Drove down to Omaha from denver to pick up my trail. saved 3k after the airfare and hotel. Worth it.
Options, worhtwhile vs worthless?
- Thread starter Rdfish1
- Start date
Drove down to Omaha from denver to pick up my trail. saved 3k after the airfare and hotel. Worth it.
Whiplash Willy
New member
I don't care what Mike Quincy says, rust has always been a problem, and still is, with any Toyota BOF vehicle. They use a cheap coating on the frame that doesn't even adhear to the welds. Just look at a brand new 4runner's frame in the dealer's lot, You will find they come pre-rusted from the factory! If you live anywhere that uses salt or mag-chloride, and want to keep your frame in good condition, you should be taking some preventive measures, and/or cleaning it regularly during the winter months.
Just do a search on rust on these forums and you will see alot of complaints:
https://www.google.com/#q=site:toyota-4Runner.org%2F5th-gen-t4rs%2F+frame+rust
The real question is, how well does the undercoating the dealer uses protect against rust. Typically any dealer provided addon product, whether it be undercoat, paint protection, or clear shield, usually isn't the highest quality product, and is over priced. If you live in the "Rust Belt" you would be better off finding a positively reviewed shop that specializes in undercoating, then have the dealer do it.
Also paying $200 for dealer installed door edge guards and handle guards is crazy. You can get kits of high quality 3m stuff that is pre-cut for your vehicle, and install it yourself in under an hour for a fraction of the price. Also, don't let the dealer stick you with easily removable add ons like Floor Mats, Cross Bars, and Running Boards. When I bought my 4runnner, the one on the lot with most of the options I wanted came with $250 carpeted Floor Mats. I "negotiated" that out of the price, and used that $250 to buy myself some Husky Liners.
You can get a kit to etch the glass yourself for cheaper. And unless your insurance gives you a discount for it, it's not worth it because they are the ones on the hook if your car is stolen.
Clear bra would be worthwhile if you care about keeping the paint pristine, but if you off-road you probably don't care as much. You can probably get it cheaper from a detail shop, anyway, unless you negotiate the price of it way down.
Rear seats would be nice every once in a while, but if you can't quickly install and remove them, then it's not worth the lost space and extra weight. They should be removable like minivan second row seats usually are.
Clear bra would be worthwhile if you care about keeping the paint pristine, but if you off-road you probably don't care as much. You can probably get it cheaper from a detail shop, anyway, unless you negotiate the price of it way down.
Rear seats would be nice every once in a while, but if you can't quickly install and remove them, then it's not worth the lost space and extra weight. They should be removable like minivan second row seats usually are.
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WW -
Just saw your other post on the frame weld rusting. Did you ever get your issues corrected, did your fix work?
To clarify, I didn't just rely on Mike Quincy's comment, I went off the numerous comments from other members on this forum regarding the necessity of undercoating. If people want to pay for it -- go ahead. I didn't want to get gouged by the dealership for their product.
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Whiplash Willy
New member
Yea, several months back I went over the frame myself with some Rust Bullet. It took a couple days of work, but I covered every part of the frame that had surface rust or missing coating with it. Someday when I have time I will try to take some pics, but here is my original thread that shows the before pics:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/148656-frame-welds-rusting-already.html
Here is what I did:
Day 1:
-Put the 4runner up on ramps (All 4 tires), removed the spare and skids, and pressure washed the underside.
-I then used a cheap car mitt, and standard car wash soap, and hand washed every part of the frame I could reach/see.
-I then rinsed/pressure washed everything under there and dried with with a blower and towels.
-Then I used 60Grit sand paper scuffed up every area I was going to coat (Basically every frame weld, since they all had surface rust) and any other area with surface rust. (My frame had nothing worse then very light surface rust to begin with, so my prep wasn't too bad)
-I then hand washed and thoroughly rinsed and dried the frame to remove the sanding residue.
-I let it dry overnight, because it has to be 100% dry for the coating to adhere properly. Rust Bullet does have special prep chemicals you can use, but I decided the condition of the frame didn't warrant it.
I decided to use rust bullet because it is similar to Por-15, however it has been shown to protect as well, if not better, and is more forgiving then Por-15 with proper prep.
Day 2:
I applied the "Rust Bullet Automotive" paint to every area that had surface rust or missing frame coating. I used several cheap paint brushes to apply it. I waited 4 hours, then applied a 2nd coat.
