4 speed automatic vs 5 speed ('04 > '05+)

[DaveK22]

I'm going to be looking at a 2004 V6 that just got listed on craigs. I was the first caller.

From what I have read in the past, the main change from 04 to 05 models was the transmission going from 4 speed to 5 speed...excluding cosmetic stuff.

Is there a noticeable difference between the two? Any advantages of the 4 speed? Any problems? Also, anyone know why toyota changed to the 5 speed in '05?

Maybe a case of you won't miss what you don't have? lol

Thanks.

 

[ebg18t]

I would suspect the 5spd would offer a higher 5th gear for better fuel economy on the hwy.

 

[settytb]

I have an 03 v6 with the 4 speed...and it has about 140k on it with no issues. Wish the 1st gear was a little lower but that's just preference. I'm happy with it.

 

[TechWrench]

I would suspect the 5spd would offer a higher 5th gear for better fuel economy on the hwy.

Actually, as I understand it, the final 5th gear ratios are the same. The extra gear results in changes to 1st through 3rd to fit it in between.

The biggest difference, other than the extra gear, is the loss of the dip stick in the 5 speed and the switch to the 'lifetime' fluid from Type-IV.

 

[ebg18t]

Actually, as I understand it, the final 5th gear ratios are the same. The extra gear results in changes to 1st through 3rd to fit it in between.

The biggest difference, other than the extra gear, is the loss of the dip stick in the 5 speed and the switch to the 'lifetime' fluid from Type-IV.

They are closer than I expected in final gear. Still give the nod to the 5spd for economy compared to the 4spd that I have.

5-speed ECT automatic
1st 3.520
2nd 2.042
3rd 1.400
4th 1.000
5th 0.716
Reverse 3.224
Differential Ratio 3.727

4spd

4-speed ECT-i automatic
1st 2.804
2nd 1.531
3rd 1.000
4th 0.705
Reverse 2.393
Differential 3.909

 

[awdjunkies]

Within the next 6 months or so, I will be looking for a 4th gen. I too was wondering the same thing regarding the 4sp vs 5sp Auto tranny. Rather than starting a new thread, I searched and came up with this thread. Any more info, As into real world difference MPG wise between the two?


PS: I will continue my search, to see If I find any more on this..

 

[rip-cord]

I'm in the same boat as you. I'll be buying a new-to-me T4R early March and I'm trying to find more information about the tranny switch yota did between 04 and 05.
Seems like the "extra" gear is for lower gear ratio? Top gear ratio stays the same so highway driving won't be affected b/c it is the same?

Also the removal of a dip-stick? So, how do you check the oil? Look for drops consistently? Might be silly I've just always used a dip.

Long story short, I was all set on buying an 03-04 w/ out 100K for around $11-12k. Now, I might want to look into picking up something a little newer if the 5gear is worth it?

Thoughts?

 

[salong53]

Coming from someone who has driven both, I much prefer the 5 speed. I currently own a 4 speed, and it definitely hinders the performance of the V6 motor, both in everyday driving and off road. Here are some complaints:
1) A tendency for the trans to get "confused" between 1st and 2nd gear on slow turns (15ish mph) resulting in either a lurch forward (1st gear) or lethargic acceleration (2nd).
2) When pulling out in traffic and trying to prevent wheel spin when at full lock, the transmission shifts into 2nd gear too quickly, then you have to floor it to shift back into 1st gear when you can finally put the power down.
3) When off road in 4hi, 1st gear and 2nd gear are too tall for engine braking when trying to maintain fairly slow speed.
4) The shift from 1st to 2nd under hard acceleration takes forever.

All of those complaints would be fixed if there were a gear between 1st and 2nd, which is why the 5 speed is better in my opinion.

 

[M1911]

1) Skip the 4-speed. The 5-speed is a lot better. The V6 engine doesn't have a lot of power and needs all the gears it can get.

2) The early V6 engines suffered from leaking intake manifolds. Fixing that costs ~$3K. I would not get an early 4th Gen V6.

 

[Martinjmpr]

I've never driven a 4th gen with the 4 speed but IIRC the 4 speed that is in the 03-04 V6's is the same A340 4 speed that was in my 3rd gen (1999.) I hated the combo of the 3.4/4 speed. It just seemed like the 3.4 had decent power when combined with a 5 speed manual (previous to the 3rd gen I owned a 2004 Tacoma with the 3.4 and 5 speed manual) but that 4 speed auto just sucked the power right out of the 3.4 and left it both anemic and thirsty.


I'm not a huge fan of slushboxes but I have to admit the 5 speed on the 05+ V6 4runner is pretty decent for an auto. And it's nice off road to have that low 1st gear (and I do use it!)

Between the 4 speed auto and the known (but probably overblown) head gasket problems (see what I did there? : ) I would say the only reason to get an 03-04 V6 was either because you really like the "look" of the early 4th gen or to save $$.

OR, you want to get the elusive Imperial Jade Mica (Dark green) 4th gen, which, sadly, was only sold in 2003.

 

[wnelax04sr5]

lol so much underserved hate for the v6, doesnt have a lot of power and needs all the help it can get? IIRC it has more HP than the early V8......

 

[M1911]

lol so much underserved hate for the v6, doesnt have a lot of power and needs all the help it can get? IIRC it has more HP than the early V8......

It is torque that matters in a truck. The V6 torque curve sucks.

 

[wnelax04sr5]

It is torque that matters in a truck. The V6 torque curve sucks.

suv* i tow with mine all the time. never had a single issue, with the tranny or the motor. i have no complaints about my v6 or its sucky torque curve

 

[verman84]

I would also suggest trying to pick up a later version 4th gen (06-09) as they made a variety of mechanical and cosmetic refinements on the 4runner after it had been out for a while.

