V6 towing

[jfoltz]

I have a 04 4Runner v6 and thinking about picking up a Uhaul trailer to drive 95 miles to pick up a 1983 Toyota pickup 2wd 149,xxx original miles running and driving for $500 and towing it 95 miles back home. Will this be fine without a trans cooler and since it should be under 5,000lbs or should I try to borrow my buddy's duramax..?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[AuSeeker]

Without being able to monitor the transmission temperature I personally wouldn't do it and borrow your buddy's truck, you can do major damage to the transmission (i.e. extremely shorten it's life span) if you get up to 190 to 200 degrees and above for an extended time period, if you have a way to monitor the temperature then I would go for it and stop to let the transmission cool down if it gets too hot.

 

[jonesmw10]

What's the weight of the truck/trailer combined? I can't imagine it being over the 5k limit. You should be fine so long as you don't let the tranny constantly hunt for gears. I towed a fully loaded 6x12 across country, through mountain passes with no issues (probably 4k-5k in weight)

 

[AuSeeker]

What's the weight of the truck/trailer combined? I can't imagine it being over the 5k limit. You should be fine so long as you don't let the tranny constantly hunt for gears. I towed a fully loaded 6x12 across country, through mountain passes with no issues (probably 4k-5k in weight)

You towed with your GX 470, or a V6 4Runner?

If with the GX470 I believe the towing capacity for it is 6500 Lbs, correct me if I'm wrong.

2008 Lexus GX 470

MPG: 14 city / 18 highway
Towing capacity: 6,500 lbs
Curb weight: 4,871 lbs
Dimensions: 188″ L x 74″ W x 75″ H
Fuel tank capacity: 23 gal
Horsepower: 263 hp
Gross vehicle weight rating: 6,200 lbs

If you towed a trailer that heavy with a V6 4Runner and weren't able to monitor your transmission temperature you could have possibly shorten the lifespan of the transmission if the temperature got too high, there's no way for anyone to know that they have done damage by overheating that will shorten the lifespan until the day the transmission fails prematurely, it's not something the presents itself immediately.


That being asked and said, I just wanted the OP to be aware if he unknowingly overheats the transmission for a prolong length of time, the lifespan of his transmission will be shorten dramatically.

I also believe that he should be able to tow the truck with no issues, it's just I wouldn't do it without being able to monitor the transmission temperature, when it comes to a very expensive transmission it's better to be safe than sorry later on. IMHO

 

[Bob22222]

You towed with your GX 470, or a V6 4Runner?

If with the GX470 I believe the towing capacity for it is 6500 Lbs, correct me if I'm wrong.

2008 Lexus GX 470

MPG: 14 city / 18 highway
Towing capacity: 6,500 lbs
Curb weight: 4,871 lbs
Dimensions: 188″ L x 74″ W x 75″ H
Fuel tank capacity: 23 gal
Horsepower: 263 hp
Gross vehicle weight rating: 6,200 lbs

If you towed a trailer that heavy with a V6 4Runner and weren't able to monitor your transmission temperature you could have possibly shorten the lifespan of the transmission if the temperature got too high, there's no way for anyone to know that they have done damage by overheating that will shorten the lifespan until the day the transmission fails prematurely, it's not something the presents itself immediately.


That being asked and said, I just wanted the OP to be aware if he unknowingly overheats the transmission for a prolong length of time, the lifespan of his transmission will be shorten dramatically.

I also believe that he should be able to tow the truck with no issues, it's just I wouldn't do it without being able to monitor the transmission temperature, when it comes to a very expensive transmission it's better to be safe than sorry later on. IMHO

While we are on the subject. Anyone know why my wife's 04 GX470 owners manual states the tow capacity at 5k lbs while my 04 Sport Edition V8 is rated at 6.5k lbs as sited above for the 08 GX 470? Apparently it came from the factory without a tow package if that matters. I know a receiver hitch has never been bolted to the frame but now that I think of it I've never checked for trailer wiring. Or could it have anything to do with the KDSS system?

 

[AuSeeker]

While we are on the subject. Anyone know why my wife's 04 GX470 owners manual states the tow capacity at 5k lbs while my 04 Sport Edition V8 is rated at 6.5k lbs as sited above for the 08 GX 470? Apparently it came from the factory without a tow package if that matters. I know a receiver hitch has never been bolted to the frame but now that I think of it I've never checked for trailer wiring. Or could it have anything to do with the KDSS system?

Without the towing package you don't have the transmission cooler or a hitch rated for the max towing.
When I did a search for a 2004 GX 470 the tow rating is still stated as 6500 Lbs, so that rating has to be with the factory towing package.

My 2004 V8 4Runner Limited without a towing package is rated at 5000 lbs, with the towing package it's 7000 lbs., your 2004 Sport Edition V8 should be the same.

 

[Bob22222]

Without the towing package you don't have the transmission cooler or a hitch rated for the max towing.
When I did a search for a 2004 GX 470 the tow rating is still stated as 6500 Lbs, so that rating has to be with the factory towing package.

