Modification priority list for performance
- Thread starter sprocket47
- Start date
I was comparing the off-road versions of each vehicle.
Nissan Xterra Pro-4x (auto): 4,432 lb's
Toyota 4runner Trail: 4,750 lb's
So there is at least a 300lb difference between the two, and that 300lb's will make a difference in how the vehicles drive.
The different gear ratios is a good point though and no doubt it creates a difference in how the vehicles drive as well.
By the way, how has your fuel economy fared with the re-gearing you did?
Bevo
New member
Welcome aboard. Sorry we got a little rough with you!
ic0517
New member
===== I have never taken my 4Runner off road, it is a pavement princess =====
And it will stay one, it needs to get kids back and forth to college, then someone will buy it and take it off road.
Find 1engineer's tag line, find the third web link in the list, and click on it, then read it.
Summary - don't f@ck with the engine if you want to maximize your chances of getting back home.
And it will stay one, it needs to get kids back and forth to college, then someone will buy it and take it off road.
Find 1engineer's tag line, find the third web link in the list, and click on it, then read it.
Summary - don't f@ck with the engine if you want to maximize your chances of getting back home.
Cheers!
Member
High end tires are always the best upgrade. Regardless if you have a truck, SUV, supercar, track machine, motorcycle.
Tires will quickly give you the best bang for buck for maximizing whatever activity you are into. Overlanding, rockcrawling, lapping days, autox, HPDE.
Buy the best money can buy. You won't ever regret having amazing tires.
Tires will quickly give you the best bang for buck for maximizing whatever activity you are into. Overlanding, rockcrawling, lapping days, autox, HPDE.
Buy the best money can buy. You won't ever regret having amazing tires.
Swarty
New member
Not the same level though
Fuel Econ balanced out. Lost about 1.5 mpg on the freeway, gained about the same in city and off road. Pick up is much improved. 3.73 to 4.56 gives about 20% more torque to the ground at every rpm. It's hard to beat. Truck downshifts a lot less also which is great. Off road you have more throttle control and engine braking is really improved. Can't recommend it enough for larger tires and towing. After doing this I almost wonder if I shouldn't have gone 4.88 . That puts the pinion pretty small though. Esp in the front.
Yeah, even with the numbers you are using the weight is <10%. It'll make a difference but not like the 20%-25% difference in gearing. But really it all adds up: heavier truck, worse gearing, weird shift points. The feel is slow for sure.
Fuel Econ balanced out. Lost about 1.5 mpg on the freeway, gained about the same in city and off road. Pick up is much improved. 3.73 to 4.56 gives about 20% more torque to the ground at every rpm. It's hard to beat. Truck downshifts a lot less also which is great. Off road you have more throttle control and engine braking is really improved. Can't recommend it enough for larger tires and towing. After doing this I almost wonder if I shouldn't have gone 4.88 . That puts the pinion pretty small though. Esp in the front.
thetechnolust
New member
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sprocket47
New member
Recovery gear for sure. And now after having my rig for a couple weeks, I can comfortably say that the suspension it at the top of my enhancement list. It's awfully soft and dips with braking more that I like. I looked at OME but on the 4Runner it's a 3" lift and I really don't need that much. I'm leaning toward some Bilstein 5100's with the ability to level it, but no lift.
I'm certain there are a ton of suspension posts but if anyone has a quick perfect answer to enhance the suspension with maybe a 1 1/2 " lift, I'd love to hear it. Otherwise I'll do some research.
Here's what I'm feeling with my ride and research, so far:
1. Suspension
2. TRD or K&N Cold Air Intake
3. Magnaflow exhaust (more for sound, but it couldn't hurt)
4. Tires. 255/75R17. I can get them new (take-off) for super cheap and they're readily available around here since it's the stock Rubicon tire and the Jeep guys take them off as soon as they come off the lot to make room for their balloon tires.
5. Fuzzy dice from the mirror
I'm certain there are a ton of suspension posts but if anyone has a quick perfect answer to enhance the suspension with maybe a 1 1/2 " lift, I'd love to hear it. Otherwise I'll do some research.
Here's what I'm feeling with my ride and research, so far:
1. Suspension
2. TRD or K&N Cold Air Intake
3. Magnaflow exhaust (more for sound, but it couldn't hurt)
4. Tires. 255/75R17. I can get them new (take-off) for super cheap and they're readily available around here since it's the stock Rubicon tire and the Jeep guys take them off as soon as they come off the lot to make room for their balloon tires.
5. Fuzzy dice from the mirror
Hellamatic
New member
I'd skip the intake and exhaust. I have a flowmaster cat back and an Airaid CAI on mine, and the gains were minimal - far less than I expected after doing intake/exhaust mods on several of my vehicles throughout the years.
I've accepted something after 3 years of owning my 4Runner: "Performance," as it pertains to a 5th gen, is measured not in horsepower, but in capability offroad. I knew before I bought it that it would never be a speed demon, so rather than focusing on increasing horsepower as I have with projects in the past, I've found much more enjoyment in increasing the offroad capabilities and utility for camping/travel/etc. Plain and simple, this is what a 4Runner does best.
I've accepted something after 3 years of owning my 4Runner: "Performance," as it pertains to a 5th gen, is measured not in horsepower, but in capability offroad. I knew before I bought it that it would never be a speed demon, so rather than focusing on increasing horsepower as I have with projects in the past, I've found much more enjoyment in increasing the offroad capabilities and utility for camping/travel/etc. Plain and simple, this is what a 4Runner does best.
wfo9
New member
Yea, stock skids are a no go.
