires. It isn't so much timed more accurately... it just ignites when the ECU tells it to.

Octane has nothing to do with buildup on the valves. That is more related to how the PCV recirculates the crankcase vapors back into the intake and the general quality of the fuel. My GTI used premium fuel and those engines are notorious for carbon buildup on the valves.
 
Quentin has it right. To put it in other words, higher octane gas simply has a higher temperature at which it ignites. I'm about to write a book here, so get comfortable. For those of you who don't really understand how motors and octane work, it might be worth the read.

It helps if you imagine (in slow motion) how the combustion stroke of an engine works. As the piston rises and starts to compress the air and fuel mixture that is in the cylinder chamber, that mixture starts to get hotter and hotter. This happens any time you compress something; its temperature rises. So that air-fuel mixture gets hotter and hotter as it's getting compressed more and more. Normally, when the piston finally gets near the top of the stroke and the air fuel mixture is compressed just the right amount, the spark plug fires and ignites that compressed air-fuel mixture, causing a really powerful explosion that forces the piston back down. That's where the motor's power comes from.

Knocking (pre-detonation) occurs when the air-fuel mixtures gets so hot while it's being compressed that it spontaneously ignites *before* the spark plug fires. This means it explodes while the piston is still going up, so you suddenly have this huge explosive force pushing down on the piston while the rest of the motor is trying to push the piston up. That's why pre-detonation can destroy your motor. It can bend and break all sorts of stuff.

So if your motor is starting to pre-detonate, that means the air-fuel mixture is reaching its ignition temperature too soon, and thus you need to somehow make it so that the the mixture doesn't explode so early. If you are running 87 octane fuel, then you can try using a higher octane fuel. The higher octane (like 91) will require a higher temperature before it explodes. Hopefully, that higher octane will be enough for the piston to compress all the way up so that the spark plug fires *before* the fuel mixture spontaneously explodes. You never want the fuel mixture to explode on its own. You always want the spark plug to cause the explosion.

When the fuel finally does ignite, though, it has the same explosive force no matter what octane you are using. Whether it's 87 or 93 octane, the explosive force is the same. The only difference is the temperature at which the fuel would explode on its own if given the chance. Like I said, though, you never want that to happen. You always want the spark plug causing the explosion. :)

So given all that information, you can see that if your engine is not pre-detonating with 87 octane, then using higher octane won't give you more power. In that circumstance, no matter which octane you use, the spark plug is causing the explosion. And that's a good thing! That means you can run 87 and not worry about it. Of course, you could run 93 also, and it wouldn't hurt anything, but it's unnecessary.

Now, there is a bit more to the story. In a motor with electronic timing control and knock sensors, it can detect when that pre-detonation is happening. When it detects it, it can very quickly back off the timing of the motor to prevent that pre-detonation. That's great and your engine is once again running perfectly safely, but the downside is that you lose a bit of power when it backs off the timing. So, to get that timing advanced again, you can put in higher octane. The timing system in the computer is always trying to advance the timing a little bit at a time to figure out just where the limit is before pre-detonation happens. So if you put higher octane in, the computer will keep advancing the timing a little at a time, giving you a little more power.

It's important to remember that the computer can only advance the timing so much, though. Once it has reached the extent of its adjustment range, it can go no further, and that's as much power as you'll get from that motor no matter how much higher of an octane you put in it. The real question for everyone here is: Which octane of fuel allows the computer to advance the timing all the way to its limit in the 5th-gen 4runner? If maximum timing advance can be reached with 87 octane, then anything higher is a waste. If maximum advance can be reached with 91 octane, then running 91 will give you a little more power.

I don't know the answer to that, but anecdotal evidence here in this thread suggests that some people are indeed seeing increases in power with higher octanes. Other people aren't seeing any difference at all. It will depend on a lot of factors, such as:
  • Your elevation (do you live near the coast or way up in the mountains?)
  • How hot it is outside?
  • In what environmental factors did the Toyota engineers design the motor to work at its maximum?

So you can see there is a lot to it, and arguing on this forum simply will never answer the question. Every person will have a different experience since everyone lives in a slightly different environment. One person could go out and do measurements and find that he gets no performance increase with 91 octane over 87, but some other person in a different part of the country can do the exact same test and find that he does see a difference.

I suggest you all simply try running different octanes and see if you can tell a difference. If you cannot tell a different, that's great. Run 87 and save yourself some money. If you think you can tell a difference, feel free to run higher octane. Or maybe you can feel a difference, but it's so small it's not worth the extra money. In that case, be happy with 87 and once again save yourself some money.

Regardless, you won't hurt the engine. And remember that higher octane does not "burn more cleanly." The "cleanliness" of fuel has to do with the various additives different companies put in the fuel. That is something I cannot comment on, since those mixtures are usually a secret, and I don't know of any extensive, long term tests that've been done on different brands of fuel.
 
Jreiter, that is the best combustion write ups I have ever read. Very easy to understand, thanks for the information.
 
Quentin and Jreiter, thank you to both of you for clearing up on the octane confusion.

For all these time I always understand it otherwise how the high octane gas works in the combustion chamber, now i fully understand. Thanks once again.

To 3x4runnerOwner. Sorry to add confusion on top of your confusion, i don't mean purposely to mislead you in anyway but just rather give you the answer which in my best understanding at the time. Hope you have your answer now.
 
Quentin and Jreiter, thank you to both of you for clearing up on the octane confusion.

For all these time I always understand it otherwise how the high octane gas works in the combustion chamber, now i fully understand. Thanks once again.

To 3x4runnerOwner. Sorry to add confusion on top of your confusion, i don't mean purposely to mislead you in anyway but just rather give you the answer which in my best understanding at the time. Hope you have your answer now.

No problem, I was confused before you posted so it wasn't a big deal...thanks to Quentin and Jreiter for there write-ups as well, very informative. I realized my initial question about fuel injector build-up has nothing to do with octane, but actually the quality of the gasoline I was probably using.
 
Not only is the flashpoint higher but there is actually other additives that cause the flame front to propogate slower across the combustion chamber, again to stop pre-ignition (detonation). The fuel itself is the same fuel as premium, the refinery or tank farm actually adds the specific additives at the time the fuel is pumped into the tanker truck to be delivered to the gas station. So "Premium" fuel is doctored so it has less power inherent in it so it doesn't go BANG too soon and tear up your engine. Of course all things being equal a higher compression engine generates more power than a lower compression engine. It just needs slower burning fuel so it won't preignite. The big oil companies are not keen on explaining this clearly to the average joe. They would much prefer everyone think "Premium" means the fuel has more power so they will continue using it when their engine doesn't need it, and would run better on lower octane. That's one of the main reasons they started calling it "Premium"
 
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Been running 87 since the day I got (Dec 2009). No problems even with most of the gas having ethanol in it. Runs smooth and am averaging 21 mpg, except when I tow my boat. Don't see a need for more expensive octane.
 
What about following the rule of " never pump gas when the tanker trucks are filling up the station" ?

I've always gone to another gas station if I saw the gas truck, since it sounds believable that it would swirl up gunk from the bottom of the tank... but if it is true, how long should you wait? Seems like you could just get really unlucky several times and hit the gas pump just minutes after the truck pulled away...

Maybe it would be good to learn our local gas station deliver times. :nerd:
 

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