Victim of odometer fraud :(

[ASUMTNEER]

UPDATED: I wanted to come back on and let you all know where this issue is now.
I filed a formal complaint with the Tennessee Department of Safety and Homeland Security. Pretty soon I had a highway patrol sergeant working on my case. He rattled the cages of both my seller, and the dealer my seller bought the car from. There was no real documentation of mileage after the auction purchase from 2019 @ 262k. The dealer claims that my seller bought it with 262k miles and told him his son had totaled a similar vehicle which they kept at their property (damning evidence if true, but a convenient story). I caught the dealer in a couple of lies over a couple of phone calls and the sergeant caught my seller in a couple of lies. With the threat of a civil suit from me, the dealer reached out to me in an attempt to settle. The dealer did not want to waste time in court and his attorney urged him to make a deal with me. Thankfully he made a reasonable offer to start, I countered that offer, and we settled on a sum that puts me back whole.

The issue is now resolved and when I get rid of this 4runner I will be sure to disclose the mileage discrepancy so that the next owner doesn't have to deal with this garbage! I hope this helps someone dealing with this down the line. My result is, according to the sergeant, an atypical one as these thieves usually cover their tracks well and get away with this stuff. In the end I'm glad I went the route of formal filings and not thugs on doorsteps .

 

[JZiggy]

[MENTION=70182]ASUMTNEER[/MENTION]

Nice work! Glad to have a positive example like yours.

 

[brillo_76]

Great work OP. Glad a solution came out of this that works for you. I may dig into just one of mine as its the only one that maybe possible for odometer fraud. The rest have the indication and look like the mileage they have so I am not concerned about them. Besides Randy Bo Bandy and I mostly just fixed up the rotted ones. We expect high mileage and things to be bad..LOL

 

[toyotaspeed90]

Not saying its always obvious but taking the time to look over the vehicle there r indicators between a 175k and 300k vehicle if u understand what ur looking at...

This is actually far from accurate.

Take 2 cars... let's say a 2015 Prius V. One is used in the city as a taxi and has 150k miles. The other is used by an individual who lives 100 miles from work and daily drives it, having 300k miles.

Guess which vehicle will have less wear, less signs of abuse, less strain on the suspension.

I have had many 200-300k+ mile Toyotas and they are generally indistinguishable from lower mileage units of same year/model. I've also been able to buy many sub 200k mile vehicles for very inexpensive because they have major faults (engine, transmission, etc).

I only got through page 1....

WA has a similar setup where the title will show "not actual miles" if over 10 years.


However I have a problem with the entire premise of this thread. The vehicle is bought as is. Unfortunately the buyer might have been duped but had a proper inspection been done, the buyer would understand the condition of the vehicle *if* there are any mechanical problems. However at the end of the day the vehicle is in no different condition regardless of the number on the dash.

Further, when you get to the age these vehicles are there's no telling what previous owners may have done.

Example- our (pretty flawless and 100% rust free) 97 MT SR5 was wrecked when a 16yo hit it. It has 320k miles. We got a good sum for it. Manuals are a pretty penny here so we bought a 97 Limited with 200k miles and a bad motor. I'll be throwing in the drivetrain from the manual (engine, transmission, transfercase) into the Limited. While the interior, in some regards, in the Limited is better than ours there are pieces we will swap as they're in better shape in our SR5 (example- something spilled on the carpet and ate away the fibers in a ~1ft section of the Limited.... our carpet is in good shape without that flaw).

So the dash says 200,222 miles but the drivetrain has 120k MORE miles and will have various pieces swapped... yet the drivetrain going in is in better shape than the engine pulled that had a spun bearing.

Point being, an engine with 175k miles and abused, losing oil pressure about to spin a bearing is worse off than a well maintained 350k mile engine that has great compression. What the vehicle is, when purchased, doesn't change because you learn history about it.

 

[JZiggy]

That being said, the issue is crooks who will roll back the odometer in order the sell the vehicle for more money since *most* people place a high value on having lower miles on a used vehicle.

Even with great maintenance a high mileage vehicle is still just that.

 

[spartacus]

If every one did what the op did their would be a lot less odometer fraud. Way to go [MENTION=70182]ASUMTNEER[/MENTION].

 

[ASUMTNEER]

If every one did what the op did their would be a lot less odometer fraud. Way to go [MENTION=70182]ASUMTNEER[/MENTION].

I honestly never expected to see a dime from this, but was hoping it would keep someone from trying this again.

 

[toyotaspeed90]

That being said, the issue is crooks who will roll back the odometer in order the sell the vehicle for more money since *most* people place a high value on having lower miles on a used vehicle.

Even with great maintenance a high mileage vehicle is still just that.

Not really though.

Unless you're talking about a pristine model with under 50k miles, the price really isn't all that reflective of mileage.

Again, would you buy a 150k mile rig for $5k if it has a hole through the block because the PO didn't ever change the oil? Or would you rather buy a 250k mile vehicle that has major and minor maintenance performed, no signs of rust, one owner, etc.


I'll also tell you... about 10 years ago my parents were given my grandma's 1995 Camry, which had 30k original miles on a 5sfe. Should have been the most reliable vehicle one could imagine... but there was quite a bit of dry rot on the rubber components and had quite a bit of issues for the ~7 years they drove it. It's no longer their primary vehicle.


When we bought our LX570 (in July) the worst vehicle I looked at was an 08 with 170k miles. The 2nd worst was a 2013 with 80k miles. The best, and one we bought, was an '11 with 125k miles. 45k miles more and a far better vehicle in maintenance and overall condition.

 

[toyotaspeed90]

Now the real question is if the OP is going to get rid of the vehicle because it's higher mileage has now magically made it a worse vehicle than when purchased?

 

[pavelvoivoda]

...and I am over here in Bulgaria, reading and laughing at odo fraud issue in the US! The odo is the last thing you look at when buying a car in the whole of Europe, even from reputable countries like Germany, where they allegedly have some system for tracking milage/kilometerage on vehicles! But in Eastern Europe...

 

[96RedRunner]

...and I am over here in Bulgaria, reading and laughing at odo fraud issue in the US! The odo is the last thing you look at when buying a car in the whole of Europe...

Have wondered what it's like in your area, thanks. I chuckle when I hear of it I'm in US, odo is last thing I look at also.

Congrats to OP on outcome.

 

[JZiggy]

If you find yourself having to resell the vehicle then have fun telling the average joe that your used vehicle with an odometer reading past 300k is "just as good" as all those ~200k options on the market with unknown maintenance. To me that is the primary reason why odometer fraud is an issue in our case. Crooks wouldn't take the time to buy, roll back, and flip for a profit if this wasn't true.

 

[pavelvoivoda]

have fun telling the average joe that your used vehicle with an odometer reading past 300k is "just as good" as all those ~200k options...

yeah I know, you are right!
Statistically speaking tho, in the end it's just some people trying to buy some cars from people trying to make money off of them.

I know it's also about the concept of safety, an missing one over here and the rest of the world.

Funny how different parts of the world have pretty much the same kind of crap to deal with when alive, no matter the standard of living.