Subwoofer and amp for TRD pro?
- Thread starter T4Duran
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flyinhawaiian01
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Been covered many, many times here actually. There's a ton of writeups on how to do this, just search for bass and you'll find a ton of info.
FWIW, I did the same install several months ago and finally couldn't take it any more! Installed a new head unit and it now sounds correct and clean with no strange anomolies in bass from the stock head unit. I used a LC2i ( lc2i - AudioControl ) and it did its job, just not very well because of the way the stock deck processes bass at different volumes. The LC2i was never able to really balance the bass linearly through the volume range and I ended up with deep bass at low volumes, extremely loud mid bass at mid volumes and zero sub bass at high volumes--exactly what the stock deck is supposed to to so owners don't blow their stock speakers!
AVIC-8100 with stock speakers and 8" 5th order sub makes it completely different and pretty damned loud and clean even at almost max volume! I shoulda just done this from the start and not had the headache and extra wiring + extra equipment now sitting on my shelf of used radio stuff...
FWIW, I did the same install several months ago and finally couldn't take it any more! Installed a new head unit and it now sounds correct and clean with no strange anomolies in bass from the stock head unit. I used a LC2i ( lc2i - AudioControl ) and it did its job, just not very well because of the way the stock deck processes bass at different volumes. The LC2i was never able to really balance the bass linearly through the volume range and I ended up with deep bass at low volumes, extremely loud mid bass at mid volumes and zero sub bass at high volumes--exactly what the stock deck is supposed to to so owners don't blow their stock speakers!
AVIC-8100 with stock speakers and 8" 5th order sub makes it completely different and pretty damned loud and clean even at almost max volume! I shoulda just done this from the start and not had the headache and extra wiring + extra equipment now sitting on my shelf of used radio stuff...
rigtec
New member
Hi T4Duran,
Hope you'll find this helpfull: http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/174196-got-bass.html Rgds!
rigtec
New member
Hi flyinhawaiian01,
Driven by the (high or low) voltage from the HU, the subwoofer system (power amp/dspEQ) should be processing the bass alone; not the head unit. I usually make sure that the bass from the hu is turned all the way down (--l---0----+) into NEG gain; which will provide far more clarity to the stock speaker system (doors and dash). The subwoofer system should increase gain linearly (smooth from minimum to full vol) and no erratic swings at any point within it's full volume range. As you know, some music program has a soft bass mix, and some, an exaggerated bass mix e.g., Raggae, Hip-Hop, Rapp, some R&B... To compensate for this, most use a Remote level control; strategically placed for the driver's convenience. This is so that there's no need for constant readjustment of the power amp(s) sensitivity control!
"Just my 0.0002 cents" Rgds!
flyinhawaiian01
New member
While that may be true with other stock head units, the non-entune stock head unit IS processing the bass BEFORE it gets to the aftermarket amp.
If you use some simple test tools, such as a few audio sweeps as well as straight frequency files, you can immediately tell that the head unit is processing the frequency cutoff as you turn the volume up. I don't have the stock deck in there now so I can't verify my old findings, but the last time I tested it (back in Feb or Mar), I believe the cutoff frequency for the rear channels were at 31hz (IIRC). At higher volumes though, that would move up a few hz (something like 37hz?) as no sound from the test files below that frequency would be sent to the amp from the head unit.
Do some simple testing with the stock deck, you'll find the same results if you just add on an amp and crossover. While I'm no audiophile, I've been an installer since 1984 and even owned a small car audio and alarm shop in Honolulu from '88 to '95. I haven't been in the business for quite some time now, but when I heard the system after installing the amp and LC2i, I knew right off that something was out of whack. I tried and tried to tune it as best as I could, and while it wasn't half bad (which is why I lived with it for the last 6 or so months), certain songs would absolutely annoy me and I'd be constantly screwin' with the bass knob for the LC2i just to balance the system.
Today is a completely different story now! Full sweeps from 10hz to 10khz produces a very lineal volume, bass is now evident as low as 12 or 13hz (although not very loud with one 8" sub, but I can hear the fluttering of the sub!) and no matter what volume I have it at, there is no cutoff low or high. This is still with stock speakers and just one Precision Audio amp, running 2 ohms mono at around 250 watts or so into one 8" Polk open air sub mounted in a 4th order box. I'm now happy with it, but I just wanted to give the OP a head's up on doing the same thing I did not too long ago...
