Tiny metal specs in oil

[SkyGuy41]

I just finished checking my oil, and I noticed very tiny shiny shavings in the oil. Maybe half a dozen tiny specs on the oil dipstick. They're not all through the oil by any means, but enough that I can spot them and feel them on my fingers. I saw them because I was using a flashlight and was able to get them to "glisten". I changed my oil approx 1500 miles ago with Mobil 1 synthetic 5w30. I replace the oil filter every oil change with Toyota OEM filters. The vehicle just hit 127,000 miles yesterday. Should I be concerned? Or is this normal for a 4Runner engine with this mileage? And if it is a problem, can it be remedied? Thanks.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

You may want to do an oil analysis on the engine, that doesn't sound great...

 

[SkyGuy41]

Here's a few pictures of the dipstick. I may have been overly optimistic with the whole "half dozen" thing... damn.

Best quality I could get in the fog and 20 degrees.

I also have an oil test on order.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

That doesn't look as bad as I thought it would, I'd still spring for an oil analysis from blackstone labs. I just got my first one done and it was very nicely detailed, they'd be able to tell you if they think a bearing is wearing out or something; that way you can decide if you need to tear the engine down further or try and keep going.

 

[SkyGuy41]

Worst case scenario, if I do need to change a bearing or something else in the engine, can I replace my head gaskets while the engine is opened up? Is it kind of the same process to get to both areas? Or are the two fixes separate from each other? Hope that makes sense...

Also, thanks for the input BlackWorks; especially at this hour. Much appreciated.

 

[fullboogie]

First thing I'd want to know is whether the particles are attracted by a magnet. That'll help ID whether you're dealing with bearing material or other stuff.

 

[Sungod]

If those are metal shavings on your dipstick, that is bad news. A good test is to use a clean plastic pan to collect your oil and pass a rare earth magnet in a zip lock bag through the collected oil. If you get anything on the bag, you know things are not good inside your motor. Obviously it won't tell you anything about any non ferrous metals like your heads or block if you have the v6, but connecting rods, crank, etc will show up.

 

[SkyGuy41]

Just drove her around for about ten min to get everything stirred up in there, and I'm not seeing those little specs anymore.... I even tried to feel them in my fingers; no dice. I don't have a rare earth magnet but I'll pick one up and try the magnet test.

But like I said, I'm not seeing what I saw earlier this morning. It is now 45 degrees compared to 20 degrees this morning....not sure if that'd change anything. Hopefully the Blackstone Labratories test I have ordered will help out? Thanks for the input fellas.

 

[KidVermicious]

Worst case scenario, if I do need to change a bearing or something else in the engine, can I replace my head gaskets while the engine is opened up? Is it kind of the same process to get to both areas? Or are the two fixes separate from each other? Hope that makes sense...

Also, thanks for the input BlackWorks; especially at this hour. Much appreciated.

You get to the crank bearings through the oil pan. You can do that work with the engine in the truck, but it ain't easy. Normally to do bearings you'd pull the entire motor, and while it's out it be pretty trivial to do the head gaskets.

Having said that, why do you want to do the head gaskets? 127k is waaaaaaaay to early to be worried about your crank bearings or head gaskets, assuming you've been kind to your motor, and if you haven't and the gaskets and bearings ARE showing signs of failure, you might want to consider a full rebuild, or a new long block.

 

[SkyGuy41]

You get to the crank bearings through the oil pan. You can do that work with the engine in the truck, but it ain't easy. Normally to do bearings you'd pull the entire motor, and while it's out it be pretty trivial to do the head gaskets.

Having said that, why do you want to do the head gaskets? 127k is waaaaaaaay to early to be worried about your crank bearings or head gaskets, assuming you've been kind to your motor, and if you haven't and the gaskets and bearings ARE showing signs of failure, you might want to consider a full rebuild, or a new long block.

I only mention head gaskets because 04 4runners with the V6 tend to have head gasket issues with my mileage. So IF I do have to open up the engine, I might as well switch those out. To save me a possible headache down the road and give some peace of mind.

