Strange Transmisson Behavior on Cold Start

[4'running'26]

This past summer my 4runner started to exhibit some strange symptoms after sitting all night. After starting 'er up and putting her into drive, it would only move at about 3-5 MPH even at 3000 RPM as if the transmission was slipping. After a minute or minute and half of doing this, it would suddenly be just fine and roll through the gears seamlessly. Since this summer, I've used it sparingly as it has become more of my summer travel mobile since I have an old Ford Escort to use back and forth to work every day. Still, it has recently displayed the same symptoms on a cold start. A few more facts that seem related to the situation:

1. Every now and then, seemingly when I had the ECT button engaged for a while, I would get a P0770 code (engine solenoid).

2. I recently had a local mechanic trouble shoot the problem. He was able to reproduce the symptoms I described above, but agreed that once warmed up for a few minutes, it was smooth.

3. I had him pull the pan and inspect the magnets and the fluid. He said the fluid was a tad dark, but nothing crazy. There was no noticeable metal in the fluid nor were there any metal shavings or significant debris on the magnets.

4. Interestingly, since he drained and filled the fluid and replaced the filter, the symptom has not recurred. It sat last night in temperatures down to 16 degrees with the high today being only 27 degrees, and it took off fine.

So, it doesn't seem to be the tranny itself. I'm sure at 280,000 many would say that it's probably on its way out, but I don't buy that considering everything that I know now. I'm leaning towards the solenoid, but which one would case that issue? Lock-up or one of the shift solenoids? And why would the symptom go away after being only slightly warm? It seems if it were electrical it would be more intermittent and not as predictable. Could it be the torque converter? But if it is, why doesn't it seem to display any other symptoms?

Just looking for any wisdom and thoughts you might have! You guys are great.

Thanks!

JT

 

[LittleCaesar]

Did your mechanic replace the solenoids while he had the pan off?

 

[Bijan]

This past summer my 4runner started to exhibit some strange symptoms after sitting all night. After starting 'er up and putting her into drive, it would only move at about 3-5 MPH even at 3000 RPM as if the transmission was slipping. After a minute or minute and half of doing this, it would suddenly be just fine and roll through the gears seamlessly. Since this summer, I've used it sparingly as it has become more of my summer travel mobile since I have an old Ford Escort to use back and forth to work every day. Still, it has recently displayed the same symptoms on a cold start. A few more facts that seem related to the situation:

1. Every now and then, seemingly when I had the ECT button engaged for a while, I would get a P0770 code (engine solenoid).

2. I recently had a local mechanic trouble shoot the problem. He was able to reproduce the symptoms I described above, but agreed that once warmed up for a few minutes, it was smooth.

3. I had him pull the pan and inspect the magnets and the fluid. He said the fluid was a tad dark, but nothing crazy. There was no noticeable metal in the fluid nor were there any metal shavings or significant debris on the magnets.

4. Interestingly, since he drained and filled the fluid and replaced the filter, the symptom has not recurred. It sat last night in temperatures down to 16 degrees with the high today being only 27 degrees, and it took off fine.

So, it doesn't seem to be the tranny itself. I'm sure at 280,000 many would say that it's probably on its way out, but I don't buy that considering everything that I know now. I'm leaning towards the solenoid, but which one would case that issue? Lock-up or one of the shift solenoids? And why would the symptom go away after being only slightly warm? It seems if it were electrical it would be more intermittent and not as predictable. Could it be the torque converter? But if it is, why doesn't it seem to display any other symptoms?

Just looking for any wisdom and thoughts you might have! You guys are great.

Thanks!

JT

My shit is doing almost the exact same thing. it has never done this before.

I have to rev it up to 4k rpm to get her to budge. I drive her around the block and she's fine.

However... yesterday I tried to go to the store and she wouldnt move at ALL.
Had to get her towed.

 

[shootmymime]

when its cold the fluid thickens up. transmissions work on fluid flow/ pressure.

i bet your fluid is not viscus enough to flow properly thus causing the trans to feel like its ether slipping or not there.

for those of you hereafter reading this. CHANGE YOUR DANG FLUID.

sorry i got a little carried away. not to mention but when it get really cold, X-case gear oil and diff gear oil turns to molasses. My first winder in idaho here i had to switch everything to synthetic. now i can start it up and drive away when its -10 out.

 

[StreetCreeper]

This past summer my 4runner started to exhibit some strange symptoms after sitting all night. After starting 'er up and putting her into drive, it would only move at about 3-5 MPH even at 3000 RPM as if the transmission was slipping. After a minute or minute and half of doing this, it would suddenly be just fine and roll through the gears seamlessly. Since this summer, I've used it sparingly as it has become more of my summer travel mobile since I have an old Ford Escort to use back and forth to work every day. Still, it has recently displayed the same symptoms on a cold start. A few more facts that seem related to the situation:

1. Every now and then, seemingly when I had the ECT button engaged for a while, I would get a P0770 code (engine solenoid).

2. I recently had a local mechanic trouble shoot the problem. He was able to reproduce the symptoms I described above, but agreed that once warmed up for a few minutes, it was smooth.

3. I had him pull the pan and inspect the magnets and the fluid. He said the fluid was a tad dark, but nothing crazy. There was no noticeable metal in the fluid nor were there any metal shavings or significant debris on the magnets.

4. Interestingly, since he drained and filled the fluid and replaced the filter, the symptom has not recurred. It sat last night in temperatures down to 16 degrees with the high today being only 27 degrees, and it took off fine.

So, it doesn't seem to be the tranny itself. I'm sure at 280,000 many would say that it's probably on its way out, but I don't buy that considering everything that I know now. I'm leaning towards the solenoid, but which one would case that issue? Lock-up or one of the shift solenoids? And why would the symptom go away after being only slightly warm? It seems if it were electrical it would be more intermittent and not as predictable. Could it be the torque converter? But if it is, why doesn't it seem to display any other symptoms?

Just looking for any wisdom and thoughts you might have! You guys are great.

Thanks!

JT

Let me preface this by saying that I'm not a mechanic. So don't take what I say too serious.

Ok so if you rule out the tourqe converter as being the culprit ( seems they make noise and like to leave chunks down in the pan when they go out, but your mechanic said it looked clean ) and decide it is a solenoid related issue — perhaps my experience might be of some benefit.

When I had a problem on my 97, I was getting a code for the lockup solenoid. If I recall correctly, I had no noticeable symptoms at slow speeds or after cold starts. The lockup solenoid mostly affected the TC locking and unlocking constantly at highway speeds.

So I wound up dropping the pan, cleaning the magnets, pan and filter. Then I swapped out both shift solenoids and the lockup solenoid and did a 16qt gentle flush using the transmission to pump out the fluid.

That was about 20-30 thousand miles ago. No problems so far. Streetcreeper knocks on wood...

My advice would be to replace all three solenoids while you are in there and do a full "gentle" flush with a good synthetic like Valvoline Maxlife High Milage ATF. No point in my opinion to go through the trouble of dropping the pan twice and not replacing all three and replacing that old shitty fluid. If one solenoid has failed — the others may or may not be far behind and having old ATF in there isn't helping anything.

 

[4'running'26]

Did your mechanic replace the solenoids while he had the pan off?

No, I just bought a house and wasn't willing to pay the extra $$$ right now.

As far as the fluid goes, I did a drain and fill this past summer. I know that doesn't nearly get all of it replaced, but it was the second time I had done it in the past couple years, this now being the third.

I know there are three solenoids directly accessible when the pan is dropped, but isn't there a fourth as well that isn't as easy to access?
[MENTION=120787]Bijan[/MENTION], sorry to hear this. Let me know what you find out.
[MENTION=14772]shootmymime[/MENTION], I understand what you're saying, but it was doing this in the summer when I was in Eugene, OR when the nighttime low wasn't much below 50 degrees at times. That will still increase the viscosity of the fluid to an extent, but when I say it happens on a "cold" start, it doesn't necessarily mean that it's bone cold outside, just that it hasn't been driven for a while.

Should I be hesitant to do a full flush with 280,000 miles on the rig?