Should i drain and fill?

[nathanroyse]

I bought this 4Runner about 2 weeks about and it has started to have hard shifts. It still shifts into every gear but i would rather try and fix it now before something worse happens when im away from home. Ive heard that flushing the transmission when its never been done before can also make problems worse. There are no records of anyone servicing the transmission. The car is at 191k miles. Here are some pictures of the condition of the fluid and the pan. Please let me know what you guys think and/or what youve done if youve had this problem. Thank you!

 

[itskohler]

If you got with a flush make sure the place uses whats known at a T-Tech machine. It used the transmissions own pump to move the fluid. I've never bought into the idea that flushing a transmission will harm it, specially using a T-Tech. If a flush does kill your transmission, it was on its way out anyways.

 

[nathanroyse]

If you got with a flush make sure the place uses whats known at a T-Tech machine. It used the transmissions own pump to move the fluid. I've never bought into the idea that flushing a transmission will harm it, specially using a T-Tech. If a flush does kill your transmission, it was on its way out anyways.

I havent heard of that but ill check it out. ive been told that if you remove the old fluid with all the particles in it and replace it with new fluid, it wont have the particles which might make it start to slip. thats a bad explanation but hopefully it makes sense.

 

[lockedlex]

Also, make sure your transmission kickdown cable is properly adjusted if you're a 96-00. If it's set too tightly, you will get harsher downshifts.

 

[nathanroyse]

Also, make sure your transmission kickdown cable is properly adjusted if you're a 96-00. If it's set too tightly, you will get harsher downshifts.

Ill look into it. How do i adjust it? its not so much downshifts though. its when im accelerating.

 

[maxthebird]

Your transmission fluid does not look that bad. It's a pink color when new and yours looks slightly off but OK. A bad color would be a dark brown which indicates overheating. You can try just changing the fluid without a flush and see what happens. A power flush is an iffy proposition if there is a lot of wear and clutch material in the pan.

 

[lockedlex]

Ill look into it. How do i adjust it? its not so much downshifts though. its when im accelerating.

yes, it basically makes all shifting (up/down) harsher vs. gentler (slipping softly, which isn't good either). Generally, you actually want a crisp/harsher shift to preserve transmission life.

It's called something else officially, but commonly referred to here as a kickdown cable. I'd run a search for the adjustment.

 

[Devbot]

Your transmission fluid does not look that bad. It's a pink color when new and yours looks slightly off but OK. A bad color would be a dark brown which indicates overheating. You can try just changing the fluid without a flush and see what happens. A power flush is an iffy proposition if there is a lot of wear and clutch material in the pan.

^^^ I second this. Sometimes rough shifting is just the sign of old fluid. As said, if a flush hurts your trans, then something was seriously wrong already. I understand this is a common myth, but it makes no logical sense that fresh, new fluid will hurt your car over of worn down fluid that's thinned out and possibly carrying particulate. I was about to go for a flush soon too, since after cold starts it's a little sticky between 2nd and 3rd for the first 1-2 shifts (plus I don't think it's ever been changed or had a new screen put in)
What WILL hurt your car is someone doing a flush improperly, so make sure they know what they're doing

 

[itskohler]

I havent heard of that but ill check it out. ive been told that if you remove the old fluid with all the particles in it and replace it with new fluid, it wont have the particles which might make it start to slip. thats a bad explanation but hopefully it makes sense.

Any particles that are large enough to keep the transmission alive are being filtered by the pan filter anyways. Which only furthers what I've always found to make sense, if a transmission flush is what does it in, it was already a dead transmission running on borrowed time.

Now, a powered flush is different from a T-Tech. The trans fluid doesn't flow backwards, isn't propelled faster than it should be. Those can wreck an otherwise good trans by clogging ports and pushing particles where they shouldn't go.

 

[gamefreakgc]

A few thoughts:

Your transmission fluid looks ok. Switching to a quality synthetic fluid like Redline or Royal Purple will smooth the shifts out, that's exactly what it did to mine. Cold starts shift hard though. When we say cold starts, it doesn't have to be cold outside, just any temperature lower than the operating temperature. Once it warms up it should shift smoother.

Your transmission cable is this one:

.

You want no slack in the cable between the bracket and the throttle body. Same goes with the cruise control. The throttle cable should have just the slightest amount of slack so that the pedal doesn't get stuck open in hot/cold conditions.

 

[TimGFL]

Also, make sure your transmission kickdown cable is properly adjusted if you're a 96-00. If it's set too tightly, you will get harsher downshifts.

Nice tip! My shift is a little off so I may check that!

 

[TimGFL]

A few thoughts:

Your transmission fluid looks ok. Switching to a quality synthetic fluid like Redline or Royal Purple will smooth the shifts out, that's exactly what it did to mine. Cold starts shift hard though. When we say cold starts, it doesn't have to be cold outside, just any temperature lower than the operating temperature. Once it warms up it should shift smoother.

That's a good thought. Mine won't shift into 3rd at all until the temp gauge starts creeping up past the low temp line. Been that way since I bought it 3 years ago.

 

[plcfcng]

If your pan has never been pulled as far as you know it would be best to pull the pan inspect for large chunks and or a bunch of metal it would be good to know. Then wash the pan clean including the magnets don't for get to put them pack in. Replace or wash the trans filter ( OEM has a metal screen that you can see so if it's clean than I would reuse it and save it 30 dollars.) Replace the pan refill the pan see Tim's video on doing this it's perfect. The method he uses is drain and refill from the trans cooler line. Be sure to get a inch lb torque wrench then putting things back. Be sure to check the cable adjustment.:mullet:

 

[19963.4lsr5]

Make sure the lever on the trans is operating freely. That lever is in the worse environment.

It’s the throttle valve cable and it controls line pressure.

Your trans may have had a shift kit installed which firms up the shifts. Especially during acceleration when you’re above 1/2 throttle.

I like shifts firm enough that the tires chirp on the 1-2 up shift at WOT.

All three of my 4Runners with anywhere from 120k miles to 280k miles won’t shift into 3rd with a cold trans unless your going above 40mph.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[alumarine]

Actually when it's cold it will shift into 3rd.
It's O/D that it won't shift into before it warms up enough.

 

[phattyduck]

That's a good thought. Mine won't shift into 3rd at all until the temp gauge starts creeping up past the low temp line. Been that way since I bought it 3 years ago.

That's by design. They all did it since new. It warms up the engine, cat(s) and trans faster. (it will shift out of 2nd, just at a much higher RPM that you might want)

-Charlie

 

[phattyduck]

It might also be worth checking if the trans fluid level is correct. All final trans fluid checks must happen when the fluid is at 'operating temperatures' - 155-174*f, which can take 10+ miles of driving. Then, with the engine still running, manually shift through all gears (P-R-N-D-2-1-2-D-N-R-P), then with engine running and still in park on a level surface, check the fluid level...

If it is out of range, fix that first.

The fluid condition doesn't look perfect, but it has definitely been serviced through its life. Don't be afraid of a drain + refill or two.

There might also be a history of a "pink milkshake" that is now showing up - though I think that normally results in over-revving/flaring not hard shifts.

-Charlie

 

[nathanroyse]

A few thoughts:

Your transmission fluid looks ok. Switching to a quality synthetic fluid like Redline or Royal Purple will smooth the shifts out, that's exactly what it did to mine. Cold starts shift hard though. When we say cold starts, it doesn't have to be cold outside, just any temperature lower than the operating temperature. Once it warms up it should shift smoother.

Your transmission cable is this one:

.

You want no slack in the cable between the bracket and the throttle body. Same goes with the cruise control. The throttle cable should have just the slightest amount of slack so that the pedal doesn't get stuck open in hot/cold conditions.

thank you for your input. if i were to switch to one of those ATFs, would i have to do a complete flush? or could i drain and fill replacing with one of those.

 

[gamefreakgc]

thank you for your input. if i were to switch to one of those ATFs, would i have to do a complete flush? or could i drain and fill replacing with one of those.

You can drain and fill, the fluids are compatible. Each drain and fill takes out 3 quarts (some transmissions it's closer to 4) and the entire system has a 12 quart capacity, I recommend doing it at least twice with driving in between to mix the fluid but realize that you're draining out brand new fluid with the old once you do it a second time. Doing a flush has the same effect, it takes more than 12 quarts if you are trying to go for brand new fluid in the whole system.

I did it 3 times when I switched to synthetic. I replaced approximately 60% of the fluid doing it that way.

 

[pilotguy757]

thank you for your input. if i were to switch to one of those ATFs, would i have to do a complete flush? or could i drain and fill replacing with one of those.

Honestly, I would flush it out yourself.

I did a drain and fill after my transmission overheated with Valvoline MaxLife because it has a higher resistance to heat than the OE fluid. After the drain and fill it still overheated. I eventually said screw it and did a full flush measuring the amount that came out and put it back in the same amount while the truck was running. It was easy. Watch Timmy's how to video.

After the full flush with Valvoline MaxLife, no more overheating and I just keep an eye on the temp when wheeling.