Tow Capacity Misleading/ Camper RV

[Ryanincc]

Did you know you really can't tow 5000 lbs with a V6 3rd gen? The published tow capacities of vehicles are not entirely accurate and mislead people often into dangerous situations. Most people see the published tow capacities and assume thats how heavy a trailer can be for you to tow. There is a national standard but most companies have not adopted it yet. You need to know a couple of numbers when looking at vehicles that are not large trucks when towing a small RV/camper. The first number is the GVWR, Gross Vehicle Weight Rating of the camper, which is the fully loaded weight. In reality you're usually within 10% of this number. The published, dealer spewing "dry weights" are fiction. Dry weight is the camper weight as it leaves the factory floor, before the dealer adds non-standard items like appliances, awnings, propane tanks etc. The second number you want to find is the GCWR, sometimes GCVWR, Gross Combined (Vehicle) Weight Rating, of your vehicle which is the sum of the vehicle weight (curb weight) plus it's load (people, gear, hitch, vehicle trim) and the loaded trailer weight. This weight must not be exceeded (pg. 154 in the manual). When you have that number, you subtract the curb weight, and that gives you the maximum weight you can haul and/or tow.

For example, My 1997 4runner V6 RWD with a published tow capacity of 5000 lbs. has a curb weight of (approx) 3900 lbs, and a GCWR of 8800 lbs, found in my manual. Subtract those and we have 4900 lbs left over that I can haul/tow. On a camping weekend, my family of 4 and all our gear inside, and on the 4runner easily add up to 900 lbs. I have a brush guard and hitch weighing 200 lbs combined. Add those up, equals 1100 lbs, and subtract from from my tow/haul capacity. Now Im left with 3800 lbs actual that I can tow. Thats a 25% reduction in towing ability.

In my case, with most pop ups I'm within limits. Not that big a deal except for the heaviest of pups. But for the minivans and other small SUV's with a 3500lbs published tow capacity, you can see how every pound counts in calculation as there is a big difference in a 1500 lb and a 3500lb popup respectively. The same applies to our V6 T4Rs, as a 5000 lbs travel trailer is very different than a pop up, and it is not realistic to assume the vehicle is empty when towing..

Ive only been alerted to one database with GCWR, and its for 2006-2011 vehicles, here:

HowStuffWorks "GCWR List"

Hopefully, this info will save someone from buying a camper they can't pull or a vehicle that won't tow as described.

 

[jgue467]

Then there's the Reality Check!

Yeah that applies to ALL vehicles no matter what brand, type or style. But what Really matters to me is how does it Feel when towing? Does it feel adequate to accelerate? Uphill too?

We always have to consider if we'll be towing on level ground, that's how they get away with 5K lbs, I will be my house the standard 3.4 cannot tow whatever weight is left after the calcs up and down the sierra madre, west texas mountains or the rockies without blowing something in the driveline up. You need a Real towing machine for that. The 3.4 engine is just a very helpful, pretty little riding mower tow'r or 2 full size atv tow'r at best. Just a small tow'r but i like it! Luck! : banana:

 

[NHRunner]

But what Really matters to me is how does it Feel when towing?

I wish more people understood this, because the feeling of being in control is the most important factor of towing/hauling.

But you also have to remember that bigger engines don't prevent loss of control or accidents. Too many people get hung up on the "power" factor when towing. Since safety always comes first, adequate brakes, a decent wheelbase, a substantial suspension, and an attentive driver are a lot more important than good acceleration.

 

[02SE]

For example, My 1997 4runner V6 RWD with a published tow capacity of 5000 lbs. has a curb weight of (approx) 3900 lbs

Just an FYI, the curb weight of a stock 1997 V6 2wd 4Runner is 3565 lbs.

Payload for your particular 4Runner is 1685 lbs.


FWIW, my Sister has towed a boat for 13 years now with her stock '01, that is right at the 5000 lb towing limit. All of the weights are within Toyota's stated capacities. There have never been any issues. The only way to know exactly how much weight you are dealing with, is to head to the scales to weigh your combination.

 

[KatRider05]

I have only towed small flatbed trailers with my T4R but I am looking to get a hybrid trailer. In my research I have found this site to help my understanding.

