On the fence about upgrading T4R3 to T4R5

[mikeySA]

As the title says, I am on the fence about upgrading my T4R from a built 2001 3rd gen to a 5th gen. The main reason I am even considering upgrading is that I need a more interior room, and a more modern interior. The interior of an 18yr old vehicle is just not as nice as a modern vehicle. This use to be a negligible difference from me. But after doing a few long road trips, it became more apparent that a modern interior is something I want.

I have a local dealership who will install any aftermarket equipment and include it all into their finance. If I upgrade, I would get a 2017 with 40-50k miles for roughly $28-35k and then add all my aftermarket equipment to it through the dealership financing. I would be adding armor and Icon’s and come out with a $43-50k built 5th gen certified pre-owned, all financed. This way I would only have an autoload to pay instead of an autoload and credit card payment.

The obviously cheaper option is to keep the 3rd gen and spend money on getting corbeau seats, regular maintenance, 18yr old car problems (i.e. yearly smog, squeaks and creaks), dealing with the small interior and dated feel. But, I’d already have a vehicle that is already very capable.

I’d like your opinions on this topic and have a discussion, thanks.

*Finally able to upload pics*

 

[volkinator]

You asked on the internet, so you're going to get lots of opinions... So here's mine.

I hate car payments. I'd stick with what you have and upgrade, when you're ready pay cash for a newer one, either 4th or 5th gen. Upgrade as you need. These things are so capable. Yeah they look cool with icon this and gobi that, but honestly. Just use the thing.

I've got a built 3rd gen that's taken me anywhere I pointed it. It's dated and not all that comfortable (exhaust leak) but she was doing well enough. Wife and I knew we were going to replace it sooner than later, so I found a deal on a 4th gen, low miles (<70k) Plan to use it and upgrade as I replace instead of taking out perfectly good things. I do really love the newer/bigger interior. Some creature comforts and everything can be had for very little.

All this to again say that I hate car payments and don't like to see people dig holes. Cars are horrible investments, even our beloved 4runners. But it depends on your situation entirely.

 

[mikeySA]

You asked on the internet, so you're going to get lots of opinions... So here's mine.

I hate car payments. I'd stick with what you have and upgrade, when you're ready pay cash for a newer one, either 4th or 5th gen. Upgrade as you need. These things are so capable. Yeah they look cool with icon this and gobi that, but honestly. Just use the thing.

I've got a built 3rd gen that's taken me anywhere I pointed it. It's dated and not all that comfortable (exhaust leak) but she was doing well enough. Wife and I knew we were going to replace it sooner than later, so I found a deal on a 4th gen, low miles (<70k) Plan to use it and upgrade as I replace instead of taking out perfectly good things. I do really love the newer/bigger interior. Some creature comforts and everything can be had for very little.

All this to again say that I hate car payments and don't like to see people dig holes. Cars are horrible investments, even our beloved 4runners. But it depends on your situation entirely.

Yeah, I hate car payments too.

My 3rd gen also very built, armor, snorkel, roof rack, lift and tires (pics incoming when I am not using work WiFi). But man is it uncomfortable and tiny. Also a gigantic dog up any sort of mountain pass.

I want a new truck and all with all of its modern features and creature comforts. But, I also hate having to start over on a new build especially when my 3rd gen is so far along already. If it was only mildly built, I wouldn't have this dilemma.

 

[sogoood]

I say do it.

but if you got room in the garage id keep the 3rd gen too. id miss the damn thing.

 

[techno]

How about meeting in the middle with a 4th gen?
For $20k you can get something really nice, build it up with suspension, armor and lockers and have a more 'friendly' car payment! The interior is larger and doesn't feel as old. And maybe a V8 could sweeten the deal.....

 

[volkinator]

How about meeting in the middle with a 4th gen?
For $20k you can get something really nice, build it up with suspension, armor and lockers and have a more 'friendly' car payment! The interior is larger and doesn't feel as old. And maybe a V8 could sweeten the deal.....

This is pretty much exactly what I did (minus the build part so far) Even the V8 which is pretty awesome

 

[Dillusion]

Surprised they would finance that especially since most of the time you don't get back what you put in.

