what happens if KDSS no longer works?

[Buck208]

First off I'm no mechanic and new the 4RNRs but I joined this forum to learn, ask questions, and maybe provide an occasional answer or perspective.

Since KDSS is new to Toyotas but has been in the Lexus GX since 2005 has anyone asked their Lexus brothers/sisters/ Lexus mechanics what if any issues they had with the KDSS. It seems that 10 years of operation would be enough time to work out any kinks and enough time to have the institutional knowledge to answer the "what if" questions regarding KDSS.

 

[wadle5]

With this comment, you've officially been enshrined in my Ignore List with [MENTION=2]Thai[/MENTION] and [MENTION=84680]wadle5[/MENTION]. Congratulations. You're number #3 but you're currently #1.

And, while I don't have your *vast* knowledge on all things 4Runner, you're simply part of the problem around here. But you're no longer my problem...

Go away for a week with no activity and I get dragged into this. Don't put that on me, because you cant take constructive criticism. I would say the individuals who have posted a response to the ridiculous question in the first place answered it(although not initially, because no one really thought the OP was serious). The OP is clearly just trolling and his statements show how truly intelligent he is. I don't fix stuff when the vehicle gets high miles on it? Really? You already have your "system" to these issues so why even get on here and ask this question. The OP and your statements just show what kind of basic B*&ch you really are. Watch out for the world wide web. . .where other people have opinions and call you out for your BS


edit: hope everyone had a great labor day weekend!

 

[ArmedBear]

It is not trolling. I am looking for a real answer that apparently nobody really knows. I have seen a dozen vids and understand what less is, but what happens if it fails? Is the vehicle unbalanced? If one was to drain the fluid couldn't the system just be passive?

I read through the first page of replies.... Remind me to never ask an honest question on this forum.

The only "real" response was someone telling you to google it. Super helpful.

I don't understand how some people just can't help themselves from typing useless shit or trolling.

It is like the Amazon review section where someone posts a question, and someone always responds "I don't know." Why even type that out?

 

[1engineer]

I read through the first page of replies.... Remind me to never ask an honest question on this forum.

The only "real" response was someone telling you to google it. Super helpful.

I don't understand how some people just can't help themselves from typing useless shit or trolling.

It is like the Amazon review section where someone posts a question, and someone always responds "I don't know." Why even type that out?

People have asked questions and received good answers for years in this section. There comes a time though when the question has been asked and answered countless times or the question is so far out in left field that the answers just have to be as silly or repetitious as the original question.

Do research. Search first for an answer to your question. This model is six years old and very few questions about it have not been asked and answered already countless times. Think about your question before you ask and if it sounds dumb to you then it will sound dumb to others too. Don't let your fingers type in third gear while your brain is in first gear. Now, if after doing all this you still have an unanswered question then ask away and expect good answers.

Oh, and use proper English with correct spelling, sentence structure and punctuation. Rightly or wrongly, people will judge based on your post. Since nobody knows anything about you then the only thing left is how you write and present yourself. People from other countries obviously get a free pass here. There are the unwritten rules. Use them. Now I will probably be banished to some obscure section of the forum for writing the unwritten rules.. ...

 

[wadle5]

I don't understand how some people just can't help themselves from typing useless shit or trolling.

You do realize this is exactly what you did and you in no way positively contributed to answering his question. Any assistance would be appreciated in reaching the appropriate answer for his question. But all you have done is told everyone thanks for not helping?

If you do not fix KDSS realistically I don't think people have an ACTUAL answer, because individuals take care of their vehicle here. For the OP to pass off this repair/damage like windows and an AC unit and he doesn't repair him then by all means he should see how this pans out and keep us in the loop. Blackworks gave a response of possible system going into limp mode. And another member suggested since the system is so new to these vehicle, maybe check in Lexus forums who have had this system in their vehicles for years. The LOGICAL(common) response, would be to fix this system as it is a vital component of the vehicle. IF he doesn't fix broken items on his truck already, why would he change his tune now?

 

[undignified]

I read through the first page of replies.... Remind me to never ask an honest question on this forum.

The only "real" response was someone telling you to google it. Super helpful.

I don't understand how some people just can't help themselves from typing useless shit or trolling.

It is like the Amazon review section where someone posts a question, and someone always responds "I don't know." Why even type that out?

So you're gonna troll the trollers? what are you trying to prove buddy? :noidea:

Your Amazon analogy makes no sense.

Let's say a question was asked on Amazon review section regarding a product (ex: how much does the item weigh?). Amazon member then answers the question. Then another person asks the same question...then another...and on and on.

 

[philsey]

.....Remind me to never ask an honest question on this forum.

Really AB? REALLY?

Here's the "honest question" at the heart of it all. Please READ it, ponder it, digest it .....

Is this something [KDSS] that needs to be fixed if it breaks?
.

Now, you're smart enough to hold a job that allows you to buy a new 4R, right? Aren't you also smart enough to recognize what a really stupid question the OP posed?

I mean, c'mon man .... "do I fix a MAJOR subsystem on my 4R if it breaks?" How can you defend this silly question?

Sure, he got clobbered. He got clobbered by those of us who recognize a DA post and called him out for it.

Please, ask all the "honest" questions you want. But don't ask ridiculous questions if you're thin-skinned.

 

[Jhalko]

I read through the first page of replies.... Remind me to never ask an honest question on this forum.

The only "real" response was someone telling you to google it. Super helpful.

I don't understand how some people just can't help themselves from typing useless shit or trolling.

I call BS, I provided some links with AMAZING information in them that I even learned a couple things from. If you want to complain at least be accurate.

Since I took the time to search for that information I get to make a snarky comment about searching. :wtf:

 

[krole]

Since a new member isn't allowed to make new posts, I will post here.

