Stick with 3rd gen or go 4th?

[atalarico]

Hey all,

My beloved '97 was recently totaled and I'm trying to figure out if I want to go up to a 4th gen for my next 4R. I've searched high and low in the forums and have read some good stuff, but not sure everyone has been in this position and has the same use-case as I do.

My T4R is mainly used a few times a month for moderate off-road adventures here in Colorado. I don't rock-crawl in it, but I certainly like taking it up roads that are a little more challenging so I can find nicer primitive campsites, shorten approaches to climbing peaks, etc.

While I loved my 97, it certainly wasn't without shortcomings if I'm being honest, and I'm wondering if a 4th would overcome those.

So far what I've learned:

1.) 4th Gens have lower stock clearance than 3rd's, so getting back to the clearance I had with my 2.5-3" lifted 3rd gen will be more expensive right away and likely require new CVs and a diff drop, right? I don't really "need" that kind of clearance again, but damn it was nice to just not ever have to worry about scraping anything. I'd definitely go Toytec for Bils 5100 and eibach springs again since it yielded a great ride on my 3rd. I'd skip the Tundra bils since that ride was way too harsh in my 3rd after I threw the Tacoma Bils on there (unless the added weight of the V8 will require it).

2.) While most 4th Gen years I can afford won't have a locker, the ATRAC system does really well and I probably won't need a locker anyway.

3.) V8 V8 V8 V8 V8 V8. It's the more bulletproof of the engines in the model years I can afford (pre 05). The V8s are also full-time AWD which would have likely prevented the way I totaled my 97 too. Oh and the V8 has a tranny cooler from the factory?

4.) The stock look of the 4th Gen doesn't do it for me like the 3rds so that will require more work to get it "there". At least a front bumper to start with?

I'm looking at hopefully keeping it under $8k, and some of the later 3rds I've found are trail ready and seem to be well taken care of and are either under 200k or just a bit over 200k miles. The 4th gens in that range seem to be hit or miss and would need work to make them more trail ready, and are higher mileage by comparison. If I get another 3rd I'll have some parts ready to swap over if it needs it.

I need to test drive all of them that I can and that might tell me more, but I'm just looking for input for anyone else that was in my position.

 

[2016 4Runner SR5]

3rd or 5th, skip the 4th

 

[atalarico]

3rd or 5th, skip the 4th

Yeah, prior to needing a new one, I used to say that too. My budget is about $8k so 5th gens are out for a while but I look forward to getting one in another 10 years!

 

[2016 4Runner SR5]

Yeah 8K won't get you a 5th. It will get you a nice 3rd though. Nothing at all wrong with a 4th, I just don't like how they look lol. I've seen some nice ones but most don't do much for me.

 

[2016 4Runner SR5]

If you like and want a 5th, why not use the 8K as a down payment? Even if not brand new, at least it will be newer and will possibly have a warranty.

 

[markymark191]

3rd or 5th, skip the 4th

Don't know where you would find a 5th gen for under 8k.

I also owned a 97 until I had to get rid of it due to frame issues. I now have a 2004. It sounds like you are mostly only going to be using it on trails. In that case I would go for the 3rd gen if you can find one in good condition. As far as a daily driver the 4th gen is definitely more comfortable to me, but I also like the looks of the 3rd better. I would definitely go for the v8 is you are lifting and getting bigger tires. the v6 is fine but I really would like the v8 haha.

 

[atalarico]

If you like and want a 5th, why not use the 8K as a down payment? Even if not brand new, at least it will be newer and will possibly have a warranty.

I thought about it, but I don't want two car payments right now, or a car payment ever again lol. But yeah, I definitely thought hard about selling my Golf R and just going back to one car and getting a 5th Gen TRD...but it isn't in the cards.

Don't know where you would find a 5th gen for under 8k.

I also owned a 97 until I had to get rid of it due to frame issues. I now have a 2004. It sounds like you are mostly only going to be using it on trails. In that case I would go for the 3rd gen if you can find one in good condition. As far as a daily driver the 4th gen is definitely more comfortable to me, but I also like the looks of the 3rd better. I would definitely go for the v8 is you are lifting and getting bigger tires. the v6 is fine but I really would like the v8 haha.

