Ultimate Suspension For On Road Handling?

[1985taylor1925]

Good stuff. However, the Land Cruiser is the big brother to the 4runner The Sequoia is like the gay, creepy uncle that always wants to watch your dance recitals growing up.

Sell your 4runner, you'll be back in a few months anyway, I guarantee it. The recidivism rate on this forum is ridiculous, and I'm guilty as well. Picking up a fun, sporty, economical DD will renew your zeal for the 4runner. Every man should have a ecobox DD and a truck playtoy. It's the secret to happiness.

Haha. Yeah, I could see myself being that creepy uncle. Except not the gay part. I do need to find a girl friend though!

Yeah, I keep on thinking that - would I regret selling the 3rd gen and then want it back. But here's my logic. I would love to build my third gen, but the list of things to do is ENORMOUS and would cost a stupid amount of money. The Sequoia basically has everything I want, and they get incredible reviews. I actually like the fact that its bigger than the 3rd gen because I always want more room when I pack up all my stuff for excursions/camping/kayaking/mountain biking trips. I love the leather interior, 273 hp/ 315 ft/lbs v8, creature comforts, rear sliding window just like our 3rd gens, rear spoiler, and honestly, sequoias look pretty awesome when you throw on a bigger tire and 2" lift.

So the thing about the sequoia is the gas mileage sucks, it has the same suspension as the 4runner just spaced wider, and its huge. the 100 series is big too, but not quite as big, it has basically the best oem ifs suspension you can get and an excellent 4 link rear end. The ride is excellent and they are typically lifted about 2" if needed.

Also if you are just dding, get a body lift.

btw the secret to happiness is solid axles.

Actually, as Ed mentioned below the Sequoia shares suspension with the Tundra. As the 3rd gen 4runner is basically the same vehicle as the early Tacoma, so the 1st gen Sequoia and Tundra are basically the same. The Tundra has rear leafs while the Sequoia has coils. But you do basically all the same lifts on the Sequoia as Tundra. Sequoia has 4 link rear suspension as well. Im not concerned with gas mileage as I am planning on doing what Absolom does, use a car for daily commuting driving. Then save the sequoia for weekend trips.

As far as the 100 series, very little difference in size with the 1st gen Sequoia. I know theyre really nice vehicles but Im not crazy about the 100 series style. I love the 80 series though. But the 100 LC of the same years im looking at (05 and 06) are way more expensive than the Sequoia.

If you mean same as in parts interchangeability/compatibility, it shares the some front suspension as Tundras,not 4Runners.

This. Same suspension other than rear leafs on the Tundra, coils and panhard on Sequoia. 05 and later Sequoias got an adjustable air suspension, which is cool until it breaks!

 

[fourfive]

Yeah, I keep on thinking that - would I regret selling the 3rd gen and then want it back. But here's my logic. I would love to build my third gen, but the list of things to do is ENORMOUS and would cost a stupid amount of money...

Nah man don't sell it. Just put the money you would have used to buy the sequoia into your 4runner.

 

[fourfive]

I have run several suspension lifts on my 3rd gen as I initially spent a ton of time off road while doing forestry work, and I also did a lot of towing and hauling. Things have changed, and now I do primarily commuting. The suspension set-ups I've run include . . .

Rear
- Stock shocks and coils (for 98)
- KYB Gas adjust shocks with OEM coils
- KYB gas adjust shocks with Performance Products coils
- LC Tokico shocks with LC 7 wraps
- LC Tokico's with OME 890 coils
- LC Tokico's wth 99 coils and 1.5 spacer (my current set-up)

Front
- Stock shocks and coils
- KYB gas shocks with stock coils
- KYB gas shocks with PP coils
- Tundra/Bilstein NON-progressive set up from a full cab 4x4 model.
- Taco Bilstein 5100s with 99 coils on second perch (current set-up)

The few suspension set ups I have personally had some experience with are:

Front: tundra/bilstein with the TRD progressive coil on the 1st perch; Rear: bilstein with OME 906

Front: toytec/bilstein coilovers with eibach springs (I like the 600# with a stock front end but if you wanted something softer, the 550# might be a good option); Rear bilstein with OME 906

Front: toytec/boss coilovers with eibach springs (550# or 600#); Rear bilstein with OME 890s

All the above set ups seemed to give a factory like ride. Maybe a little stiffer but I would compare the stiffness to how a brand new stock 3rd gen suspension would feel. As far as the coilover options, at 1-2 inches of lift, it feels very close to a factory set up. It wasn't until I turned it up to 3 inches that it felt a little stiffer. I noticed that you ran the 890s with the LC tokicos at one point...that may have been the issue for the stiffer ride in the rear. I've noticed when running a stiffer spring like the 890s or 906 with a softer shock (bilstein or toytec boss) it has a very close to factory like ride. If you were just looking for a 1.5-2inch lift that has a softer ride, either the tundra/bilsteins with TRD coils or the toytec/bilstein or boss coilovers with the 550# springs up front & the bilstein or boss shocks out back with the OME 906 would probably be your best option...outside of going back to a completely stock set up. The tundra/bilstein/TRDs set on the 1st perch feel very similar to the toytec coilovers set at 2 inches of lift.

 

[D Farms]

have you actually looked at the front suspensions? its nearly identical, the same length control arms and everything, to the 3rd gen 4runner, which btw uses the suspension from the landcruiser prado aka 90 series.

anyways...

 

[1985taylor1925]

The few suspension set ups I have personally had some experience with are:

Front: tundra/bilstein with the TRD progressive coil on the 1st perch; Rear: bilstein with OME 906

Front: toytec/bilstein coilovers with eibach springs (I like the 600# with a stock front end but if you wanted something softer, the 550# might be a good option); Rear bilstein with OME 906

Front: toytec/boss coilovers with eibach springs (550# or 600#); Rear bilstein with OME 890s

All the above set ups seemed to give a factory like ride. Maybe a little stiffer but I would compare the stiffness to how a brand new stock 3rd gen suspension would feel. As far as the coilover options, at 1-2 inches of lift, it feels very close to a factory set up. It wasn't until I turned it up to 3 inches that it felt a little stiffer. I noticed that you ran the 890s with the LC tokicos at one point...that may have been the issue for the stiffer ride in the rear. I've noticed when running a stiffer spring like the 890s or 906 with a softer shock (bilstein or toytec boss) it has a very close to factory like ride. If you were just looking for a 1.5-2inch lift that has a softer ride, either the tundra/bilsteins with TRD coils or the toytec/bilstein or boss coilovers with the 550# springs up front & the bilstein or boss shocks out back with the OME 906 would probably be your best option...outside of going back to a completely stock set up. The tundra/bilstein/TRDs set on the 1st perch feel very similar to the toytec coilovers set at 2 inches of lift.

Yeah, I ran a Tundra setup for over a year. But it wasnt the progressive TRD suspension. Mine was from a 4x4 four door non-TRD Tundra, and the coils were yellow/red blue/red. And the bilsteins were a standard model,not the 5100s. They were way too stiff. The TRD progressive coils might be smoother. I would still be interested in that setup if it is close to a factory ride.

How much does the Tundra/5100 setup lift the front on the very lowest setting? Im guessing no more than an inch.

Im running the Taco 5100s right now on middle perch with stock 99 coils, and was sure that it would be plenty soft. Turned out to be basically the same as my last setup.

 

[D Farms]

on the first perch the yyyb coils are super smooth, the most comfortable of any of the setups ive tried on my truck.

 

[1985taylor1925]

have you actually looked at the front suspensions? its nearly identical, the same length control arms and everything, to the 3rd gen 4runner, which btw uses the suspension from the landcruiser prado aka 90 series.

anyways...

Yeah I know they are all similar as they are all Toyota front end truck designs. But the 1st gen Tundra and Sequoia is the same platform and suspension. Both bigger than the 4runner.


On another note, I have a few questions for anyone who can answer . . .

- What is the difference between the 3rd gen 4runner and early Taco front suspension? Is it just the top plate?

- What is the difference between the 2nd and 3rd gen 4runner rear coil? Because I just read a guy who said he had rear coils from an 89 on his 2002 4runner. That would open up new options as there are several companies who make variable rate rear coils for the 2nd gen 4runner.

 

[fourfive]

How much does the Tundra/5100 setup lift the front on the very lowest setting? Im guessing no more than an inch.

The tundra/bilstein 5100/TRD coil on the first perch gave my friends 4runner 1.5-1.75 inches in the front and & in the rear with the bilstein 5100/OME 906 right at 2 inches & it felt very close to the factory set up.

 

[1985taylor1925]

Bump for two of my questions -

- Is the only difference between 3rd 4runner and 1st gen tacoma front suspension the top plate? And with that in mind, has anyone here run Taco front coils? Im running Taco 5100s, so seems like it would be easy to throw on Taco coils.

- Has anyone ran 2nd gen rear coils on a 3rd gen? I ask because there are progressive rear coils available for the 2nd gen

 

[Ed_C]

Bump for two of my questions -

- Is the only difference between 3rd 4runner and 1st gen tacoma front suspension the top plate? And with that in mind, has anyone here run Taco front coils? Im running Taco 5100s, so seems like it would be easy to throw on Taco coils.

The OP in this thread http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/156772-progressive-springs-softer-ride.html#post1555350 says he used OEM Taco front strut/spring assemblies on his and the ride was improved.