4 Hours after the 2nd coat, I applied their "Black Shell" Top Coat over the entire frame.
The "Rust Bullet Automotive" only comes in a Grey Color. While it isn't UV sensitive like Por-15, I didn't want a bunch of grey parts throughout the frame, which is why I top coated it. The Black Shell came out a little more glossier then I would like, but it goes on well with 1 coat, and dries really hard. I feel it will hold up much better again rocks and ect then the factory coat would have.
I left the LCAs and Spare uncoated, even though their welds have surface rust, because they are easily replaceable, and I will be able to see how they hold up vs the rust bullet.
Now that the frame is dirty, the Black Shell has lost its glossiness, and looks like a standard frame coat.
Here is a link to the products:
Rust Bullet Automotive - Products | Rust Bullet
BlackShell - Topcoats - Products | Rust Bullet
*On a side note, before I decided to go with Rust Bullet, I called up their CS line, and the 1st person who answered was very knowledgeable about their product and answered every question I had.
Living in Portland Oregon, where it rarely snows, and they don't use salt, I don't think it would have gotten horribly bad, like what I have seen from people in "The Salt Belt", but there was enough of it exposed where it would have gotten worse over time, and would have bugged the hell out of me, since rust is a huge pet peeve of mine. This is my first new Toyota BOF, and I want to keep it in good condition for as long as possible. At the end of the day, all it took was less then $100 in supplies, and a few days. Now I feel much better when im under the 4runner doing service, looking up at a black frame.
I do feel Toyota does a decent job coating their bodies and Uni-bodys, however they still have a long way to go with their frame coating.
03_4x4Runner
Senior Member
This is what I did for this problem. http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/174156-tonneau-cover-finished-what-toyota-started.html
That's funny. I live in Omaha but the Lincoln, NE Toyota went and got our trail from ND. Sent a driver up and he drove it back. I didn't care about the miles
Only thing I wanted beside base Limited was auto start - maybe a better aftermarket is available but didn't want to deal with it. Only options that can't be easily added later are 3rd row, auto running boards, and sliding cargo - I didn't want any of the three. Accessories can be ordered later or aftermarket. My opinion is Toyoguard or whatever, is a farce - not heard of in my part of country - have heard of equivalent at dealerships for last 40 years - just a big money maker.
I agree with you. You may have seen the thread about my 4th gen -- my frame rusted to oblivion. But I don't see any rust on the body.
Friggin Idiot
Senior Member
The options I went with were considered. I don't mean to step on toes, just providing opinion.
Roof rack cross bars because I occasionally need to grab lumber and other long things for the house. 6ft long is diagonal limit of rear cargo area with 2nd row folded down. I'm not willing to risk my nav unit or windshield if someone pulls out in front of me and I have to panic brake with stuff piled on my center console. I've learned this lesson the hard way, thankfully with a windshield instead of an expensive nav unit, but still a stupid feeling to have.
Heated seats (STD on LTD?) Cooled seats I'd pass on, unless you're in some sunny state of the south where you just can't stand to sit on hot seats in the summer.
Remote Start if you think you need it. I like getting into a pre-heated vehicle when it's snowy/icy. Don't get Toyo OEM, get the Viper or something like it. The OEM has a 10 minute auto shut-off and won't let you enter the vehicle with the engine running. So after using remote start, I have to unlock the truck (which turns off the engine), get in, and restart the truck. It doesn't sound hard, but when you're carrying groceries and trying to walk on an icy parking lot, it's certainly not fun.
Floormats, your choice. There are whole threads on this. I got the carpeted mats with mine purchase. I wanted them in case I didn't like the HuskyLiners, although probably should have just gone without the carpeted ones. The full set of HuskyLiners set me back around $275 with the big rear cargo mat ordered direct. I prefer HuskyLiners to the Weathertechs for the feel (more grippy in wet/muddy conditions). Some say the factory rubber mats are fine, but I wanted the spill protection after what happened to my last vehicles.
ToyoGuard sounds like a waste of $$$. I found a local 3M tint shop and had them do clear bra (aka paint protection film) and a front window tint to match rears for $550. He did the entire bumper which the Toyota kit does not include. If you're only going to do the metal parts, then what's the point? I don't want rock chips in my plastic bumper either!