I wouldn't finance mods personally.

 

[mikeySA]

This is pretty much exactly what I did (minus the build part so far) Even the V8 which is pretty awesome

Was going up 1 Generation worth it? I feel like I'd like to go up by at least 2 to justify myself.

Surprised they would finance that especially since most of the time you don't get back what you put in.

I wouldn't finance mods personally.

Yeah, it was interesting when I learned that. I even asked if they would go armor that takes months, and they said it was fine as long as it is installed on their lot.

Why would you not finance mods?

 

[Dillusion]

Was going up 1 Generation worth it? I feel like I'd like to go up by at least 2 to justify myself.



Yeah, it was interesting when I learned that. I even asked if they would go armor that takes months, and they said it was fine as long as it is installed on their lot.

Why would you not finance mods?

This is just my opinion on why I don't finance mods.

1. Most of the time you will not get back what you put into it.
2. You are paying interest on these mods.
3. I'm not a fan of cc for extracurricular stuff. I use mine to fill up gas and get miles and pay it off every month. Plus goes back to #2 if you keep a balance.

 

[volkinator]

Was going up 1 Generation worth it? I feel like I'd like to go up by at least 2 to justify myself.

For me it was. Cost/Mileage/Condition made the decision easy. It's very comfortable, the power is nearly endless (V8 :spy But the interior is massive compared to the 3rd gen. It's taking some getting used to, but I really like it. There's more storage, but it's just bigger, so some organizing is required. Also much quieter. From what I've heard, the platform is VERY similar for 4/5 gens. I personally liked the style of the 4th (but the pre-facelift trail edition will always be my sweet spot) Honestly, best thing to do is try to find a dealer that has both... Get in, drive it around, see what fits you best. I went with a Limited due to the heated leather seats, and they seem to be better taken care of in older ones. YMMV.

Also I would definitely agree with not wanting to finance mods for the interest and depreciation so quickly.

 

[jordanrb81]

So, from a financial perspective I wouldn't do this. You're going to be upside down, most mods don't add a dollar to the book value of the vehicle. It becomes at best like a collectable (something with no intrinsic value) So you end up with a big loan 50k on a 30k vehicle. Also are the dealer installed mods competitive? in other words if you had the car and the cash and could go anywhere you like, are there prices for modifications the same as anywhere else? Or like most things at a dealership are they 5-10% higher? Who is financing this deal, is it a bank or the dealership itself? what is the term and interest rate? would these things be materially different if you just purchased and financed the car only? Also are you trading in your current 4Runner, because of the mods you'd likely do better selling it private, or as already mentioned maybe keep it and buy the 5th Gen bone stock. then you can wheel the already paid for already modified rig and have the fifth gen to sort of pay as you go on.

My father drilled into my head "you don't finance your toys" a car by itself is at least more of a need than a want, enough for me to justify financing. That said if you look in my garage you'll see a couple cars that are toys, they are owned out right and were bought with cash. So financing the 5th gen is no biggie, but to me financing the mods feels like a regret in the making. I wouldn't modify my vehicle with money I don't have or pay a nickel of interest to do it. Everyone looks at debt differently though.

 

[mikeySA]

For me it was. Cost/Mileage/Condition made the decision easy. It's very comfortable, the power is nearly endless (V8 :spy But the interior is massive compared to the 3rd gen. It's taking some getting used to, but I really like it. There's more storage, but it's just bigger, so some organizing is required. Also much quieter. From what I've heard, the platform is VERY similar for 4/5 gens. I personally liked the style of the 4th (but the pre-facelift trail edition will always be my sweet spot) Honestly, best thing to do is try to find a dealer that has both... Get in, drive it around, see what fits you best. I went with a Limited due to the heated leather seats, and they seem to be better taken care of in older ones. YMMV.

Also I would definitely agree with not wanting to finance mods for the interest and depreciation so quickly.

It is very hard to find a 4wd V8 in my area. I'd very much like one and I hear the 2008 models are the best year. I am on the look out but I usually see 2005 and older with an average of 200k miles. I am almost considering giving up on the V8 4th gen and the 5th gen and sticking with my 3rd gen.