Thanks! I definitely appreciate good road manners getting to the trail though, and my lifted 97 had some whacky ass road manners. But yeah, V8, lift, and 33's would be my ideal end goal.

 

[ElZilcho]

I really enjoyed my 3rd gen but I bought the 4gen for a couple of very specific reasons. 1) The V8 and 7000# towing capacity. 2) I needed something a little newer and a little more maintenance free. Not that the 3rd gens aren't dependable, I just didn't want to be dealing with the issues you get in any 15+ year old truck.

I like the 3rd gens relative simplicity. Diff lock, lever actuated range selector, fewer nanny's and electronicals [sic], etc.

If I had enough time/money for a "fun" truck I would have seriously considered getting another 3rd gen (or dumped more money into my 80 series) but my situation is the opposite of yours. My 4runner is my DD and my car is the fun one.

You would get no judgement from me if you chose to stick with the 3rd gen, especially since you might be able to salvage some of your current mods and swap them over to the new truck.

I guess, long story short, for me...
I like my 4gen. I loved my 3rd gen.

 

[atalarico]

I guess, long story short, for me...
I like my 4gen. I loved my 3rd gen.

That says a lot. Thank you!

I'm also wondering if I'd opt to DD my 4R more if it had better road manners too, even if I do lift it 3". I think I stopped DD'ing my 3rd Gen because it really wasn't built up for commuting to work on highway (especially compared to my tuned Golf R). I did everything possible to tighten up the steering and make the road manners better, and it still was just a little sketchy at highway speeds. Hmmmmm...

 

[jreask]

Hey all,

My beloved '97 was recently totaled and I'm trying to figure out if I want to go up to a 4th gen for my next 4R. I've searched high and low in the forums and have read some good stuff, but not sure everyone has been in this position and has the same use-case as I do.

My T4R is mainly used a few times a month for moderate off-road adventures here in Colorado. I don't rock-crawl in it, but I certainly like taking it up roads that are a little more challenging so I can find nicer primitive campsites, shorten approaches to climbing peaks, etc.

While I loved my 97, it certainly wasn't without shortcomings if I'm being honest, and I'm wondering if a 4th would overcome those.

So far what I've learned:

1.) 4th Gens have lower stock clearance than 3rd's, so getting back to the clearance I had with my 2.5-3" lifted 3rd gen will be more expensive right away and likely require new CVs and a diff drop, right? I don't really "need" that kind of clearance again, but damn it was nice to just not ever have to worry about scraping anything. I'd definitely go Toytec for Bils 5100 and eibach springs again since it yielded a great ride on my 3rd. I'd skip the Tundra bils since that ride was way too harsh in my 3rd after I threw the Tacoma Bils on there (unless the added weight of the V8 will require it).

2.) While most 4th Gen years I can afford won't have a locker, the ATRAC system does really well and I probably won't need a locker anyway.

3.) V8 V8 V8 V8 V8 V8. It's the more bulletproof of the engines in the model years I can afford (pre 05). The V8s are also full-time AWD which would have likely prevented the way I totaled my 97 too. Oh and the V8 has a tranny cooler from the factory?

4.) The stock look of the 4th Gen doesn't do it for me like the 3rds so that will require more work to get it "there". At least a front bumper to start with?

I'm looking at hopefully keeping it under $8k, and some of the later 3rds I've found are trail ready and seem to be well taken care of and are either under 200k or just a bit over 200k miles. The 4th gens in that range seem to be hit or miss and would need work to make them more trail ready, and are higher mileage by comparison. If I get another 3rd I'll have some parts ready to swap over if it needs it.

I need to test drive all of them that I can and that might tell me more, but I'm just looking for input for anyone else that was in my position.