As for undercoating, I'm sure you can do better with aftermarket if you're really concerned about it. There are plenty of good shops in the "Rust Belt" if you need it.
The sliding cargo tray seems to be all over the 4Runners, I had to look to find one without it already installed! It's not like you're unloading a semi, if you can't reach in an pull what you need out of the truck, then you shouldn't have put it there in the first place. I'm an average guy (5'10") and I have no trouble reaching things against the 2nd row seat from the rear hatch. Do watch you knees on the hitch receiver though.
3rd row. I've never gotten in an SUV 3rd row that I liked. I look at them like the 3rd row of the old station wagons, useful for that child you are the most mad at while going over the river and through the woods to grandma's. There's never enough legroom for an adult to not feel sardined in, and getting in and out might as well be like crawling through your kid's outdoor play-set. Let you kids build some character and make them sit 3 across on the rear seat, it's what we all had to do growing up and it didn't kill us or our siblings. If you need more than that, you should be buying a bigger vehicle.
Roof rack cross bars because I occasionally need to grab lumber and other long things for the house. 6ft long is diagonal limit of rear cargo area with 2nd row folded down. I'm not willing to risk my nav unit or windshield if someone pulls out in front of me and I have to panic brake with stuff piled on my center console. I've learned this lesson the hard way, thankfully with a windshield instead of an expensive nav unit, but still a stupid feeling to have.
Heated seats (STD on LTD?) Cooled seats I'd pass on, unless you're in some sunny state of the south where you just can't stand to sit on hot seats in the summer.
Remote Start if you think you need it. I like getting into a pre-heated vehicle when it's snowy/icy. Don't get Toyo OEM, get the Viper or something like it. The OEM has a 10 minute auto shut-off and won't let you enter the vehicle with the engine running. So after using remote start, I have to unlock the truck (which turns off the engine), get in, and restart the truck. It doesn't sound hard, but when you're carrying groceries and trying to walk on an icy parking lot, it's certainly not fun.
Floormats, your choice. There are whole threads on this. I got the carpeted mats with mine purchase. I wanted them in case I didn't like the HuskyLiners, although probably should have just gone without the carpeted ones. The full set of HuskyLiners set me back around $275 with the big rear cargo mat ordered direct. I prefer HuskyLiners to the Weathertechs for the feel (more grippy in wet/muddy conditions). Some say the factory rubber mats are fine, but I wanted the spill protection after what happened to my last vehicles.
ToyoGuard sounds like a waste of $$$. I found a local 3M tint shop and had them do clear bra (aka paint protection film) and a front window tint to match rears for $550. He did the entire bumper which the Toyota kit does not include. If you're only going to do the metal parts, then what's the point? I don't want rock chips in my plastic bumper either!
As for undercoating, I'm sure you can do better with aftermarket if you're really concerned about it. There are plenty of good shops in the "Rust Belt" if you need it.
The sliding cargo tray seems to be all over the 4Runners, I had to look to find one without it already installed! It's not like you're unloading a semi, if you can't reach in an pull what you need out of the truck, then you shouldn't have put it there in the first place. I'm an average guy (5'10") and I have no trouble reaching things against the 2nd row seat from the rear hatch. Do watch you knees on the hitch receiver though.
3rd row. I've never gotten in an SUV 3rd row that I liked. I look at them like the 3rd row of the old station wagons, useful for that child you are the most mad at while going over the river and through the woods to grandma's. There's never enough legroom for an adult to not feel sardined in, and getting in and out might as well be like crawling through your kid's outdoor play-set. Let you kids build some character and make them sit 3 across on the rear seat, it's what we all had to do growing up and it didn't kill us or our siblings. If you need more than that, you should be buying a bigger vehicle.
DesertCanyons
New member
You can have the 3rd row or you can have the slider, but you can't have both. They occupy the same part of the rear cargo area.
Personally, I don't care for the cargo tray. It takes up space in height and reduces the flat floor area around the tray. I want the space for camp gear, not the sliding tailgate party table. If I want a table I'll take one of my camping tables.
I believe what people say here about the small 3rd row seat. If you want one buy a Land Cruiser or Sequoia or any larger SUV.
I live near Boston. I won't own another car without heated seats (unless it is a weekend toy only drive on sunny Sunday afternoons). I don't need cooled seats. YMMV.