So, from a financial perspective I wouldn't do this. You're going to be upside down, most mods don't add a dollar to the book value of the vehicle. It becomes at best like a collectable (something with no intrinsic value) So you end up with a big loan 50k on a 30k vehicle. Also are the dealer installed mods competitive? in other words if you had the car and the cash and could go anywhere you like, are there prices for modifications the same as anywhere else? Or like most things at a dealership are they 5-10% higher? Who is financing this deal, is it a bank or the dealership itself? what is the term and interest rate? would these things be materially different if you just purchased and financed the car only? Also are you trading in your current 4Runner, because of the mods you'd likely do better selling it private, or as already mentioned maybe keep it and buy the 5th Gen bone stock. then you can wheel the already paid for already modified rig and have the fifth gen to sort of pay as you go on.



My father drilled into my head "you don't finance your toys" a car by itself is at least more of a need than a want, enough for me to justify financing. That said if you look in my garage you'll see a couple cars that are toys, they are owned out right and were bought with cash. So financing the 5th gen is no biggie, but to me financing the mods feels like a regret in the making. I wouldn't modify my vehicle with money I don't have or pay a nickel of interest to do it. Everyone looks at debt differently though.

Most help, my friend!

I guess I won't be getting a 5th gen with mods financed. It doesn't make a lot of sense after hearing everyone's opinions.

I also have a bit a hard time getting rid of my already built rig that I put my own time into. Everything was installed myself and I feel that it adds a significance to the rig. It also taught me that I don't want to install mods myself anymore as it takes so much of my free time to do it especially with a 9-5 job, dogs, and GF.

Does V8 swapping it make any sense to you? Rather than getting rid of it for another rigs and start from scratch.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

 

[MSRP.]

It is very hard to find a 4wd V8 in my area. I'd very much like one and I hear the 2008 models are the best year. I am on the look out but I usually see 2005 and older with an average of 200k miles. I am almost considering giving up on the V8 4th gen and the 5th gen and sticking with my 3rd gen.

Most help, my friend!

I guess I won't be getting a 5th gen with mods financed. It doesn't make a lot of sense after hearing everyone's opinions.

I also have a bit a hard time getting rid of my already built rig that I put my own time into. Everything was installed myself and I feel that it adds a significance to the rig. It also taught me that I don't want to install mods myself anymore as it takes so much of my free time to do it especially with a 9-5 job, dogs, and GF.

Does V8 swapping it make any sense to you? Rather than getting rid of it for another rigs and start from scratch.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

In your position, v8 swapping? No.
Sounds like you don't want to wrench no more (I'm in similar position), and v8 swap while done right, would be reliable, there's no guarantee it won't leave you stranded on a trip without a good idea on where to start troubleshooting.

Your built 3rd gen is a sunk cost, won't get any of it back selling as is or parted out.
Only reason to REALLY sell it is if it weren't reliable or safe enough for your needs.

Sure as hell wouldn't buy a new 5th gen without at least knowing when the 6th gen is coming for sure. That said, I would be looking VERY HARD at trail 5th gens once the general populace trades in their beloved 5th gen for a 6th gen.. whenever that is. Only question is if it will replace the 3rd or 4th gen.

 

[mikeySA]

In your position, v8 swapping? No.
Sounds like you don't want to wrench no more (I'm in similar position), and v8 swap while done right, would be reliable, there's no guarantee it won't leave you stranded on a trip without a good idea on where to start troubleshooting.

Your built 3rd gen is a sunk cost, won't get any of it back selling as is or parted out.
Only reason to REALLY sell it is if it weren't reliable or safe enough for your needs.

Sure as hell wouldn't buy a new 5th gen without at least knowing when the 6th gen is coming for sure. That said, I would be looking VERY HARD at trail 5th gens once the general populace trades in their beloved 5th gen for a 6th gen.. whenever that is. Only question is if it will replace the 3rd or 4th gen.

The V8 swapping makes sense. If I were to do it myself, I'd know how to troubleshoot it. If I don't do it myself, I'd have no idea on where to start. Wrenching is only fun when you have time for it, for sure.

