Nitrogen in Tires

JP4RNR

New member
Has anyone replaced the air in their tires with nitrogen?

Here some info I read


Gassing up your car is about to take on a new meaning.

Fill your tires with pure nitrogen and you'll get better gas mileage, advocates of the practice say. Your tires will be safer, and they'll last longer.

A colorless, odorless, tasteless gas that makes up about 78 percent of the Earth's atmosphere, nitrogen could cost you as much as $10 a tire. But what you save on gas, tire replacement and peace of mind will make up the difference, according to the pitch.

Already, retailers like Costco and Olin Mott stores offer nitrogen, and Pep Boys has test-marketed it.

Starting Saturday, buyers of all new cars sold at select Crown dealerships in the Tampa Bay area will find their tires filled with nitrogen. Eventually, all 13 dealerships will offer it.

The thinking is that nitrogen's larger molecules prevent it from seeping out of a tire as quickly as air. So inflating tires with nearly pure nitrogen - which has been done for years in race cars, commercial airliners and long-distance trucks - allows them to retain correct pressure longer.

Pressure is vital because a properly inflated tire is a safer, more efficient tire. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration says most drivers can improve gas mileage by nearly 3 percent by keeping their vehicle tires within the recommended pressure range. The government also estimates the nation loses more than 2 million gallons of gas every day due to underinflated tires.

Enter nitrogen. Chemical No. 7 on your periodic chart of the elements. At anywhere from $2 to $10 per tire.

Besides attracting customers and addressing safety concerns, it's a way to fight inflation. Or rather, the lack of it, said Jim Myers, Crown's chief operating officer.

"The whole theory is that air bleeds through the tire slowly," Myers said. "And if someone isn't diligent, any tire will lose air over time. But because of nitrogen's properties, that doesn't happen as quickly."

Myers said Crown will also offer to replace air with nitrogen on any vehicle for $39.

What happens if tire pressure drops and the driver is not near a garage or tire store that sells nitrogen?

Topping off with compressed air won't hurt, tire experts say, and the tire can be purged and refilled with nitrogen later.

So should motorists feel ... pressured to put nitrogen in their tires?

"It sounds like it has mostly positive points," said Randy Bly, director of community relations for AAA Auto Club South in Tampa. "Nitrogen helps keep tires cooler under open highway conditions, and it's less likely to leak out, so that would help with fuel mileage.

"The only negative would be the cost. But it may well be worth it."

Nitrogen-filled tires stay inflated about three times as long as than air-filled tires, advocates say, and while a typical tire inflated with compressed air might lose 2.7 pounds of pressure monthly, one filled with nitrogen loses 0.7 pound.

But Jim Davis, public relations manager for Goodyear Tire and Rubber, says replacing air with nitrogen is "a tough call."

"The objective is to have the correct air pressure," Davis said. "And over time, minute amounts of air do leak out.

"There is no harm to the tire from using regular air. But we urge people to check their tires monthly."

What happens, Davis said, is that decreased air pressure flattens a tire, creating more surface area between the tire and the road. That added friction can make the engine work harder and cause tires to overheat, possibly leading to a blowout.

"More tire surface means it takes more power to roll that tire," Davis said. "A correctly inflated tire is going to roll more easily."

Checking tires for correct pressure also has a side benefit.

"When you're down there, look at the tires," Davis said. "You may notice a nail or tread that is wearing abnormally, and you can catch it before the problem becomes worse."

At least one tire manufacturer is even more skeptical about the advantages of nitrogen in the family car.

Michelin officials recommend nitrogen only for tires used "in a high risk environment and/or when the user wants to reduce the consequences of a potential abnormal overheating of the tire-wheel assembly (for example in some aircraft applications)," according to a company statement.

But for all other tires in normal use, nitrogen "is not required and does not necessarily bring the expected benefit.

"It is true that the physical properties of nitrogen reduce the pressure loss due to the natural permeability of the materials of the tire and thus the broad use of nitrogen will in general assist motorists with pressure maintenance.

"Nevertheless, the existence of several other possible sources of leaks (tire/rim interface, valve, valve/rim interface and the wheel) prevents the guarantee of better pressure maintenance for individuals using nitrogen inflation."

So we can save the expense if we just check our tires regularly.