My 2004 V8 4Runner Limited without a towing package is rated at 5000 lbs, with the towing package it's 7000 lbs., your 2004 Sport Edition V8 should be the same.

Yes, I stand corrected 7k lbs for 4WD and 7.5k for the 2WD V8 with the tow package.
So as I understand the DOT rules and regulations one could not legally (we're talking civil law here not crime but liability) upgrade the tow capacity my adding the above mentioned frame mention frame mounted (sometimes call weight distributing) hitch. Once the the manufacturer states a vehicles weight capacity it can't be upgraded by aftermarket add ons. Is my recollection f the regulations correct?

 

[RonJR]

I don't think you'll be under 5000 lbs. The UHaul vehicle trailer weighs 2200 lbs empty, and I can't believe a Toyota pickup, even 2wd, weighs under 3000 lbs. It's probably more like 3800. Also, UHaul requires that the towing vehicle is at least 80% of the weight of the towed package (trailer plus load).

You might want to go to the UHaul website and see if they will even allow the combination of tow vehicle and towed weight that you are proposing. UHaul is fairly conservative, and generally will not allow you to get to the mfg. towing limits. For example, even though my '06 is rated for 7000 lbs towing, according to UHaul I can't rent a vehicle trailer from them and load my 4200 lb '94 4runner on it and tow it, even though the loaded trailer weight is < 7000 lbs. If I have a Suburban or full-size pickup it's OK.

You can lie to them about what you are doing, but then if something happens you are on your own liability wise.

Edit: I just checked, and a mid 80's pickup weighs 2800 lbs, so you'll be just barely over the 5K limit. UHaul might be OK with it

Check here for UHaul's rules.
https://www.uhaul.com/Trailers/Auto-Transport-Rental/AT/

 

[AuSeeker]

Yes, I stand corrected 7k lbs for 4WD and 7.5k for the 2WD V8 with the tow package.
So as I understand the DOT rules and regulations one could not legally (we're talking civil law here not crime but liability) upgrade the tow capacity my adding the above mentioned frame mention frame mounted (sometimes call weight distributing) hitch. Once the the manufacturer states a vehicles weight capacity it can't be upgraded by aftermarket add ons. Is my recollection f the regulations correct?

As long as you upgrade with OEM parts, you would be within the law and ratings of the manufacturer, the manufacturer doesn't state the towing ratings anywhere on the vehicle except the tow hitch, so if you have the correct hitch either stock or added later you have the capacity stated on it and the owner's manual.

That being said there are 2 different tow hitches, the "V6" hitch which is only attached to the cross member and the "V8" hitch A.K.A. "Weight Carrying Hitch" which is attached to the main side rails of the frame, also most don't understand that the mentioned "Weight Distributing Hitch" A.K.A. a WDH in the owner's manual is not either of the aforementioned tow hitches, a WDH is a optional piece of equipment that attaches to the stock tow hitch's receiver and when setup properly shifts some of the trailer weight to the front of the vehicle, so what Toyota is saying is that even with the "V8" hitch your towing capacity is still only 5000 lbs. it only goes up to the 7000/7200 lbs. when you add the WDH.

It's the general consensus that the "V6" hitch will not withstand the stress of using a WDH because of it being attached only to the cross member, the WDH transfers some of the trailer weight to the front via the tow hitch and the main frame, the cross member is not thought to be strong enough to transmit that force to the side rails of the main frame without deforming/bending.

I don't think you'll be under 5000 lbs. The UHaul vehicle trailer weighs 2200 lbs empty, and I can't believe a Toyota pickup, even 2wd, weighs under 3000 lbs. It's probably more like 3800. Also, UHaul requires that the towing vehicle is at least 80% of the weight of the towed package (trailer plus load).

You might want to go to the UHaul website and see if they will even allow the combination of tow vehicle and towed weight that you are proposing. UHaul is fairly conservative, and generally will not allow you to get to the mfg. towing limits. For example, even though my '06 is rated for 7000 lbs towing, according to UHaul I can't rent a vehicle trailer from them and load my 4200 lb '94 4runner on it and tow it, even though the loaded trailer weight is < 7000 lbs. If I have a Suburban or full-size pickup it's OK.

You can lie to them about what you are doing, but then if something happens you are on your own liability wise.

Edit: I just checked, and a mid 80's pickup weighs 2800 lbs, so you'll be just barely over the 5K limit. UHaul might be OK with it

Check here for UHaul's rules.
https://www.uhaul.com/Trailers/Auto-Transport-Rental/AT/

I also agree that the OP will be close if not over the 5000 lbs limit.

But another option would be to tow the truck using a tow dolly, remove the drive shaft, strap the front of the truck onto the tow dolly and the weight should be around or under 4000 lbs., basically the truck/tow dolly then becomes a trailer.

 

[flipflopnfly]

As long as you upgrade with OEM parts, you would be within the law and ratings of the manufacturer, the manufacturer doesn't state the towing ratings anywhere on the vehicle except the tow hitch, so if you have the correct hitch either stock or added later you have the capacity stated on it and the owner's manual.