I am very kind to my motor, but I've only had her for a year. So the previous owner may not have been so forgiving.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Just spend the $28 bucks on an oil analysis for the vehicle in it's current state. They'll let you know if you have excessive metals in the oil, which will be a good indicator of whether or not the engine should be torn down and inspected; or leave it alone until it gets worse type of deal.

I'll be honest, that's a rather small amount of specs compared to what I normally see when a bearing or other part goes bad; also the fact that it settled back into the bottom of the pan and isn't picking up on the dipstick anymore is also probably a good sign. Keep in mind that you will get wear metals no matter what you do, it's just how the engine works; if you pop the pan on an engine that was run 50~100k from brand new with oil changes at the correct times; you'll still find a layer of sludge and particulates in the bottom of the pan, but that's the key, a light amount is normal, heavy is bad.

Blackstone Labs

 

[Bob22222]

Skyguy, new guy here. Signed up to offer that lit looks like ice in the oil rather than metal. Condensation? Head gasket? I'm hoping it's condensation. Good luck.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Skyguy, new guy here. Signed up to offer that lit looks like ice in the oil rather than metal. Condensation? Head gasket? I'm hoping it's condensation. Good luck.

You know what... that's a good point, I hadn't thought of that at all. OP is located in Pennsylvania so it's entirely possible that's just frozen water suspended in the oil. Not something I see often in CA.

 

[SkyGuy41]

Skyguy, new guy here. Signed up to offer that lit looks like ice in the oil rather than metal. Condensation? Head gasket? I'm hoping it's condensation. Good luck.

Hmm that would explain not finding any particulates in the oil today; 20 degrees warmer and clear ( also no dense fog). The only other thing is I could feel small amount of grit between my fingers when I wiped the dipstick with my fingers this morning. But I guess that could have been condensation that froze because the feeling of "grit" went away after a second or two.


Bob thank you for your insight. I'll continue to keep an eye on it until my oil test kit arrives and I can post the results.

EDIT: just checked it again 0048 hrs, more specs and a few thin shavings. Crap.

 

[SkyGuy41]

Well here's my oil report from Blackstone Labs... Kind of surprising that no metal showed up in the report. Because when I changed my oil, I found all sorts of metal shavings and tiny pieces at the bottom of my oil tub (bought a brand new one to be sure all metal was from THIS oil change). But, as you can see I have antifreeze in the oil... I take it this means my head gaskets are shot? Or worse? Either way, things don't look good for my rig. What do y'all recommend my next course of action should be? :help:

EDIT: I noticed my magnesium is extremely high, but not explicitly mentioned in the report. That can't be good right?

 

[fdbyrne]

If you want further confirmation of a head gasket problem you might have a shop do a leak down test. That should tell you what you need to know.

 

[balong48]

Well here's my oil report from Blackstone Labs... Kind of surprising that no metal showed up in the report. Because when I changed my oil, I found all sorts of metal shavings and tiny pieces at the bottom of my oil tub (bought a brand new one to be sure all metal was from THIS oil change). But, as you can see I have antifreeze in the oil... I take it this means my head gaskets are shot? Or worse? Either way, things don't look good for my rig. What do y'all recommend my next course of action should be? :help:

EDIT: I noticed my magnesium is extremely high, but not explicitly mentioned in the report. That can't be good right?

Reviving this old thread due to finding very similar looking shavings in my 5th gen. Blackstone didn’t detect anything either, but noted they can’t detect visible particles, only microscopic particles.

If you’re still active in this forum, what’d the outcome end up being?

I changed at 127k and noticed some sparkles but thought it may have just been sand, as I had just done the mower a few days earlier. I just did my 137k change and noticed it again - so it definitely isn’t sand. Drain pan was wiped clean prior as well. Ignore the bigger debris, as that did not come out of the engine. More concerned about the fine stuff sprinkled throughout and pooled up around the drain. I’ll have to check the dipstick as well when I get a few more miles. Will go to 5th gen forum is no response received here.