Sports Mode Questions

[Eagle62]

One thing I've noticed compare to most other automatics I've recently driven is when in D and I release accelerator there seems to be quite a drive train resistance that slows the vehicle down more rapidly than the 'free' coasting I'd expect. In other vehicles it feels more like the trans is in neutral vs. still engaged. I find if I put the 4R in neutral I when releasing accelerator I don't get as much drag and can coast more freely.

I think we call that "engine braking". Could work to your advantage in some situations.

 

[Eagle62]

From what I remember:

High Point New jersey is the highest point in the state; it is at about 500 feet; it is flat terrain at High Point.

It's no wonder you might not ever use the S mode -

The original owner of my 4Runner was in New Jersey - It probably had never been used in 4wd except in snow; had probably never been in 4LOW; had probably never been used in s mode - - -

That all changed when I started driving it on 10 December 2015 -

Thank you previous owner:

end quote]
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Highest point in Jersey is about 1800 feet. Maybe you meant 500 METERS. Either way, plenty of places in the area to use 4WD, hi or lo, not just in the snow.

 

[noisebeam]

I think we call that "engine braking". Could work to your advantage in some situations.

Well of course that is why I use S1/S2 on trails or S3/S4 down long paved descents to keep speed under control with minimal brake braking, but in D I am not used to such 'aggressive' engine braking. I'm finding I'm taking foot off accelerator too soon before stops compared to other vehicles/trucks I've driven.

 

[Eagle62]

Well of course that is why I use S1/S2 on trails or S3/S4 down long paved descents to keep speed under control with minimal brake braking, but in D I am not used to such 'aggressive' engine braking. I'm finding I'm taking foot off accelerator too soon before stops compared to other vehicles/trucks I've driven.

I totally understand what you mean but we have a close to 5000lb truck, I certainly wouldn't want it to feel like a sports car. The engine braking, I'm sure helps with sudden stops in traffic (and puts a little less strain on your brakes). The point I'm trying to make is maybe it was designed that way on purpose.

 

[mdogg]

From what I remember:

High Point New jersey is the highest point in the state; it is at about 500 feet; it is flat terrain at High Point.

It's no wonder you might not ever use the S mode -

More like 550.... meters.

Seriously though, NJ is a tale of 2 states if you look at it. South/East is very flat. Then as you go North/West, it gets much more hilly (I wouldn't really call it mountainous, though). On some of the highways there are fairly major grades for going 65-80. A few years ago driving my old pickup truck, there was a stretch where I was going only about 50 by the time I hit the top of the grade. I use S-mode fairly frequently on certain sections every day.

 

[Ron4RNevada]

You are correct NJ and NY guys - I was wrong.

The highest point in NJ is in Sussex County and is 1803 feet.......

 

[Paui4m]

I agree. Definitely more pronounced in this vehicle.
To the point where if I let off the gas and touch the brakes at 40 or under, it immediately downshifts and 'lurches a bit'.

Well of course that is why I use S1/S2 on trails or S3/S4 down long paved descents to keep speed under control with minimal brake braking, but in D I am not used to such 'aggressive' engine braking. I'm finding I'm taking foot off accelerator too soon before stops compared to other vehicles/trucks I've driven.

 

[WCVanHorne]

Exactly, and it'll even overrule you on that if you push it too far. I tried leaving it in 2 on an onramp during my test drive - it beeped at me and shifted up before redlining.

This thread is actually quite timely for me.

I just came back from an extra long weekend in the mountains and spent a quite a few hours rather aggressively driving the paved trail access roads. As most of you fellow mountain drivers know D is useless in windy, steep conditions, particularly when trying not to run down brake riding flatlanders or pass them.

Anyhow for the first time I ran my 2012 into the red band for several seconds a couple times. The longest was probably a 5 vehicle pass where I'd just finished engine & pad braking down to ~50 km/h in 2nd and then took off because I hit a straight section with an opening. While gauging the pass and keeping my head up to scan the road I think I ran her up to somewhat over 6000 RPM for a few seconds (~120km/h) before slapping it into 3rd.