Depending on your budget and desired mileage you can find 06+ anywhere from $7 (w/160k miles) to $13k (w/100k miles) around here.

 

[black4vcobra]

lol so much underserved hate for the v6, doesnt have a lot of power and needs all the help it can get? IIRC it has more HP than the early V8......

V8 owners are mostly just giving V6 owners shit because they can. It's rooted in the general mindset that many people have that "if a V8 is available, why would anyone ever get a V6???" and that applies to quite a few different vehicles.

If you look at a V6 Mustang for instance, it is a completely inferior car than the V8 version, FAR slower and often many less options and it doesn't sound like a muscle/pony car.

Same with many full size trucks, for a long time the V6's (200ish hp) were the base model 2WD while the 4WD trucks all had V8s (often 300+ hp), obviously a much more desirable combination.

Toyota made a good decision by putting a capable V6 in the 4th gen 4Runners and an even more capable V8 as an option. I've been in 4th Gen V6 4Runners and they are plenty strong and can actually get out of their own way unlike many other base engine SUV's.

 

[wnelax04sr5]

V8 owners are mostly just giving V6 owners shit because they can. It's rooted in the general mindset that many people have that "if a V8 is available, why would anyone ever get a V6???" and that applies to quite a few different vehicles.

If you look at a V6 Mustang for instance, it is a completely inferior car than the V8 version, FAR slower and often many less options and it doesn't sound like a muscle/pony car.

Same with many full size trucks, for a long time the V6's (200ish hp) were the base model 2WD while the 4WD trucks all had V8s (often 300+ hp), obviously a much more desirable combination.

Toyota made a good decision by putting a capable V6 in the 4th gen 4Runners and an even more capable V8 as an option. I've been in 4th Gen V6 4Runners and they are plenty strong and can actually get out of their own way unlike many other base engine SUV's.

i totally agree with you. I drove both, i loved the v8 and i love my v6, compared to a lot of other vehicles in the class, both motors are far better options than in any other.

a good friend of mine has a '15 v6 mustang with an auto. I'm not quite used to anything thats necessarily "fast" (go ahead make fun of the v6 more) but boy is that thing quick. it used to be all about theres no replacement for displacement, but with things like the eco boost, although some are problematic, that notion is going by the wayside.

what i can't wrap my head around on this forum is the superiority complex some people get just cause they have two more cylinders. if thats how you measure yourself, then you have bigger issues than me having a v6.

:cheers:

 

[ASUMTNEER]

2) The early V6 engines suffered from leaking intake manifolds. Fixing that costs ~$3K. I would not get an early 4th Gen V6.

Is this true? I've missed this if it's true. I know the early V8's are prone to exhaust manifold leaks.

 

[black4vcobra]

i totally agree with you. I drove both, i loved the v8 and i love my v6, compared to a lot of other vehicles in the class, both motors are far better options than in any other.

a good friend of mine has a '15 v6 mustang with an auto. I'm not quite used to anything thats necessarily "fast" (go ahead make fun of the v6 more) but boy is that thing quick. it used to be all about theres no replacement for displacement, but with things like the eco boost, although some are problematic, that notion is going by the wayside.

what i can't wrap my head around on this forum is the superiority complex some people get just cause they have two more cylinders. if thats how you measure yourself, then you have bigger issues than me having a v6.

:cheers:

Ya, the V6 pony cars have gotten much better. The 2011 to '15 V6 Mustang has 300 or so horsepower. If you go back to 2010 the 4.6L GT motor only had 300 horsepower, so they've come a long ways. I have a '99 Cobra myself and if I hadn't added a supercharger it would only be marginally more powerful than the current V6s! Obviously the current trend is automakers going to smaller displacement, higher specific output motors which I think have both positives (better fuel economy) and negatives (often slower with less aftermarket potential).

Superiority complex happens all the time in the automotive world so don't sweat it, the worst offenders are usually the knuckle draggers who want to have the highest lifted diesel pickup that can roll the most coal. Usually guys like that are compensating for some other shortcoming though...

 

[M1911]

what i can't wrap my head around on this forum is the superiority complex some people get just cause they have two more cylinders. if thats how you measure yourself, then you have bigger issues than me having a v6.

Are you projecting?

I don't think I'm superior in any way because I've got the V8. I've driven the V8 and the V6. I think the V8 drives better than the V6. The V8 is more refined and needs a lot less revs to accelerate. The V6 compounds the issue by not being relatively loud and coarse when reving. The 4-speed transmission on the 04-05 doesn't help matters.

I'm sorry you seem to be taking that as an insult, but that's your problem, not mine.

DaveK22, drive 4-speed and 5-speed V6s. I think you'll find that the 5-speed is worth the extra money for the newer truck.

 

[wnelax04sr5]

Ya, the V6 pony cars have gotten much better. The 2011 to '15 V6 Mustang has 300 or so horsepower. If you go back to 2010 the 4.6L GT motor only had 300 horsepower, so they've come a long ways. I have a '99 Cobra myself and if I hadn't added a supercharger it would only be marginally more powerful than the current V6s! Obviously the current trend is automakers going to smaller displacement, higher specific output motors which I think have both positives (better fuel economy) and negatives (often slower with less aftermarket potential).

Superiority complex happens all the time in the automotive world so don't sweat it, the worst offenders are usually the knuckle draggers who want to have the highest lifted diesel pickup that can roll the most coal. Usually guys like that are compensating for some other shortcoming though...

my roommates previous truck......