Have you driven a 4Th Gen ? There is a big difference in power even with the V6. The V6 has plenty of power compared to the 3Rd Gen trucks. I have owned at least 15 3RD gens and 6-7 4TH gens. The 4's are more comfortable with more room. They have more amenities also. I like both but I prefer the 4's.
I have also owned a few 5's, including a 2015 Trail. They are also underpowered unless you mash the pedal. Traded the trail for a GX. I guess I lean toward more power.

 

[ray k]

I think you will be very happy with a 4th gen. I have both a 4th and a 5th and while the 5th is shiny and new, I really like the 4th a lot better. It is much easier to drive(better handling and turning radius) and the interior on the newer 4runners is much cheaper. I know you can't afford a decent 5th gen, but I think you should go test drive both and go with your instincts. In the end you can't go wrong with ANY 4runner.

 

[atalarico]

Have you driven a 4Th Gen ? There is a big difference in power even with the V6. The V6 has plenty of power compared to the 3Rd Gen trucks. I have owned at least 15 3RD gens and 6-7 4TH gens. The 4's are more comfortable with more room. They have more amenities also. I like both but I prefer the 4's.
I have also owned a few 5's, including a 2015 Trail. They are also underpowered unless you mash the pedal. Traded the trail for a GX. I guess I lean toward more power.

Holy Moses, that's a lot of 4Runners! Save some for the rest of us!

I haven't driven a 4th yet, and I'm planning to do that this week after I get the inevitable "your frame is bent" call from the body shop.

I know the V6 is a 30% power increase over the 3rd Gen's V6, but it seems like the 4th Gen V6 has more problems for the years I can afford to buy right now (basically everything below 2005). Is that true? That's why I was thinking V8 was the way to go.

 

[atalarico]

I think you will be very happy with a 4th gen. I have both a 4th and a 5th and while the 5th is shiny and new, I really like the 4th a lot better. It is much easier to drive(better handling and turning radius) and the interior on the newer 4runners is much cheaper. I know you can't afford a decent 5th gen, but I think you should go test drive both and go with your instincts. In the end you can't go wrong with ANY 4runner.

Thanks! That's kind of what I'm thinking too is that 3rd or 4th gen, I really can't go wrong, it's just a matter of degree of awesomeness. I wish I could afford a 5th, but that'll come in another 10 years.

 

[ray k]

Yeah, the v6 has head gasket problems. I believe they solved it partway through 2006. It does have a timing chain where the v8 has a belt so you have to consider that expense/maintenance on the 8.

 

[jreask]

I just bought a 2004 V8 with 239K on it. I know the V8 is a great motor, but that V6 ain't no slouch. There were some head gasket failures on the early 4 v6's. I don't think as many as some make it out to be. I bought this 2004 that had the dreaded manifold leak and a pronounced ticking on acceleration. I gambled and came out ahead on this one. As I suspected it was the exhaust manifold gasket, as the manifold had already been replaced. So, instead of $1500 to repair , it was less than $200. It purrs like a silent kitten now. I guess my point is is that you take a gamble with any used car. These 4Runners can be abused and still be very reliable.

 

[markymark191]

Holy Moses, that's a lot of 4Runners! Save some for the rest of us!

I haven't driven a 4th yet, and I'm planning to do that this week after I get the inevitable "your frame is bent" call from the body shop.

I know the V6 is a 30% power increase over the 3rd Gen's V6, but it seems like the 4th Gen V6 has more problems for the years I can afford to buy right now (basically everything below 2005). Is that true? That's why I was thinking V8 was the way to go.

the Pre 2006 i believe v6 have the head gasket issue. Which just happend to me this last year, but hopefully I should be good till 300k miles or so now. Some people have problems with the exhaust manifold on the v8? correct me if I'm wrong. I think the two biggest issues for the v6 is the head gasket and actuator leak. Also if you do decide to go for the 4th gen make sure the 4x4 switch works. If those haven't been used they can get stuck and not work.

 

[jreask]

the Pre 2006 i believe v6 have the head gasket issue. Which just happend to me this last year, but hopefully I should be good till 300k miles or so now. Some people have problems with the exhaust manifold on the v8? correct me if I'm wrong. I think the two biggest issues for the v6 is the head gasket and actuator leak. Also if you do decide to go for the 4th gen make sure the 4x4 switch works. If those haven't been used they can get stuck and not work.