If you use some simple test tools, such as a few audio sweeps as well as straight frequency files, you can immediately tell that the head unit is processing the frequency cutoff as you turn the volume up. I don't have the stock deck in there now so I can't verify my old findings, but the last time I tested it (back in Feb or Mar), I believe the cutoff frequency for the rear channels were at 31hz (IIRC). At higher volumes though, that would move up a few hz (something like 37hz?) as no sound from the test files below that frequency would be sent to the amp from the head unit.
Do some simple testing with the stock deck, you'll find the same results if you just add on an amp and crossover. While I'm no audiophile, I've been an installer since 1984 and even owned a small car audio and alarm shop in Honolulu from '88 to '95. I haven't been in the business for quite some time now, but when I heard the system after installing the amp and LC2i, I knew right off that something was out of whack. I tried and tried to tune it as best as I could, and while it wasn't half bad (which is why I lived with it for the last 6 or so months), certain songs would absolutely annoy me and I'd be constantly screwin' with the bass knob for the LC2i just to balance the system.
Today is a completely different story now! Full sweeps from 10hz to 10khz produces a very lineal volume, bass is now evident as low as 12 or 13hz (although not very loud with one 8" sub, but I can hear the fluttering of the sub!) and no matter what volume I have it at, there is no cutoff low or high. This is still with stock speakers and just one Precision Audio amp, running 2 ohms mono at around 250 watts or so into one 8" Polk open air sub mounted in a 4th order box. I'm now happy with it, but I just wanted to give the OP a head's up on doing the same thing I did not too long ago...
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Do you have pics of the aftermarket radio installed on yours? Do they make a kit to replace the oem radio?
Meyercord
New member
CL441dsp - Car Audio - OEM Interface - OEM Integration - JL Audio
Why not use something like that? It was common for the raptor guys.
Why not use something like that? It was common for the raptor guys.
flyinhawaiian01
New member
Because, as I've said before, the HEAD UNIT is REMOVING frequencies COMPLETELY as you turn the volume up. It isn't REDUCING the frequencies, its killing them altogether! Maybe the Raptor head unit reduces the volume of the bass as the volume is increased, toyota's head units increase the frequency as the volume goes up.
There's no equipment that I know of that will produce a bassline for music if there's no bassline there to begin with! All these pieces of equipment do is AMPLIFY specific frequencies to match a certain volume. If there's nothing there for it to amplify, it simply doesn't do anything. This is exactly what I experienced with the stock non-entune head unit and the LC2i and amp. The LC2i did help a little to level out the bass at higher volumes, but it also exacerbated the lack of bass down below 30-something hertz, making it sound like the amp was actually shutting down when playing a sweep!
Very hard to explain the issue with the stock head unit here, and even recording a video of the problem will no fully explain it, as none of my video recording devices will pick up a subsonic frequency, its just one of those things that ya gotta be there to experience it!
flyinhawaiian01
New member
I'll get a photo of the head unit and post it this evening for ya, but yeah, there's a couple of kits to replace the dash where the stock head unit is. They're cheap enough too, here's the one I have from Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004V78B0O?
Meyercord
New member
Any idea if the entune headunit responds the same way?
flyinhawaiian01
New member
That, I don't know, but seeing that the entune head unit has an option for a sub, I would think its easier to set up a sub to the stock deck.
Having said that, I have no experience with one, hopefully someone who's done this can confirm it.
And, not that it matters for the entune folks, I can also tell you that there are ZERO outputs from the non-entune head unit for a sub! I tested every pin from the deck and found NO remote turn on, and NO sub output whatsoever! There has to be either or both of these outputs from an entune head unit if one can get an optional sub for the rear with that head unit.
Having said that, I have no experience with one, hopefully someone who's done this can confirm it.
And, not that it matters for the entune folks, I can also tell you that there are ZERO outputs from the non-entune head unit for a sub! I tested every pin from the deck and found NO remote turn on, and NO sub output whatsoever! There has to be either or both of these outputs from an entune head unit if one can get an optional sub for the rear with that head unit.
flyinhawaiian01
New member
Pics of the Pioneer AVIC-8100NEX with Scosche dashkit:
I wrapped the inset area in matte black vinyl, as it comes painted completely in metallic silver. It makes the deck look wider than it actually is at first glance!:rockon:
I wrapped the inset area in matte black vinyl, as it comes painted completely in metallic silver. It makes the deck look wider than it actually is at first glance!:rockon:
