Transmission oil cooler placement recommendation from my mechanic

[dwmckeehen]

Hey,

A couple weeks ago, my coolant pump blew, and it went into the shop. They replaced the water pump, timing belt, tensioner and seals. I have been wanting to do the transmission fluid bypass upgrade for some time myself, but since I had the money and they were working on the front end anyway, I asked the shop to go ahead and install a transmission oil cooler to avoid becoming the proud owner of a pink milkshake machine.

I have an ARB bull bar on the front, and next week am getting a winch installed.

When I came to pick up my rig, I was a bit amazed to find the mechanic had installed the cooler between the radiator and the condenser instead of in front of the condenser. He accomplished this by moving the radiator just a shade backwards.

When I asked him why he did that, he said that with the bull bar in front and a winch going in, it makes sense to protect the transmission oil cooler from getting damaged due to being exposed if they put it in front of the condenser. This makes a lot of sense, if I am out in the field and do something that causes damage, I would much prefer it to be damage that stops my air conditioner rather than my transmission.

I am looking for opinions from more experienced mechanically minded people out there. Will my transmission oil cool enough with the cooler installed between the radiator and condenser?

 

[gamefreakgc]

In my opinion (and that's all this is), yes. If I remember correctly our fans are "puller" fans not "pusher" fans so it'll suck in air through the whole nine yards.

Remember, the stock transmission cooler "cooled" by coming in contact with a shared barrier next to hot radiator fluid (does not flow through the fins). Unless you're driving in like 150* heat it's going to be way cooler than stock since you're actually passing the fluid through a cooler.

I'm not worried about damage to mine since I used high pressure fuel lines and the build of my cooler is solid.

 

[nissanh]

During the summer you may not get your trans cooled if you use the AC. The condenser will pass its heat to the trans cooler and as a result, cooling efficiency will suffer.

 

[jgue467]

Check the tranny temps to find out how well it cools. s/b ok in WA under 'normal' conditions (not towing while going uphill). Personally I don't buy the 'better protection' concept of putting it between the two - its not the way the cooler manufacturer says to install it. Why don't people ask ahead of time?

When i had mine done, i told them where to place it and what to do with the old tranny cooler connections (run a hose between them in case the engine coolant leaks into the old tranny cooler). Might try a magnefine addition too.

Luck. :cowboy:

 

[IsaiahC]

I have mine behind the stock grill in front of the condenser and radiator. The only time I could see it being a problem is if there was a front end collision or if I was driving through a field of bamboo (second one won't ever happen). Not to mention my cooler is pretty robust. If anything, your bullbar will protect yours even more. So, you're giving up 25% of your cooling for a slight amount of situational protection.

 

[dwmckeehen]

Check the tranny temps to find out how well it cools. s/b ok in WA under 'normal' conditions (not towing while going uphill). Personally I don't buy the 'better protection' concept of putting it between the two - its not the way the cooler manufacturer says to install it. Why don't people ask ahead of time?

When i had mine done, i told them where to place it and what to do with the old tranny cooler connections (run a hose between them in case the engine coolant leaks into the old tranny cooler). Might try a magnefine addition too.

Luck. :cowboy:

I did learn a lesson here. There is a lot of good advice on these forums about mods. This mod made a lot of sense to me, that is why I wanted to get it done. It never occurred to me that a mechanic would start over thinking things and do something like this . He is an awesome mechanic, that is why I use him. In the future, if I decide to have a mechanic do a mod, I will be very detailed and specific about what I want and need.

 

[dwmckeehen]

Thanks everyone. I am a little less concerned about needing to switch things around right away, but I think , based on comments here that I will probably switch things around before our next trip into the SW Canyonlands area.

 

[alumarine]

You could always contact the manufacturer of the trans cooler and see what they say.
I bet they would know...

 

[gamefreakgc]

Thanks everyone. I am a little less concerned about needing to switch things around right away, but I think , based on comments here that I will probably switch things around before our next trip into the SW Canyonlands area.

I really don't think it's necessary. Even if you were blasting the A/C, the residual heat transfer from the condenser to the transmission oil cooler is still way less than it would be on the stock oil cooler. If you've ever gone wheeling on a hot summer day, your coolant would have seen temps consistently at 200 degrees or higher, that radiator is still stinkin' hot, meaning your transmission fluid could see temperatures of about 200 degrees.

Now, let's say it's a hot day wheeling with your new oil cooler installed, maybe 100* and you've got the A/C going. The condensor lets off heat, so let's say the air passing through the condenser is heated up to 140*. That's still 60 degrees cooler than stock, and that's a worst case scenario. Best case is that you're moving and it's seeing air temps of 110-120*.

I really think you are fine. It's not at maximum cooling capacity but by no means is it ineffective.

 

[greenbomer]

If I may ask a question here

What kind of tran's temp's are you guy's running with the external cooler's?

 

[gamefreakgc]

Only those blessed with newer 4Runners can read theirs (99-02 or 00-02, I can't remember). I put it on mine because the previous owner burnt his transmission into oblivion with the supercharger. Was in process in burning his second transmission when I bought it and had to immediately change the tranny fluid to keep it from getting worse.

I don't know the temps, I just know it was too hot to start with as evidenced by the fluid.

 

[A.Wilson013]

What kind of tran's temp's are you guy's running with the external cooler's?

It has been pretty cold around here lately and my temps have been sitting at around 110 degrees. When it's REAL cold and raining it'll stay closer to 100.

On an average PNW day (60 degrees or so) it'll hang out around 135.

On a HOT PNW day (80-100 degrees or so) it'll sit around 170-180.

If I am really pushing the the engine on a long, steep incline it will occasionally climb to 210-220, but will RAPIDLY cool off if I turn the OD off.

The highest temp I have ever seen was 240 when pulling an f350 through loose sand in the summer. The trans light STILL did not come on. Curious at what point that occurs.

Keep in mind that my 4Runner is very heavy, with larger than stock tires, and a supercharger. My cooler is the rather small B&M 70268

 

[St Runner]

I would find a way to measure the temps, you have a 2000 so it is not hard. If you don't know exactly what the temperature is you are just guessing. Personally I think it will be fine most of the time, but if it is really hot and you are using it hard those transmissions put out a lot of heat. Knowing what the temps are allows you to back off until it cools down so you don't burn up your transmission and fluid

 

[SpidermanGeek]

I have mine behind the stock grill in front of the condenser and radiator. The only time I could see it being a problem is if there was a front end collision or if I was driving through a field of bamboo (second one won't ever happen). Not to mention my cooler is pretty robust. If anything, your bullbar will protect yours even more. So, you're giving up 25% of your cooling for a slight amount of situational protection.

That was my thought. I don't think the AC condenser itself really offers any added protection to the trans oil cooler, especially against any object that can pierce, like a large branch. The condenser isn't a Kevlar vest.

 

[SpidermanGeek]

What kind of tran's temp's are you guy's running with the external cooler's?

I average about 150 in normal city driving conditions. The highest I've ever seen my gauge hit was just under 170.

I haven't towed or wheeled since installing my gauge though.

I'm running duel senders, one pre-cooler and one post-cooler. The post-cooler reading is generally 10-15 degrees less than pre.

 

[Bstrom]

I really don't think it's necessary. Even if you were blasting the A/C, the residual heat transfer from the condenser to the transmission oil cooler is still way less than it would be on the stock oil cooler. If you've ever gone wheeling on a hot summer day, your coolant would have seen temps consistently at 200 degrees or higher, that radiator is still stinkin' hot, meaning your transmission fluid could see temperatures of about 200 degrees.
.

This is the very reason NOT to put that oil cooler behind another heat source. The tranny is the least tolerant of heating sources - AC, coolant and oil are well covered with their larger cooling areas. The tranny needs all the cooling it can under load in an esentially static situation.

I called B&M about this and they specifically said to keep the tranny cooler out front. It's not that big...

Look at how larger the rads are on construction equipment - same deal.

 

[Mgyver1]

Also the B&M and TruCool design appear a lot sturdier than the condensor

 

[gamefreakgc]

This is the very reason NOT to put that oil cooler behind another heat source. The tranny is the least tolerant of heating sources - AC, coolant and oil are well covered with their larger cooling areas. The tranny needs all the cooling it can under load in an esentially static situation.

I called B&M about this and they specifically said to keep the tranny cooler out front. It's not that big...

Look at how larger the rads are on construction equipment - same deal.

My TruCool cooler had this handy little chart showing how much it would cool if placed behind one or two other coolers (A/C, Radiator, etc.). It still kept the majority of its cooling efficiency but was reduced so wasn't 100% effective. I don't have the paper anymore so it didn't have the specifics. Still much, much better than stock though!

 

[dwmckeehen]

I really don't think it's necessary. Even if you were blasting the A/C, the residual heat transfer from the condenser to the transmission oil cooler is still way less than it would be on the stock oil cooler. If you've ever gone wheeling on a hot summer day, your coolant would have seen temps consistently at 200 degrees or higher, that radiator is still stinkin' hot, meaning your transmission fluid could see temperatures of about 200 degrees.

Now, let's say it's a hot day wheeling with your new oil cooler installed, maybe 100* and you've got the A/C going. The condensor lets off heat, so let's say the air passing through the condenser is heated up to 140*. That's still 60 degrees cooler than stock, and that's a worst case scenario. Best case is that you're moving and it's seeing air temps of 110-120*.

I really think you are fine. It's not at maximum cooling capacity but by no means is it ineffective.

Thank you. This totally makes sense.

 

[Drcoffee]

So, I'm not known for my tactful opinions, but that is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. He moved the radiator from a solid mount to some extended mount. Hello! Ever hear about vibration. Its good you disconnected the trans cooler line because that would certainly cause the in rad cooler to stress and break. Never mind the obvious. If you used a B&M cooler, you cannot damage these beasts. If you used a tube and fin cooler, shame on you.

But for the bggest reason not to put it there is, it cant be cooled there. I dont care how much air your fan sucks, hot air is hot going to cool your trans fluid. Run your AC and then put your hand on the condeser.

One more reason. If the zip ties he used to install it wear through the radiator cooling tubes, you will be stranded.

If it was me, and its not. I would move it to the front of the condenser.

Honestly, he put it between the condenser and radiator?

I can only shake my head in amazement.