I'm actually curious about the question of what happens if KDSS stops working. Instead of an actual answer, everyone here is just a smartass.

So the options I can assume would be.

1. Replace it for $4K
2. Tear it out and no sway bar
3. Leave it in and it will be stuck in 1 position? This is what I'm curious about. How would this affect handling?

Sorry but I've been searching about KDSS for probably the past week, about to buy a new 4Runner and plan on keeping it for a long time. I just want to know what options would be if it fails in 15 years.

 

[Jivewalker]

Since a new member isn't allowed to make new posts, I will post here.

I'm actually curious about the question of what happens if KDSS stops working. Instead of an actual answer, everyone here is just a smartass.

So the options I can assume would be.

1. Replace it for $4K
2. Tear it out and no sway bar
3. Leave it in and it will be stuck in 1 position? This is what I'm curious about. How would this affect handling?

Sorry but I've been searching about KDSS for probably the past week, about to buy a new 4Runner and plan on keeping it for a long time. I just want to know what options would be if it fails in 15 years.

Since you revived this old thread and I just read some of it, I'll take a stab here and give my opinion. It would depend fully on what part of the KDSS was not working. Pistons, actuators, sway bars, electronics, etc. all working together to achieve a system result. So a failure in any one of the components may provide different "what happens" scenarios. Hopefully this isn't coming across as smartass, but this is how i see it.

 

[Jetboy]

To add to what's above - I've never heard of a KDSS valve failing. If a valve fails in the open position - you'll have a softer sway bar effectively. Handling will not be good on the highway. If if fails closed, then it'll be the same on the road, but pretty firm off road and it won't open up.

The most common (the only type I've ever actually heard of - and it's rare) - is a cylinder seal leaking. If it leaks enough fluid eventually it'll end up like having no sway bars. So handling will suffer on the road quite a bit. You will know something is wrong. Also I'm sure dash lights will tell you something is wrong before you get to that point.

In most cases - yeah, I'd repair it. There are probably half a million KDSS models in service. Very very few failures. And there are lots of used parts available, or new ones, to fix it. It's about the same process as replacing a high pressure shock absorber plus bleeding a brake system. It's not rocket science.

If you didn't want to replace it - you can buy a set of sway bars and brackets for the regular SR5 model and swap them on. They should just bolt into place. And you can remove the KDSS sway bars. If you want a little softer flex - you can use Limited model sway bars. They fit in the same place as the non-KDSS bar, but are smaller diameter and as a result have lesser spring rate.

If you don't like any of those options - buy a model without KDSS. It has pluses and minuses. You can buy an extended warranty up to 10 years if you want Toyota to own the risk of a failure.

As a comparison - lots of aftermarket suspensions at the top end are as expensive or more expensive. A replacement coilover from Fox or King costs about the same as a KDSS cylinder. The only tricky part is the re-pressure charging and bleeding of KDSS.

 

[krole]

Since you revived this old thread and I just read some of it, I'll take a stab here and give my opinion. It would depend fully on what part of the KDSS was not working. Pistons, actuators, sway bars, electronics, etc. all working together to achieve a system result. So a failure in any one of the components may provide different "what happens" scenarios. Hopefully this isn't coming across as smartass, but this is how i see it.

Understandable, I'm just trying to understand what I'm dealing with when spending $40K.

Maybe I will take my question down to this.. My simplified understanding is there the "slow off road mode" below 12 mph? And the "high speed road mode" above 12 mph?

Say its stuck in the "slow off road mode" below 12 mph, how would it handle high road speeds?

What about if its stuck in the "high speed road mode", how does that affect the slow off road articulation?

Maybe being this worried about KDSS I should forget about it.

 

[Jivewalker]

Understandable, I'm just trying to understand what I'm dealing with when spending $40K.

Maybe I will take my question down to this.. My simplified understanding is there the "slow off road mode" below 12 mph? And the "high speed road mode" above 12 mph?

Say its stuck in the "slow off road mode" below 12 mph, how would it handle high road speeds?

What about if its stuck in the "high speed road mode", how does that affect the slow off road articulation?

Maybe being this worried about KDSS I should forget about it.

If it makes you feel any better, I'm at 201,000 miles with zero KDSS issues. Anytime you add a system, you will have to maintain it at some point. To me, risk was worth the reward and If I ever buy another vehicle with the option, I will take it without hesitation. Lots of opinions on here will differ with what I say, but having test drove both I liked the KDSS better and bought it.

 

[krole]

If you didn't want to replace it - you can buy a set of sway bars and brackets for the regular SR5 model and swap them on. They should just bolt into place. And you can remove the KDSS sway bars. If you want a little softer flex - you can use Limited model sway bars. They fit in the same place as the non-KDSS bar, but are smaller diameter and as a result have lesser spring rate.

I thought the KDSS models have a different LCA and frame. Any idea if those would prevent the stock sway bar from fitting? If I know I could always do this I don't think I would have an issue going KDSS.

Overall that is the best information I've seen regarding this so far in one post. Thanks.

 

[Jetboy]

I thought the KDSS models have a different LCA and frame. Any idea if those would prevent the stock sway bar from fitting? If I know I could always do this I don't think I would have an issue going KDSS.

Overall that is the best information I've seen regarding this so far in one post. Thanks.

I believe the frame mounts are already there in the front. And the non-KDSS sway bar attaches to the spindle/upgright and I can confirm that they are shared parts, the mounting location is there. I'd have to double check where the holes are in the frame up front to verify that there are welded in nuts in the correct spot. Worst case you could weld some in or use riv-nuts or similar.

On the rear - I was wrong - the rear axle does not have the mounting points and the rear frame does not have the mounting flanges on the sides. So the rear would require some welding. It's pretty easy to do if you have fabrication tools, but it's not something you can bolt on.