Official T4R "Firearms" thread

[bofa]

Wow, I've been in the market for either a Colt LE6920 or a Noveske for a very long time. How long do you think this price will last?

These are the daily 12 days of Christmas deals from Grab-a-gun, so I would assume today or until they run out.

You may find similar prices elsewhere eventually if you keep an eye out.

 

[bofa]

Both of mine were mid 2012 test fire dates. From the research I have done, it seems to be only the full size 9mm with accuracy issues.

The fit between the barrel and the slide was so loose on one, you could make it rattle when you shook the slide when it was pulled off the frame. I'd say it had a few millimeters of play in a circular motion. The pistol struggled to stay on a 12"x 12" target at 25 yards no matter who was shooting it. While I'm no bullseye shooter, I have had a lot of pistol training, have competed in steel shoots and am shooting pretty much weekly.

Storm lake makes oversized barrels for them that need to be hand fit to the slide to correct the issue, but it's not cheap. S&W doesn't seem to care to fix the issue either. They sent me a new slide that was just as bad.

In comparison with my HK P30 and Glock 34 I can put 10 rounds inside a 6" birch wood Casey shoot n see target at 25 yards. The HK barrel locks up as tight as a drum and from what I've seen reported, it's probably the most accurate out of the box duty pistol on the market.

In the end I didn't feel like spending an extra $400 to get the M&P where I wanted it so I went with the HK.

Oddly enough I had a much harder time getting mags for the M&P as well. While people always seem to say HK mags are expensive and hard to find, I called up HK USA and ordered 5 mags direct for $35 each. I had seen them online as high as $60 each and they were out if stock. Most people forget to call the manufacturer first for mags and parts. Also unlike Glock, you don't have to be an armorer to order parts direct with HK.

I wouldn't want to put that kind of money into one either. My 357C does have a bit of slide play, but I've come to expect that from inexpensive polymers. No barrel rattling that I've noticed. Like I've said though, accuracy hasn't been an issue once I learned how to work with the trigger - 4" groups from 10 yards and 6" from 15 and 25 yards. I absolutely love the 357 Sig round.

Agree on Mags - S&W mags are a total pain in the ass to get a hold of for some reason.

 

[nevada]

I got the EOtech and magnifier mounted, man...that is slick. I think it took longer to get them out of the box, then it did to mount them. having no previous experience with this type of system, I didn't know what to expect. it was pretty nice.

the best part, the exps2 is so short, even with both components on there, I can still use the carry handle. WIN!

 

[M1911]

I've got an Eotech, but I'm more likely to go with a 1x4 than to add a modifier. Of course, there is the little matter of money and I've been thinking about this for at least two years...

 

[M1911]

I'm aware of them. So you take a $500 gun, put in a $90 apex kit, and then have a fitted barrel installed to correct the accuracy problem for $250. Or you can just buy a P30 for $900 and be done with it. After a few years of wandering blind I have seen the light.

P30? Blech.

Pretty much every handgun I own has needed a trigger job out of the box. On a few (Glocks and J-frames) I've done it myself. On others, like 1911s and K-frames, I've had a gunsmith do it.

I know a lot of people who shoot M&Ps in IDPA, including Master level shooters. You are the first one I've heard of complain about accuracy issues. So I don't think that is endemic to the gun.

A lot of Glock shooters in IDPA and USPSA spend well more than $90 on better action parts.

 

[dorton]

A couple a friend of mine built

 

[nevada]

I've got an Eotech, but I'm more likely to go with a 1x4 than to add a modifier. Of course, there is the little matter of money and I've been thinking about this for at least two years...

the price is certainly a big issue.

I wouldnt have gotten what I did, expect for the fact I got a buddy deal. from someone that works there.
it ended up being $430 shipped for the exps2, and g33 both.

at that price, I couldn't not buy it. and even at that, I saved up for several months.

 

[JBecker]

I know a lot of people who shoot M&Ps in IDPA, including Master level shooters. You are the first one I've heard of complain about accuracy issues. So I don't think that is endemic to the gun.

A lot of Glock shooters in IDPA and USPSA spend well more than $90 on better action parts.

Oh really?

Recent manufacture M&P 9 accuracy

M&P9 25yd inaccuracy: Myth or Fact? - THR

New m&p pro 9mm 5" accuracy - MP-Pistol Forum

M&P accuracy - full size vs compact [Archive] - pistol-forum.com

I could care less what gun gamers are doing to their pistols. They all have trigger work done and they are running hand fitted barrels (notice a trend here?).

The problem is a direct relation to barrel to slide fit and lock up, and that's why there are a few manufacturers who have stepped up to offer a solution.

Or you could just buy something that had more attention to detail at the factory and be done with it. I chose that route.

 

[M1911]

Oh really?

Recent manufacture M&P 9 accuracy

M&P9 25yd inaccuracy: Myth or Fact? - THR

New m&p pro 9mm 5" accuracy - MP-Pistol Forum

M&P accuracy - full size vs compact [Archive] - pistol-forum.com

I could care less what gun gamers are doing to their pistols. They all have trigger work done and they are running hand fitted barrels (notice a trend here?).