The trouble is, we don't.

As recently as two years ago, government and tire industry surveys showed close to 30 percent of cars, vans, pickups and SUVs on the road had at least one tire that was substantially underinflated, at least 8 psi below the recommended minimum pressure.

But high gas prices and consumer education may be cutting into that number. According to a survey by Uniroyal Tire in mid August, nearly 50 percent of Americans said they are now checking the air pressure in their tires once a month.

Still, that leaves millions of unchecked tires.

"Most people don't take care of their tires on a regular basis," said Dave Zielasko, editor and publisher of Tire Business , an Akron, Ohio, trade publication. "Tires are one of the most underappreciated part of the vehicle. People take them for granted. But the reality is they do need to be checked.

"Remember, it's the only part of the vehicle that touches the road."
 
Register to hide this ad
From what I understand, Nitrogen is better because it doesn't leak out as fast. IOW, check your tire pressure from time to time, and keep your tires inflated, and you'll get the same results as nitrogen. I won't pay for it, but Costco did give fill my tires with it when I got my new tires. They filled my tires at 29psi.
 
simple said:
... check your tire pressure from time to time, and keep your tires inflated, and you'll get the same results as nitrogen. ... but Costco did give fill my tires with it when I got my new tires. They filled my tires at 29psi.

Underinflated (@ 29) with nitrogen is still underinflated. Defeats the whole purpose. They probably want to save on the nitrogen cost which costs you in the long run.

Save your money. Check your pressures.
 
I use N2 and love it. It lasts longer than air and it's more stable. In my old Titan, which had live tire pressures on the nav display, I could see a huge difference. Air would vary 6psi (sometimes more) cold to hot and N2 varied just 3psi.

The claim about 2.7lb vs .7lb per month is in line with my experiences as well.

If you do it have them run the spare up to max sidewall inflation as for most of us that's the most important and least maintained tire.

I get it for free. Would I pay? I check pressures very regularly so I am not sure. It does work as advertised though...

:cheers:
 
Loosing 2.7 pounds a month?? What a load of garbage! Your tires would be almost flat after a year, and thats never happened to anyone I know. My Nissan Patrol was in storage in Australia for 2 years and the tires dropped from 35 to about 32 in that time. If your tires loose that much air then you have a LEAK, not an excuse to pay a bullsh!t amount for nitrogen. Nitrogen is used in aviation because aircraft operate at altitudes where the temperatures make the moisture content in air freeze, and nitrogen pressures fluctuate less over a temperature range because of the lack of moisture. So unless you drive your 4Runner at 35000 ft and drive around at nascar speeds then why bother?
 
Tire brand and model seems to make a big difference on the leak rate. My girlfreind has some mid-grade Toyo's that do around 1.5-2.0/month. The valve stems are new and tight, all the tires lose exactly the same amount so it's not from a leak or curb pounding... The Michellin LTX A/S on a 1ton Dodge the company has doesn't seem to lose a pound in six-months... Both her car and the Dodge have regular air. Switching her donut spare to N2 made a huge difference in the leakdown rate.

I don't know.

:cheers:
 
The day I pay $10/tire to have pure anything in my tires is the day hell freezes over. What a load of crap. A huge difference? The air in tires is 78% N2 already. So 21% oxygen with the balance of CO2 and various other gases has a $10/tire effect? This is worse than the hybrid and ethanol scams. You've gotta be kidding me. Save coin, check your tires monthly.

However, if a person really believes its better and has peace of mind from something like this, its worth the $40. For me personally, its not.
 
Another reason why I wouldn't use nitrogen is because I go off-road often and I almost always air-down (15-23psi depending on the terrain) on the trails and then air-up when returning home. Refilling with nitrogen is impractical and would be way to costly.

I also think the quality of the work done when fitting the tire to the rim plays a big part. My wifes Accord had one tire that was dropping about 2-4 psi each month. I did a very thorough leak test and eventually found a tiny stream of bubbles coming from the bead. I had the local tire shop remove the tire, inspect and clean the rim and the tire and re-seat it. Problem solved.
 
God knows I agree with you TheBlueWave. But Nitrogen gas for tires is and will be sold because ppl willing to buy it. Just like bottled water is popular now. Who knew that we will pay for water. Trust me, some day, some clever idiot will find the way to sell "bottled clean air" and people will pay for it. Sad isn't it?
 