During this event and another, briefer one I heard no warning beep, nor did it do an upshift override. Basicly my question is: does this feature exist on 2012 and what are the parameters for it? E.G. 5 sec >5900 RPM (start of red zone)? Hitting 7000 RPM? Something else?

A related, or perhaps the same question for those in the know is what is the real red "line", as opposed to warning red "zone"? I don't always drive my 4Runner like a poor man's sports car; but between the odd busy approach road with a ton of *really* slow tourists and long mountain pass down slopes with a mid-sized utility trailer, I occasionally push the line (well zone) and would like to know what the actual safety margin is and if there is an ultimate upshift override.

 

[Bimmer-Bob]

This thread is actually quite timely for me.

I just came back from an extra long weekend in the mountains and spent a quite a few hours rather aggressively driving the paved trail access roads. As most of you fellow mountain drivers know D is useless in windy, steep conditions, particularly when trying not to run down brake riding flatlanders or pass them.

Anyhow for the first time I ran my 2012 into the red band for several seconds a couple times. The longest was probably a 5 vehicle pass where I'd just finished engine & pad braking down to ~50 km/h in 2nd and then took off because I hit a straight section with an opening. While gauging the pass and keeping my head up to scan the road I think I ran her up to somewhat over 6000 RPM for a few seconds (~120km/h) before slapping it into 3rd.

During this event and another, briefer one I heard no warning beep, nor did it do an upshift override. Basicly my question is: does this feature exist on 2012 and what are the parameters for it? E.G. 5 sec >5900 RPM (start of red zone)? Hitting 7000 RPM? Something else?

A related, or perhaps the same question for those in the know is what is the real red "line", as opposed to warning red "zone"? I don't always drive my 4Runner like a poor man's sports car; but between the odd busy approach road with a ton of *really* slow tourists and long mountain pass down slopes with a mid-sized utility trailer, I occasionally push the line (well zone) and would like to know what the actual safety margin is and if there is an ultimate upshift override.

Not sure about this truck, but vehicles generally have a rev limiter to protect the engine. Bouncing off of the rev limiter for a few seconds is a fairly frequent occurrence in autocross or at track days, and is considered mostly harmless. If you didn't hear or feel the engine cutting power, then you didn't hit the limiter.

 

[WCVanHorne]

Not sure about this truck, but vehicles generally have a rev limiter to protect the engine. Bouncing off of the rev limiter for a few seconds is a fairly frequent occurrence in autocross or at track days, and is considered mostly harmless. If you didn't hear or feel the engine cutting power, then you didn't hit the limiter.

Thanks for the reply.

I am pretty sure there is something. Heck on dyno runs don't they go though the whole band till they hit that limit (past peak torque and power)?

I'd still love to know where it is without thrashing my engine just to find out. From the previous posts it sounds like there is a warning beep, probably a throttle cap, and a forced upshift (if possible). From my experience, or more accurately lack of experiencing it, this must occur closer to 7000 RPM and possibly involves some amount of time there.

 

[WCVanHorne]

So to bump the thread a bit I was looking around the net and about the only thing I found was some claims on Edmunds.com that:

2012 & 2011

Redline (rpm) 5,900​

and

2014

Redline, indicated (rpm) 5,800
Fuel cutoff/rev limiter (rpm) 5,900​

Not sure why it might have changed on the 2014 refresh or if it really did. In any event I have had the 2012 very briefly, and definitely, over 6,000 and not encountered the limiter (nor any rumored beep or up-shift).

You would think someone would know for sure.

 

[Jeremy556]

I doubt there are any fuel injected engines sold today that do not have an ignition rev limiter. The needle on the cluster is likely not 100% accurate. They may have changed the gauge graphics in 2014 to be 100rpm lower, but the real red line has not changed since 2010.

 

[WCVanHorne]

I doubt there are any fuel injected engines sold today that do not have an ignition rev limiter. The needle on the cluster is likely not 100% accurate. They may have changed the gauge graphics in 2014 to be 100rpm lower, but the real red line has not changed since 2010.