Also, since its already a sunk cost. Does it make any sense to keep adding things to it to accommodate for its age like new Corbeau Seats, gears/SC(either or, probably not both). While I wait for 5th gen Trail(TRD OffRoad on newer years)?

 

[Rpreme]

From my personal experience I did the reverse. I once owned a 16 Quicksand TRD Pro 5th gen. I couldn't see myself paying the monthly and modifying it for daily and off-road use. I foresaw it running me into a hole in the long run! So I ditched the 5th gen and sold it and started fresh with a low mileage stock 3rd gen.

I say keep the 3rd gen and enjoy its reliability and glory. And maybe if you save up enough cash to pay off maybe upgrading to a 4th or 5th gen will be feasible.

 

[mikeySA]

From my personal experience I did the reverse. I once owned a 16 Quicksand TRD Pro 5th gen. I couldn't see myself paying the monthly and modifying it for daily and off-road use. I foresaw it running me into a hole in the long run! So I ditched the 5th gen and sold it and started fresh with a low mileage stock 3rd gen.

I say keep the 3rd gen and enjoy its reliability and glory. And maybe if you save up enough cash to pay off maybe upgrading to a 4th or 5th gen will be feasible.

Did you like the 5th gen while it lasted?

 

[MSRP.]

The V8 swapping makes sense. If I were to do it myself, I'd know how to troubleshoot it. If I don't do it myself, I'd have no idea on where to start. Wrenching is only fun when you have time for it, for sure.

Also, since its already a sunk cost. Does it make any sense to keep adding things to it to accommodate for its age like new Corbeau Seats, gears/SC(either or, probably not both). While I wait for 5th gen Trail(TRD OffRoad on newer years)?

New seats (look for the BMW e90 seat retrofit) for the 3rd gen.
Those racing inspired seats don't look close to being comfortable as the BMW seat would.

SC/gears, even both will cost you considerably less than a new/like new 5th gen in depreciation (while it is very low). Unless you NEED the safety/interior of the 5th gen, 3rd gen will be sufficient IMO.

Have you considered just getting a second car for road trips through the mountains?
Even a used pickup will cost you far less than a $50k finance deal.

 

[mrblah]

I love gen3's but i feel the gen5 is a evolution of the gen 3. Basically, the gen 5 is a modernized version of the gen 3 (more than than the gen 4 ever was).

So it comes down with whether you want to own a old car and deal with the maintenance or buy a new car and deal with the payments.

I would buy a new gen 5 and keep it stock and keep the gen 3 since its paid off. Once you pay off your gen 5 and your gen 3 dies, you can mod the gen 5 to your hearts content.

If you love the gen 3, you will love the gen 5.

Lastly, don't ever finance any add on's from the dealer.......it adds nothing to your resale and doesn't slow down your vehicle's depreciation. This of course doesn't apply to OEM specialty vehicles...

 

[Rpreme]

Did you like the 5th gen while it lasted?

Don't get me wrong. They are awesome to drive and very modern in terms of interior space, performance, etc. But at the end of the day, what you're paying won't justify it, well in my opinion it didn't. Unless you have deep pockets. I've talked to a bunch of previous TRD Pro and 5th gen owners sell theirs because of the amount they spend vs the amount of driving they do and use of the vehicle. And in the end, they didn't break even selling or lost money.

But to each their own. I say go for it if you're financially ready.

 

[Jetboy]

Consider a 100 series land cruiser. Might fit nicely between the 3rd and 5th price. I went 3rd to 5th. At times i regret not getting a lc200. Had I known gas prices would stay this low I would have.

The 5th is a nice upgrade. Especially going from limited 3rd with open diffs to a trail edition 5th with rear locker and MTS. Much more trail capable out of the box. And the drive train especially the ifs is much stronger. So you don't have to worry about it. Maybe you wouldn't need as many mods? Mine is pretty mild and goes everywhere i ask it to.

That said, being car poor sucks. Unless you can pay cash, I'd buy something else. Also consider a gx460. Great value. Great platform. Really underappreciated.