Before You Buy... RV|Truck|Tow Vehicle

It has some really good info.

 

[Nunyabiz]

This is the main reason my wife and I pretty much decided that our best bet was to turn the table and tow the 4Runner with a Motor Home instead of tow a trailer with the 4runner.
Most of the Motor Homes we were looking at are 400-500HP with 1000-1250 ft/lb of torque, so towing the 4Runner is like towing a nat.

The only trailer that we found that was worth a damn in our opinion for towing with a 4Runner was the Camplite 16TBS.
It would be pushing the 4Runner to the max though.

Camplite 16tbs Automotive Travel Trailer Overview | Livin' Lite RV

 

[eplanajr]

We tow a small pop up and I hardly notice it's even there...
I have airbags in the rear.

 

[KatRider05]

I have seen many different brands of hybrid campers, the travel trailers with he pop out beds, that fall well below the towing cap of the runners. Rockwood Roos, Starcraft, jay co, just to name a few. All-in-all you just need to research.

The other day I saw a new highlander towing a Starcraft hybrid travel trailer. The back was sagging a bit but that's what you get for towing with a unibody vehicle and without a WD hitch.

 

[Jowenbrown]

I wonder where the notion of being able to tow anything under the sun came from.

*Insert image of tundra towing the space shuttle here*

 

[mountainbiker42]

I tow around about 3500-4000 lbs each saturday. It's a double axle trailer with mowing equipment. The 4runner pulls quite nicely, it's certainly not a V8 however. I always turn on the tow/haul button and turn off OD, the torque converter will lock in at about 42 mph and it take a lot of gas pedal to get it to unlock which is great because it prevents your transmission from heating up. I have OME 906 springs in the rear with Bilstein 4600's. I am very pleased with the way it tows considering it's only a 3.4 V6. I have a B&M cooler as well which I would recommend for anyone who tows frequently. Towing around town nice and easy and on country roads (with the torque converter locked in) I'll see an average of about 160-170 degree trany temps on 80-90 degree summer days. The key is to get the TC locked in, and keep it that way. I know there's a lot of talk about towing and transmission temps on this forum, hopefully this information can be of help to some guys.

 

[Ryanincc]

Just an FYI, the curb weight of a stock 1997 V6 2wd 4Runner is 3565 lbs.

Ive seen a lot of posted Curb Weights and this one is the lowest. Perhaps that makes it the right one :shrug:.

 

[Ryanincc]

I have seen many different brands of hybrid campers, the travel trailers with he pop out beds, that fall well below the towing cap of the runners. Rockwood Roos, Starcraft, jay co, just to name a few. All-in-all you just need to research.

The other day I saw a new highlander towing a Starcraft hybrid travel trailer. The back was sagging a bit but that's what you get for towing with a unibody vehicle and without a WD hitch.

Mine use to sag with almost no weight on the hitch, and then I got to reading around here... beyond the normal sag complaints. I found the recall notice here and I called and got mine done. They put something on the inside of the coils and the sag is gone. I have zero sag at 300 lbs tongue weight right now. I posted some pics of it somewhere around here.
Having said that. With mine full of camping gear and people, I wouldn't tow more than 3500 lbs with mine, currently tow 3200. Just judging by the way it acts now when towing. But its possible Ive had something wrong with it for a while because mines in the shop right now. They've had it a week and still don't know whats wrong with it. Its lost MPGs steadily since Ive been towing over the last 6 months. 9 mpg city when i handed the keys over and zero acceleration. Had to lose two camping trips because of it too, last weekend and this one.

 

[Ryanincc]

I wish more people understood this, because the feeling of being in control is the most important factor of towing/hauling.

But you also have to remember that bigger engines don't prevent loss of control or accidents. Too many people get hung up on the "power" factor when towing. Since safety always comes first, adequate brakes, a decent wheelbase, a substantial suspension, and an attentive driver are a lot more important than good acceleration.

I was one of those, stuck on the power factor. With my Prodigy 2 brake controller set on boost 2, driving in traffic in San Antonio. It was only dumb luck that I didn't rear end a stopped vehicle while I was doing 40 on the freeway. Since then, I tow much differently. I have stock brakes and wouldn't tow more than 3500 lbs. Even with better brakes I don't think I would tow more. Mine has always been really sluggish when towing anything significant but I wonder if its just mine which is in the shop now for no acceleration and bad MPG,, or its everyones 3.4.