<<<< said:
God knows I agree with you TheBlueWave. But Nitrogen gas for tires is and will be sold because ppl willing to buy it. Just like bottled water is popular now. Who knew that we will pay for water. Trust me, some day, some clever idiot will find the way to sell "bottled clean air" and people will pay for it. Sad isn't it?

Hell yeah. Especially when you consider that tap water is more tightly regulated than bottled water. Any company could bottle tap water and sell it for a $1.29 as spring water. Its legal, too, as long as the municipal source its bottled from is sourced from an aquifer or artesian spring. You could get that same water for fractions of a penny for a bottle's worth.
I just hope I'm the next person to come out with something I can cash in on with nothing but an empty promise. If the dude who bottles clean air makes a fortune, he will be lauging all the way to the bank breathing regular air.

Sorry for going off topic.
 
Another way to make money in the auto industry.....lol. People buy in hook line and sinker.

Just use air for gosh sakes.

My dealer told me the same crap , I just laughed.

Take care of your tires , rotate them , check pressure regularly they will work just fine:D
 
Air is 78 % nitrogen and 21 % oxygen to begin with. So why exactly pay so much to get rid of 21 % O2? Oxygen is a bigger atom than nitrogen, so air will leak out slower than pure nitrogen (but in the smallest way)

I believe it becomes more important on race cars where temperatures can reach extreme temps. Increasing the temp increases the pressure, so they would be concerned with maintaining a more constant temp which pure N2 may provide? Ever see a dragster (rail) tires increase in size as they warm they up from burn-outs?
 
greasefingers said:
Air is 78 % nitrogen and 21 % oxygen to begin with. So why exactly pay so much to get rid of 21 % O2? Oxygen is a bigger atom than nitrogen, so air will leak out slower than pure nitrogen (but in the smallest way)

I believe it becomes more important on race cars where temperatures can reach extreme temps. Increasing the temp increases the pressure, so they would be concerned with maintaining a more constant temp which pure N2 may provide? Ever see a dragster (rail) tires increase in size as they warm they up from burn-outs?

The heat capacity (way to measure ability to hold a constant temp with energy input or output) of N2 can't be much different than air. Got to be another reason for N2, but I sure can't think of one. Flammability perhaps?
 
I work at Costco, in the tire shop. We fill every tire we work on with Nitrogen.
We make our own Nitrogen with a unit that filters out the Oxygen, so its no cost to us, apart from the cost of the unit. We do not under inflate to save on Nitrogen.
Some say that after a long period of time, tires with regular compressed air loose only a small amount, this is true. Whats happening is that the Oxygen leaks out first, so you loose some pressure, then you have only Nitrogen in them, so this keeps the pressure there. I would not pay for Nitrogen, it wouldn't be worth what other places are charging, but if you get it free, like at Costco, its definitely worth it. Why do race cars use it??? Same as planes, to keep a more constant pressure
Tim
 
Water Vapor in Air

The question of nitrogen in tires was recently asked a tire forum sponsored by Yokohoma.

The tire engineer stated that the real advantage of Nitrogen over air is its lack of water vapor. Water vapor in air is a main cause of large pressure changes in tires as they heat up. Remember air is mostly nitrogen. Water expands greatly as it is heated. Race teams use nitrogen not because it is more
 
I had nitrogen in my tires. It really didn't do much for me. In the winter, when it was really cold or when it snowed, I would loose pressure and my tire pressure alarm went off. But after a long drive, with friction, the tire got warmer and the alarm light turns off. That was the reason why I replace air with Nitrogen but I still had that problem in cold weather. Nitrogen wasn't the solution. So that pretty much answers your question about temperature.

Concerning saving on gas, I think its a myth, lol. Didn't save on gas, and if it did, not to a point where I noticed it. I ended up filling my tires with air again. Wasn't worth the $10/tire for me. I can see that the molecular and chemical break down makes sense, but the way you drive is more important. If you really wanna save gas on the 4runner, just drive bellow 2500 rpm ;):
and if you looose allot of pressure, then you have a nail somewhere :bash:
 

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
278,307
Messages
3,554,053
Members
248,016
Latest member
Advally Service

Trending content

Back
Top