The typical order I would recommend for a multi purpose trail rig. (again these depends on your needs and after level 1 the daily driver starts to suffer a bit with piss poor mpg. 0 = best on the road with highest reliability. 4 = best on the trail. Everything is a compromise.
Levl 0:
- stock
- min Recovery gear
- better tires
Level 1:
- Lift + 33" tires + UCAs
- Skids
- Sliders
Level 2:
- Gears (4.56)
- Front air Locker, Rear if you don't already have one
- Bigger MT tires (34")
- LT rear springs, brake lines, lower control arms
- Bumpers
- Winch
- Springs up front to handle the added weight
Level 3:
- LT front (requires CV axles, LCA, UCA... Coil overs valved for new ratio)
- Custom Fenders or major cutting clear the tires
- 35" tires
- Custom rear axle to match the track up front
- Lefty dual speed trans case
Level 4:
- SAS
- 3Link rear
- Trailer
- LS1 swap
- Exo cage
- Another truck to daily drive :ballchain:
1engineer
Moderator
Excellent post. This should be what is given to new guys.
It sounds like you are much more interested in "blinging" your truck out than you are in giving it true performance upgrades.
The CAI and exhaust really won't do much except perhaps give you a slightly different soundtrack to listen to.
The tire size you are interested in getting is a downgrade rather than an upgrade, at least for trucking activities.
Fuzzy dice will definitely make up for everything else, so you should totally get those.
If you are interested in making this thing into a "fast street" truck, I could suggest several other options where your money and time would be better spent. The 4runner is not that...at best it's a rugged, mildly capable off-roader, at worst, it's an over-engineered people-mover.
sprocket47
New member
Definitely not interested in bling...I can hold off on the fuzzy dice.
The air intake and exhaust, as other posters said, worked well on other vehicles so I assumed it would benefit on the 4runner. Apparently not? Just the air intake alone on my manual transmission Xterra worked wonders.
I absolutely don't want a bling lift. If I did, I wouldn't be considering OME.
I curious about the tire comment: Why is going 255/75 M/T tire a downgrade from the stock 265/70? Those tires seem much more capable in off road than the stock.
I need to walk that delicate line of having a daily driver and occasional long road trip vehicle with the ability to do moderate off road, not rock crawling.
I tow an expedition trailer with 32" tires and independent suspension along with 2 growing boys in the back seat. Although I don't load the trailer very heavy, I do need the suspension to adapt to that easily. I was prepared to install a Timbren suspension kit on my last vehicle and from comments, it sounds like I'll benefit from doing that on the 4Runner as well.
Thanks for all your help!
1engineer
Moderator
From what you just posted you need a set of AT tires and maybe some airbags for the rear. Nothing else. This will take you everywhere you want. Rock crawling requires a different set of mods.
MT tires are terrible on the road. Stopping distance alone (not to mention noise or wet weather performance or snow and ice) is a reason not to run them on a predominantly street driven vehicle. They are built for mud.
Your vehicle already has a CAI from the factory. Open the hood and look at it. You mention cat back exhaust. Which cat? There are seven on the 4Runner. Now if you want to rip out your existing exhaust and run custom headers and a new exhaust all the way back then yes, you can get a few HP's there. Anything else is just for show and noise.
Although your offroad trailer doesn't sound heavy, I'd consider some airbags for your rear springs: https://www.airliftcompany.com/products/air-springs/air-lift-1000/.
4RnR Grl
New member
I had a TRD CAI gifted to me. This is the ONLY reason why I have one installed, especially after research on this forum. The sound is more distinct and it deletes the intake "mufflers" (increasing the noise), but more power? Nada. On previous vehicles I have owned there was a noted difference. Not on the 4Runner. I drive A LOT... I would notice it.
Get some good tires and drive it. It is PERFECTLY capable off road completely stock for what it sounds like you will be doing. My truck is a testament to that.
Get some airbags to help with the rear sagging with hauling and upgrade the suspension to improve your ride quality. Done and done.
sprocket47
New member
I totally appreciate the difference between an MT and AT tire. I guess I thought it was size that was being pointed out as a non-upgrade from stock. I prefer a 255 or narrower sticking close to the 32" diameter.
If my rig has a CAI then it's encapseled in some sort of freak factory package that looks just like a standard air filter setup. Definitely not the open K&N concept. But if it isn't going to help, then there isn't any point in worrying about it.
So first priority: airbags and suspension (Bilstein)
Also - I know what rock crawling is and what it takes. That was a joke...
If my rig has a CAI then it's encapseled in some sort of freak factory package that looks just like a standard air filter setup. Definitely not the open K&N concept. But if it isn't going to help, then there isn't any point in worrying about it.
So first priority: airbags and suspension (Bilstein)
Also - I know what rock crawling is and what it takes. That was a joke...
flyboysgt
New member
While it isn't like adding a supercharger to your truck, apparently the TRD intake does help. Gains are minimal, but it has been dyno proven on this forum that there are gains to be had. I don't know why people keep telling you otherwise. Like I said, its just not going to be a ton. I wish I could remember the poster that was kind enough to do the dyno runs. I know he drove it through an epic river forging! Maybe someone will be kind enough to link it for you.