 

[jgue467]

They're all that way

... Mine has always been really sluggish when towing anything significant but I wonder if its just mine which is in the shop now for no acceleration and bad MPG,, or its everyones 3.4.

Some think the 3.4 (normally aspirated) is sluggish even while not towing! But yes - 183HP and 217lbs of torque can only do so much and can feel quite sluggish going on most any incline. I have to use the A/C around central texas 9-10 months of the year but do love when i can turn it off. Ever driven the 4.0v6? That is what the 3rd gen should have come with, what a difference! I've also driven the 4.7v8 w/vvti in a 1st gen sequoia, wow! Still not a 10K tower but lots of torque compared to our little ol' 3.4s... :banana:

 

[ben550]

I towed a 5000lb trailer from Columbus GA, up to Syracuse, NY in my 2001 3.4L V6.

It made it up just fine. Only issue was I couldn't use cruise control due to excessive downshifting on inclines. Oh well. I took it slow and enjoyed the scenery.

 

[BlackCat914]

why would anyone want to tow 5,000lbs with a 4runner!? My truck can't get out of it's own way pulling my 4-wheeler and trailer @ roughly 1,000lbs combined, haha.

 

[02SE]

Ive seen a lot of posted Curb Weights and this one is the lowest. Perhaps that makes it the right one :shrug:.

That's directly from Toyota's specs. Being a 2wd, you don't have the front diff, CV-axles, front driveshaft, transfer case, etc.

 

[Ryanincc]

Some think the 3.4 (normally aspirated) is sluggish even while not towing! But yes - 183HP and 217lbs of torque can only do so much and can feel quite sluggish going on most any incline. I have to use the A/C around central texas 9-10 months of the year but do love when i can turn it off. Ever driven the 4.0v6? That is what the 3rd gen should have come with, what a difference! I've also driven the 4.7v8 w/vvti in a 1st gen sequoia, wow! Still not a 10K tower but lots of torque compared to our little ol' 3.4s... :banana:

I never thought of mine as sluggish without towing before until the last month where Ive had no acceleration. It has been in the shop for over a week and still cause unknown. Thats even comparing it to my wife's zippy Escape. But after reading about some guys towing 5K lbs and no troubles, Im thinking Ive had something wrong with mine for a long time and just didn't know it. Ever since I started towing my pop up, my mpgs have steadily dropped from 15-16 city to 9, not towing, and it accelerates like I'm in 3rd gear. 150 miles on a tank before the light comes on. Clearly something wrong, but since I didn't notice the power loss, until recently when it suddenly dropped off, and my mpgs have been dropping for 6 months, I could have been missing out on all kinds of power that should have been there. Its hard to remember but I think when I got it in 2006, it would bark the stock tires from a stop. For the last couple of years, that seems laughable as I would need to be on dirt to have any traction loss due to acceleration.
Ive never driven a 4.0 or knew it existed until now. Which vehicles had it the late 90's early 2000's? My only guess would be the Tacoma. My sister had Sequoia, an '04 i think and I thoroughly enjoyed driving hers. In hindsight I wish I had bought one instead of T4R, but it has served me well and I had no idea at the time that I would be towing a popup and have a family of 4 today.

 

[ben550]

why would anyone want to tow 5,000lbs with a 4runner!? My truck can't get out of it's own way pulling my 4-wheeler and trailer @ roughly 1,000lbs combined, haha.

because i was moving. i wouldnt want to do that again. my top speed was 60mph. 45-50 going up hills.

 

[Ryanincc]

why would anyone want to tow 5,000lbs with a 4runner!? My truck can't get out of it's own way pulling my 4-wheeler and trailer @ roughly 1,000lbs combined, haha.

This is my experience as well. But Ive only been towing for 6 months and have had power loss during that time. I HOPE, if they ever get it fixed or even figure out whats wrong with it, that it proves to be a much more capable towing 3200 lbs. I wish I had another 3rd gen to compare to because the 3rd gen members here post some widely varying critiques when towing.