Nut & bolt rather than rivnut install on full length Front Runner Rack?

[MtnMan219]

Maybe my forum search skills are weak, but I can't find anything, even on the web, about people using nut & bolt on the front legs of a full length Front Runner rack. It comes with rivnuts, but my experience with them reveals they wear out and often deform the initial hole after prolonged use under load. Not to mention the chances of rivnuts spinning if you don't notch the hole prior to install.

Has anyone chosen to use nut & bolt on the front legs instead of using the rivnuts? I don't mind the drilling and know i'll definitely need to pull the headliner down at the front. I'm looking for the most secure option to help keep it water-tight.

 

[JSparky]

When I ordered my rack they recommended a nut and bolt over the rivnuts but included them anyways so I could decide once I got in there. Considering the location a nut and bolt may be easier than messing with rivnuts as well. I won't be able to install my rack for a little while but I can report back on what I do if you'd like.

 

[MtnMan219]

When I ordered my rack they recommended a nut and bolt over the rivnuts but included them anyways so I could decide once I got in there. Considering the location a nut and bolt may be easier than messing with rivnuts as well. I won't be able to install my rack for a little while but I can report back on what I do if you'd like.

That's good to know. I've got my rack and want to install it Saturday if time allows. I'll try to document it no matter what way I go.

 

[JSparky]

That's good to know. I've got my rack and want to install it Saturday if time allows. I'll try to document it no matter what way I go.

Nice. Factor in some time for putting the tray together, it can take awhile getting everything aligned. Good luck with the install!

 

[RAD4Runner]

I have a first-gen but I used nuts and bolts to install my custom raised-rail rack. Most secure. Just make sure you seal well with good silicone and rubber gaskets.
AND, since you'll have nuts under the roof, make them do double duty as tie-up points, say for overhead cargo mesh storage, by installing little D-rings or pad-eyes before you put the nuts on. They will be more robust than the stock ones.
They will not be pretty but the truck is utilitarian and not for soccer-mom's correct?

 

[doctorres112]

That's good to know. I've got my rack and want to install it Saturday if time allows. I'll try to document it no matter what way I go.

If you have time, I'd advise buying the extended hex tools they use on the videos. Just makes life a little easier and are pretty cheap on amazon. I think I got a 4mm & 5mm for $4 each. I was afraid to use my drill for fear of stripping any of the hex bolts.

Good luck, I love my FR 3/4 rack, and more often than not, wish I would've gone w/ the full length.

-Chris

 

[MtnMan219]

I have a first-gen but I used nuts and bolts to install my custom raised-rail rack. Most secure. Just make sure you seal well with good silicone and rubber gaskets.
AND, since you'll have nuts under the roof, make them do double duty as tie-up points, say for overhead cargo mesh storage, by installing little D-rings or pad-eyes before you put the nuts on. They will be more robust than the stock ones.
They will not be pretty but the truck is utilitarian and not for soccer-mom's correct?

It's definitely utilitarian and that's a good idea, but i'll probably have these nuts hidden close to the A-pillar and under the headliner. It does give me another idea tho....

If you have time, I'd advise buying the extended hex tools they use on the videos. Just makes life a little easier and are pretty cheap on amazon. I think I got a 4mm & 5mm for $4 each. I was afraid to use my drill for fear of stripping any of the hex bolts.

Good luck, I love my FR 3/4 rack, and more often than not, wish I would've gone w/ the full length.

-Chris

I'll be sure to note this. My brother has quite an extensive set of hex key and torque drivers. May just have to pay him a visit

 

[Gabex35]

I used a nylock nut and bolt for the reasons you mentioned. No arguing it’s better for the long term than a rivnut.

 

[4Running303]

I just installed my frontrunner rack today. Drove down to Agoura Hills and picked it up at 8am.

I did the riv nuts and it went smooth. I made my own tool following some youtube videos. I may switch to a nut down the line if the riv nuts fail. They seem snug right now, but we'll see after i throw an RTT up there and get some dirt miles on it.

 

[nglayton]

I know the frontrunner video shows someone picking his Jeep up by the rack, but seriously do you really think you need to bolt the front of this thing down?

How many of you are going to be picking your T4R up off the ground and even if you were, how many of you will use the rack to do it?

Personally I wouldn't drill it at all. Why risk a leak for no reason?
I get that the rivnut solution isn't great, but I bet that jeep in the video wasn't picked up by the rivnuts either. I'm going to guess there was a whole lotta stuff inside they never showed.

Plenty of Gobi full length racks running around without drilling anything. Mine included. I use it all the time, works just fine, without the front being bolted to anything...........

Obviously YMMV, and this is just MHO, but think about it. Holes last a lifetime, along with the leaks they enable. :mmph:

 

[RAD4Runner]

I know the frontrunner video shows someone picking his Jeep up by the rack...

Just a marketing thing... The reason they can lift the Wrangler by the Frontrunner Rack is because the rack is mounted on structural parts; The front roll-bar hidden inside the A-pillar and the rear mounts that bolt on to the roll-bar through removable roof and spacers. We can't expect to do that with the 4Runner.

Personally I wouldn't drill it at all. Why risk a leak for no reason?
I get that the rivnut solution isn't great...

Hmmm... Aren't Rivnuts installed by drilling?

I just installed my frontrunner rack today. ... youtube videos...

You did drill, correct?

 

[nglayton]

Just a marketing thing... The reason they can lift the Wrangler by the Frontrunner Rack is because the rack is mounted on structural parts; The front roll-bar hidden inside the A-pillar and the rear mounts that bolt on to the roll-bar through removable roof and spacers. We can't expect to do that with the 4Runner.

I guess I was too subtle with my post. This is my point exactly.

NO ONE IS GOING TO DO THIS EVER WITH A 4RUNNER. (or any vehicle IRL)

Hmmm... Aren't Rivnuts installed by drilling?

Again, my point was, they are not great, [highlight]SO WHY DRILL AT ALL!?[/highlight]

 

[4Running303]

Hmmm... Aren't Rivnuts installed by drilling?

You did drill, correct?

Yep, drilled and installed the rivnuts...pretty easy.

I don't mind drilling...I've drilled this 4runner many times, and other vehicles before it. I trust myself...use a lot of silicone in and around the drilled holes. No leaks!
If you don't want to drill, then don't. I know people with the full length frontrunner and the full length prinsu that chose not to for whatever reason. I personally like the added connection point up front. My Frontrunner rack is larger than the regular 5th gen version they sell to accommodate a wider hardshell RTT.

 

[JSparky]

I guess I was too subtle with my post. This is my point exactly.

NO ONE IS GOING TO DO THIS EVER WITH A 4RUNNER. (or any vehicle IRL)

Again, my point was, they are not great, [highlight]SO WHY DRILL AT ALL!?[/highlight]

I totally respect your position, but on the other hand I happen to be from the camp that has no real issue with drilling. It's two small holes among several already up there and will greatly increase overall strength. I'd be more concerned over a sunroof leaking.

Gobi uses double stick foam tape to "mount" their front ends. When I had installed mine I didn't use the tape right away to make sure everything was lined up and you could seee and hear the oscillations in the rack, especially at speed. The tape fixed that I never really did have full confidence in it. In terms of safety at-speed for cargo, as well as impacts from tree branches and whatnot offroad, I'd much rather have a full length rack actually mounted the full length. As an anecdote, I've broken factory load rails, cross bars, and a Yakima loadwarrior basket on various occasions. I'm also aware of an individual in Tucson who lost his entire roof basket loaded with gear in route to Baja, it quite literally tore off his roof on the freeway.

Long story short is not to underestimate the forces that get applied to a roof rack. With something as long as a full-length gobi/front runner/eeziawn, it's really best to spread the load out evenly across the roof. I know Eezi-awn doesn't "require" drilling, perhaps from a sales perspective, and there's a lot of guys out there running full length racks without drilling who have never had a problem, but I respect Frontrunner for recommending the best/strongest mounting method.. just seen too many rack failures to risk the alternative.

 

[nglayton]

No worries my friends, if you want to drill, please drill. I just wanted to know why, given the risks & rewards.

To each his own. I've drilled plenty of holes in my Runner, just not any in the roof. I will probably keep it that way.

You do have a good point, that there are several holes up top already. A few more can't possibly hurt a thing.

 

[Ducmonsta]

I personally drilled and used a lock nut. The most surprising thing for me was the amount of metal shavings on your headliner after drilling. In fact, some of them land on the side curtain air bags so I can only imagine what that's going to do to you incase of an deployment. Granted, you've probably got other things to worry about if they deploy but that's just adding insult to injury there (or metal shavings to the face).

Dropping the headliner slightly allowed me to vacuum up the shavings and easily install the nuts on the inside. So for me, it was a 2 for 1 deal to take the time to drop it.

 

[MtnMan219]

Install update: Sorry guys, I wasn't able to do the install this past weekend. A foot injury is keeping me down at the moment. I'm now planning to do it this coming weekend. I'm very excited to get it on. At this rate, my sliders may arrive and get put on at the same time.

 

[JSparky]

Install update: Sorry guys, I wasn't able to do the install this past weekend. A foot injury is keeping me down at the moment. I'm now planning to do it this coming weekend. I'm very excited to get it on. At this rate, my sliders may arrive and get put on at the same time.

Damn, hope it's nothing serious. I was recently laid up for awhile with an ankle injury, I know how that can go. Hope you get better soon.

 

[MtnMan219]

Damn, hope it's nothing serious. I was recently laid up for awhile with an ankle injury, I know how that can go. Hope you get better soon.

Nothing crazy thankfully. Just have to stay off it if I want it to heal which really sucks.

I personally drilled and used a lock nut. The most surprising thing for me was the amount of metal shavings on your headliner after drilling. In fact, some of them land on the side curtain air bags so I can only imagine what that's going to do to you incase of an deployment. Granted, you've probably got other things to worry about if they deploy but that's just adding insult to injury there (or metal shavings to the face).

lol this was my thought exactly. I hope to never need the airbags to deploy whether on or off the road.

 

[mattyrides07]

I drilled through my front posts and used bolts vs the riv nuts. Needed the extra strength and longevity that comes with the bolts. And coming from my FJ with the FR bolted in in knew the pros of bolting it. Taking the header and side panels off was the most frustrating and time consuming part. You could chest and not fully remove the panel IF you have small enough hands to squeeze in there, but you risk bending the header.

My advice:
1. Bolt the frontrunner in the front vs rivet. Use locking nut and red lock tite.
2. Take the extra time to remove headliner and A piller liners.
3. Use grade 8 bolts
4. Use marine grade caulking

Enjoy your rack. It's the BEST one of there for sure. Feel free to PM me for my phone number and we can talk or iChat through any issues you have.

FYI- Plan on 6-8 hours for completion of everything.