I'm not actually suggesting a modern engine doesn't have an ECU controlled rev limiter. You are possibly correct that the gauge is a little off on the high end. However I do suspect the rev limiter might actually be somewhat higher than 5900 RPM. In the end I just wish I could find a simple Toyota reference confirming the number and behavior in terms of audible warning and/or up-shift.

 

[SPENCERPDX]

Just got a 2017 4Runner and joined this forum. I'm a little unclear about D vs S and yes I've read the manual. If the initial max gear is 4 in S, what if I shift from D to S when I'm in 5th gear? Will it let me and if it does, is that bad for the transmission- forcing the transmission from 5th to 4th when it wants to be in 5th? Can you shift from D to S at any speed? Thanks!

 

[WallyT4R]

Just got a 2017 4Runner and joined this forum. I'm a little unclear about D vs S and yes I've read the manual. If the initial max gear is 4 in S, what if I shift from D to S when I'm in 5th gear? Will it let me and if it does, is that bad for the transmission- forcing the transmission from 5th to 4th when it wants to be in 5th? Can you shift from D to S at any speed? Thanks!

I shifted from D to S on the highway last night while approaching a mountain pass. I was going 65 mph. All it did was rev up to about 3000 rpm as it hit 4th gear. So keep that in mind that it is probably not a good idea to shift into S mode at 85 mph. I am not going to try it at that speed But again these trucks have a lot of nannies. The truck will protect itself from harm usually.

Congrats on your new 4Runner!

 

[yifangd]

I shifted from D to S on the highway last night while approaching a mountain pass. I was going 65 mph. All it did was rev up to about 3000 rpm as it hit 4th gear. So keep that in mind that it is probably not a good idea to shift into S mode at 85 mph. I am not going to try it at that speed But again these trucks have a lot of nannies. The truck will protect itself from harm usually.

Congrats on your new 4Runner!

I just got my first new 4Runner, and this thread is so helpful! I tried out the shift to S on highway speed (~70mph), didn't notice much difference. but it's great reading this thread to learn about them.

One take away is - don't shift to S on highway

 

[e60ral]

you can absolutely shift into S on the highway, it's fine. the transmission isn't going to do anything that will hurt the engine.

i usually move to S to downshift before passing so i can go ahead and get in gear so i don't have that delays when it downshifts when i hit the gas.

 

[17KT4R]

Rev Limiter ? Good grief - I suppose if you really want to find out then Park is the way to do it, just make sure you're at operating temp and hold it at 4K for a few seconds to build high oil pressure and ensure optimum lubrication when you floor it. It would be harder to do it in gear and not exactly recommended for the rest of the drive train.

As for the shift characteristics of this transmission I find it reacts exactly the way it should for pushing around a 5 thousand pound vehicle. I think it is all about learning what throttle position makes the trans react the way it should, and does. I've tried S too but find that stabbing the accelerator pedal just far enough provides the exact downshift I need and holding it there long enough makes the trans react exactly the way I expect. But I don't tow and traverse mountain passes so I suspect that is where S mode really shines in allowing you to hold gears. I've not found a use otherwise in relatively normal driving scenarios so far... I've only owned this thing for 6 months :beer:

 

[1jzgte]

I just got my first new 4Runner, and this thread is so helpful! I tried out the shift to S on highway speed (~70mph), didn't notice much difference. but it's great reading this thread to learn about them.

One take away is - don't shift to S on highway

FYI, if you're ever towing and going up a huge incline. S-mode helps you downshift and keep it at that gear to climb. Otherwise your transmission might hunt between 3rd 4th 5th. The hunting for gears will heat up your transmission fast. Lots of guys w/o aftermarket trans. coolers report tranny fluid temps over 200 degrees. Trans fluid will start to degrade at that point.

 

[WallyT4R]

FYI, if you're ever towing and going up a huge incline. S-mode helps you downshift and keep it at that gear to climb. Otherwise your transmission might hunt between 3rd 4th 5th. The hunting for gears will heat up your transmission fast. Lots of guys w/o aftermarket trans. coolers report tranny fluid temps over 200 degrees. Trans fluid will start to degrade at that point.

I don't take it out of S mode while towing ever and keep it in fourth gear on the highway. But usually don't go above 70mph while towing either.