Good point on the actuator problem. Make sure you check 4lo when you drive them. Some people don't even know how to put these in 4 lo. If it doesn't go in right away or if it starts beeping keep trying a few times. Eventually it will go in pretty easily. If it doesn't don't buy it. As far as the center locker, those seem to be very hit and miss, even on the brand new 5's. they eventually lock but sometimes it takes a little while. I think you will love the 4th as soon as you drive it.

 

[atalarico]

Yeah, the v6 has head gasket problems. I believe they solved it partway through 2006. It does have a timing chain where the v8 has a belt so you have to consider that expense/maintenance on the 8.

Thanks! I'm used to timing belts since I had one in my old 3rd gen. It wasn't a huge deal, but I'm definitely only looking at 4th gen V8's that have had the timing belt job done recently.

I just bought a 2004 V8 with 239K on it. I know the V8 is a great motor, but that V6 ain't no slouch. There were some head gasket failures on the early 4 v6's. I don't think as many as some make it out to be. I bought this 2004 that had the dreaded manifold leak and a pronounced ticking on acceleration. I gambled and came out ahead on this one. As I suspected it was the exhaust manifold gasket, as the manifold had already been replaced. So, instead of $1500 to repair , it was less than $200. It purrs like a silent kitten now. I guess my point is is that you take a gamble with any used car. These 4Runners can be abused and still be very reliable.

Totally, and good to know your story just if anything so I have one more thing to ask about (re: manifold leak and ticking). I always joke about the 4Runner/Tacoma/Hilux being the vehicle of choice for Asia/Middle East/African guerrilla fighters for a reason. I'm sure they're not on top of their service intervals while waging war in jungles, yet those guys are always in Yotas!

the Pre 2006 i believe v6 have the head gasket issue. Which just happend to me this last year, but hopefully I should be good till 300k miles or so now. Some people have problems with the exhaust manifold on the v8? correct me if I'm wrong. I think the two biggest issues for the v6 is the head gasket and actuator leak. Also if you do decide to go for the 4th gen make sure the 4x4 switch works. If those haven't been used they can get stuck and not work.

Yeah, if I went V6 I'd go post-06. Even being good til 300k doesn't sit well with me for such an expensive fix since it's not an easy one to DIY. I've definitely read about making sure the 4x4 switches work too since some people don't exercise them enough, but that shouldn't be a problem with the V8s since they're full-time AWD, right?

 

[jreask]

Thanks! I'm used to timing belts since I had one in my old 3rd gen. It wasn't a huge deal, but I'm definitely only looking at 4th gen V8's that have had the timing belt job done recently.



Totally, and good to know your story just if anything so I have one more thing to ask about (re: manifold leak and ticking). I always joke about the 4Runner/Tacoma/Hilux being the vehicle of choice for Asia/Middle East/African guerrilla fighters for a reason. I'm sure they're not on top of their service intervals while waging war in jungles, yet those guys are always in Yotas!



Yeah, if I went V6 I'd go post-06. Even being good til 300k doesn't sit well with me for such an expensive fix since it's not an easy one to DIY. I've definitely read about making sure the 4x4 switches work too since some people don't exercise them enough, but that shouldn't be a problem with the V8s since they're full-time AWD, right?

Yes they are full time but you have 4 lo also. I've never needed 4 lo but it's nice to know it works if you do need it. Put it in neutral, push and turn switch to 4 lo..
the 4 lo light should come on the dash. Put it in drive and you're in 4Lo. Hopefully.

 

[atalarico]

Yes they are full time but you have 4 lo also. I've never needed 4 lo but it's nice to know it works if you do need it. Put it in neutral, push and turn switch to 4 lo..
the 4 lo light should come on the dash. Put it in drive and you're in 4Lo. Hopefully.

Yep! Considering this would mainly be a trail rig, 4Lo is important and something I'd be testing out for sure. Cheers!