That being said there are 2 different tow hitches, the "V6" hitch which is only attached to the cross member and the "V8" hitch A.K.A. "Weight Carrying Hitch" which is attached to the main side rails of the frame, also most don't understand that the mentioned "Weight Distributing Hitch" A.K.A. a WDH in the owner's manual is not either of the aforementioned tow hitches, a WDH is a optional piece of equipment that attaches to the stock tow hitch's receiver and when setup properly shift some of the trailer weight to the front of the vehicle, so what Toyota is saying is that even with the "V8" hitch your towing capacity is still only 5000 lbs. it only goes up to the 7000/7200 lbs. when you add the WDH.

It's the general consensus that the "V6" hitch will not withstand the stress of using a WDH because of it being attached only to the cross member, the WDH transfers some of the trailer weight to the front via the tow hitch and the main frame, the cross member is not thought to be strong enough to transmit that force to the side rails of the main frame without deforming/bending.




I also agree that the OP will be close if not over the 5000 lbs limit.

But another option would be to tow the truck using a tow dolly, remove the drive shaft, strap the front of the truck onto the tow dolly and the weight should be around or under 4000 lbs., basically the truck/tow dolly then becomes a trailer.

I think the Class IV hitch is just better to go with, the outside frame mount. Unfortunately the V6 doesn't have Class IV stock either 4th gen or 5th gen. Or an auxilliary trans cooler.

4.0 V6 can trailer ok, but got shortchanged compared to the Tacoma 4.0 that has the Class IV hitch and trans cooler.

 

[jonesmw10]

You towed with your GX 470, or a V6 4Runner?

With the V6 4Runner I get where you're coming from. 85% of the trip was all flat, which is why I wasn't too worried. The last 15% was mountain passes in Colorado. I just kept in 3rd and 4th for most of it so it wouldn't keep hunting for gears.

 

[RonJR]

I also agree that the OP will be close if not over the 5000 lbs limit.

But another option would be to tow the truck using a tow dolly, remove the drive shaft, strap the front of the truck onto the tow dolly and the weight should be around or under 4000 lbs., basically the truck/tow dolly then becomes a trailer.

I thought of that. However, the problem is that with the tow dolly you now have no brakes on the towed vehicle (the Uhaul vehicle trailers come with surge brakes). 3500 lbs or so is a lot of extra weight back there to rely only on the 4runner brakes.

 

[heiser]

I'm going to post here instead of making a new thread, because I have basically the same situation.

2004, v6, 4wd sport. 185k miles.
moving 1000 miles and thinking of towing the small enclosed uhaul with my belongings. I'm hesitant because last weekend I loaded the cab with camping gear for 150 miles, and that seemed to make a difference. That's less than half the loaded uhaul weight, and a fraction of the 1000 miles move. The max uhaul weight (incl. load) is ~2450 lbs. Not sure I'll use all of that though.

Thoughts?

 

[RonJR]

You should be fine with <2500 lbs. I've pulled that much across the Colorado Rockies with my '94 and the wimpy 3.0 V6. Not fast, but no real problems either. Of course, that vehicle has a manual, so no worries about transmission overheating.

Will it make a noticeable difference in how it drives? Sure. Enough to make the trip miserable? Not likely, unless you simply have to have sports car performance no matter what. Just put on some good music, relax, and enjoy the journey. Take two days for the 1000 miles instead of one. Take the old US or state highways instead of the interstate. Stop at a Mom and Pop restaurant instead of McDonalds. Make it a relaxed trip to remember instead of a death march to endure.

 

[heiser]

You should be fine with <2500 lbs. I've pulled that much across the Colorado Rockies with my '94 and the wimpy 3.0 V6. Not fast, but no real problems either. Of course, that vehicle has a manual, so no worries about transmission overheating.

Will it make a noticeable difference in how it drives? Sure. Enough to make the trip miserable? Not likely, unless you simply have to have sports car performance no matter what. Just put on some good music, relax, and enjoy the journey. Take two days for the 1000 miles instead of one. Take the old US or state highways instead of the interstate. Stop at a Mom and Pop restaurant instead of McDonalds. Make it a relaxed trip to remember instead of a death march to endure.

The funny part is I've done this trip before when I bought it a couple years ago. I went WA to AZ and now I'm going AZ to OR. That was without a trailer, but at least I'm familiar with the journey.

 

[madeinhb]

Why not rent a truck that can easily tow it? Probably cheaper than damaging the t4r

 

[heiser]

Why not rent a truck that can easily tow it? Probably cheaper than damaging the t4r

That's the gamble. Pay 1000 more to rent the truck with the tow, or possibly mess up my transmission and pay a lot more for a repair.

 

[madeinhb]

Have you tried the car transport companies? I shipped a car from CO to VA for around $800

 

[heiser]

Have you tried the car transport companies? I shipped a car from CO to VA for around $800

Last time I looked was 2 years ago when I bought it. I think it was more in the 1000+ range for this specific trip, so it wouldn't be much different cost-wise than towing it myself.

EDIT: Just checked again, $1250 was cheapest for the 4runner. $1000 was cheapest for my Gf's cherokee.