The folks that I know shooting M&Ps and Glocks are shooting the production barrels that came with the gun. As for the gamers, my point is that Master level shooters -- people who really know their way around a gun -- are getting quite good accuracy. I'm sorry you've had an issue. Not everyone else has.

As for HKs, I'm sorry but their bore axis is too high, their triggers suck, and their magazine release sucks.

Every gun has its own issues. None of them is perfect. What works for me may or may not work for others. You like HKs. Great. I can't stand them. Who is right? Both of us.

I like 1911s because they have thin grips and great triggers. But I recognize they are also the king of feed failures. I don't put any gun on a pedestal.

 

[noobshooter]

Here's a few...
AR-15 SPR clone w/ Ops Inc 15th suppressor.


Nighthawk GRP w/Osprey .45 suppressor

 

[JBecker]

The folks that I know shooting M&Ps and Glocks are shooting the production barrels that came with the gun. As for the gamers, my point is that Master level shooters -- people who really know their way around a gun -- are getting quite good accuracy. I'm sorry you've had an issue. Not everyone else has.

As for HKs, I'm sorry but their bore axis is too high, their triggers suck, and their magazine release sucks.

Every gun has its own issues. None of them is perfect. What works for me may or may not work for others. You like HKs. Great. I can't stand them. Who is right? Both of us.

I like 1911s because they have thin grips and great triggers. But I recognize they are also the king of feed failures. I don't put any gun on a pedestal.

I think you might be surprised the number of folks running fitted barrels in their Glockss or M&P's shooting USPSA Production class. Granted some guys are doing it only because they are running a .40 S&W pistol with a 9mm conversion barrel.

I used to buy into the bore axis myth, but after running a shot timer and having the same split times as a Glock, to me it's a non issue. Especially shooting a full size 9mm pistol. If it were a big issue, you wouldn't have guys winning competitions with HK's, Sig's or Beretta's, and the Caracal would be cleaning up. Regarding triggers, I had a glocktriggers.com trigger kit in my 34, and had some that were just smoothed over. I prefer the V1 trigger in the HK. And while the paddle mag release is a bit different, I didn't have a hard time transitioning to it.

But like you said, go with what works for you. I only elaborated on my issues with the M&P because I was asked. :hello:

 

[JBecker]

Changing gears a bit here, but anyone running a SIRT pistol trainer? I've been thinking about picking one up to play with while at the house and can't make it out to the range.

 

[Limbwalker]

Colt 1911 Government model .45
Colt 'Detective' snubby .38 revolver
Winchester model 94 Legacy (lever action) .44 mag
and a couple .22s

 

[bofa]

Changing gears a bit here, but anyone running a SIRT pistol trainer? I've been thinking about picking one up to play with while at the house and can't make it out to the range.

Those are a bit pricey... why not just pick up a few laser cartridges and test with the actual gun(s) you'll be using?

 

[JBecker]

Those are a bit pricey... why not just pick up a few laser cartridges and test with the actual gun(s) you'll be using?

They had one in sale for $200 recently. I have a laser cartridge now I use with my HK but it's not ideal due to having to rack the slide after each shot unless I want the full 14 pound DA pull.

 

[bofa]

They had one in sale for $200 recently. I have a laser cartridge now I use with my HK but it's not ideal due to having to rack the slide after each shot unless I want the full 14 pound DA pull.

Eh, I'd just practice that way personally, unless you actually carry and use a G17 exclusively.

Now if they somehow created a training pistol with the actual recoil and slide effects, I'd be more inclined to spend that much.

 

[JBecker]

Eh, I'd just practice that way personally, unless you actually carry and use a G17 exclusively.

Now if they somehow created a training pistol with the actual recoil and slide effects, I'd be more inclined to spend that much.

I haven't seen a pistol like that, but the Army uses a CO2 blow back M4 carbine for training on a large screen. It cycles and feels like the real deal just without the sound.

Another reason I have been thinking about it is there is a SIRT league in my town. It's really cheap and a lot of fun, especially when the weather isn't very good.

 

[LINY4Runner]

73 pages late to the party but here's my baby...

Bushmaster XM-15-E2S; various Magpul goodies and an Aimpoint CompM4 dot sight which saw action in Iraq and Afganistan. Mostly NY compliant with a few exceptions Andy doesn't need to know about...

Also have a beautiful Marlin Model 60 .22LR and a Savage MarkII Lefy Bolt Action .22LR with competition sights. Coming down the road is something along the lines of a Remington 870 in .308 and one of those modenized Springfield M1's with the composite stock. Working on the pistol license too...

 

[hades]

Eh, I'd just practice that way personally, unless you actually carry and use a G17 exclusively.

Now if they somehow created a training pistol with the actual recoil and slide effects, I'd be more inclined to spend that much.

You mean air soft .

 

[zopperman]