 

[1985taylor1925]

The OP in this thread http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/156772-progressive-springs-softer-ride.html#post1555350 says he used OEM Taco front strut/spring assemblies on his and the ride was improved.

Thanks for the link! I wondered if there was a progressive coil for the taco. That's the only thread I've ever seen where someone was running a taco coil on a 3rd gen. I'm running taco 5100s right now, so a progressive taco coil should be a perfect match. Time to pm Nissanh

 

[ThorInc]

Addco anti-sway bars and Poly bushings? :canada:

 

[Ed_C]

Thanks for the link! I wondered if there was a progressive coil for the taco. That's the only thread I've ever seen where someone was running a taco coil on a 3rd gen. I'm running taco 5100s right now, so a progressive taco coil should be a perfect match. Time to pm Nissanh

I'm beginning to wonder if they're really progressive rate. His description of the spring shapes does not necessarily mean it's a progressive rate design.

I quickly browsed through Moog's part lookup site ( Federal-Mogul Resource Center - Vehicle Look-up ) for same-year 4Runner and Tacoma (I used 2002 for the year) and all the springs are constant rate. The Tacomas are softer, 456 lbs/inch vs 595 lbs/inch, and are a little longer, .36 to .69 inch depending on the cab style and transmission. I think it's the lower spring rate that improved the ride.

By the way,are the Taco 5100s a different part # than the 4Runner? I recall browsing Rancho's site and the Taco and 4Runner front RS9000s are the same.

 

[1985taylor1925]

I'm beginning to wonder if they're really progressive rate. His description of the spring shapes does not necessarily mean it's a progressive rate design.

I quickly browsed through Moog's part lookup site ( Federal-Mogul Resource Center - Vehicle Look-up ) for same-year 4Runner and Tacoma (I used 2002 for the year) and all the springs are constant rate. The Tacomas are softer, 456 lbs/inch vs 595 lbs/inch, and are a little longer, .36 to .69 inch depending on the cab style and transmission. I think it's the lower spring rate that improved the ride.

By the way,are the Taco 5100s a different part # than the 4Runner? I recall browsing Rancho's site and the Taco and 4Runner front RS9000s are the same.

I think the Toyota coils actually are progressive though. At least they were on some of the models with the TRD off road package. I did some searching on tacoma forums and thats what I found.

As far as the 5100s, yes they are different. There is a Tundra 5100 and Tacoma 5100, both of which will work on the 3rd gen. The Tundra model has 5 settings while the Taco has 3. Beyond that I dont know if they are any different in terms of rebound compression, etc. I went with the Taco 5100s because I assumed naturally they would be a bit softer than the Tundra 5100s, and better suited for my 99 coils

 

[1985taylor1925]

These are on ebay right now, from a 2000 Tacoma. You can clearly see the top section has tighter winds, indicating is a softer coil. I dont know what else that would be if its not progressive. Now if I could just track down where to get a new set of these!

 

[absalom]

These are on ebay right now, from a 2000 Tacoma. You can clearly see the top section has tighter winds, indicating is a softer coil. I dont know what else that would be if its not progressive. Now if I could just track down where to get a new set of these!


View attachment 159402

Camelback Toyota for new springs.

 

[1985taylor1925]

Camelback Toyota for new springs.

Yeah I was on their website a few nights ago looking. I just don't know which coil I'm looking for. None of them specify progressive. And the listing from the set on eBay doesn't give a proper part number. I'm hoping nissanh can help me track down a part # as he's running the coils right now. He claims they sit the same height as 99 coils but ride much nicer

 

[D Farms]

you can tell its progressive if the coil changes diameter. obviously a thicker gauge of wire is stiffer. however a wider coil wrap is actually softer, because the width of the coil is what gives it its leverage. another thing, if the distance between the wraps changes, that makes it progressive as well. if the gaugr of wire changes that as well will make it progressive.

anyways you probably cant tell on camelback's website, but if you can find pictures of the coils you want, you can tell if they are progressive.

 

[absalom]

you can tell its progressive if the coil changes diameter. obviously a thicker gauge of wire is stiffer. however a wider coil wrap is actually softer, because the width of the coil is what gives it its leverage. another thing, if the distance between the wraps changes, that makes it progressive as well. if the gaugr of wire changes that as well will make it progressive.

anyways you probably cant tell on camelback's website, but if you can find pictures of the coils you want, you can tell if they are progressive.

I was about to say. Why do passenger cars have large voids between each wind of skinny coil?

 

[D Farms]

because its cheaper to make a wide short coil with skinny wire than a narrow tall coil with thick wire. plus they have more travel with less wraps of wire. ? also they are leveraged as well.

also its impossible to have a digressive spring, unless you use a mechanism like a compound bow does. but then when you hit a bump, your truck would jump i think.