97 Limited T4R VIOLENT shaking

[sw1]

Hi all,

I've been visiting this site for a while now and this is my first post.

I own a 97 Limited all stock 2WD. I bought it from a shady dealer who went out of business just after my warranty expired. When I bought the vehicle, it had no apparent problems. I first started noticing the following issue about a year ago. (actually, I bought new tires)

My "poor Runner" has been violently shaking at times. It is more apparent at freeway speeds. I've brought it to two different highly rated shops. Nobody can figure out what is happening. The real kicker is that the shaking will get worse and worse and then GO AWAY!

Here is a list of all of the repairs I've paid for to try to fix this issue:
- Resurfaced rotors, they warped again quickly, then I just had them replaced
- new drum brakes in rear
- drive shaft was straightened
- u joint replaced
- tires balanced, rotated (the tires are about a year old)
- my driver rear wheel's brakes kept dragging, had them replaced again
- parking brake adjusted twice

That's all I can think of at the moment. I've had the brakes and the steering inspected several times.

More specifics:

When I drive in the city, I can feel the truck "lurching": no throttle, just coasting along in gear, I can feel it being held back by something. The slower I go, the slower I can feel the lurch, the faster, blah blah you know.

On the freeway, this violent shaking/vibration gets really bad at 45 through 70 (as fast as I'm willing to go). Just for fun, I pulled up gently on the parking brake and can feel it though the handle quite well. It seems like the entire rear end is going to shake itself apart. The rear view mirror image is totally fuzzy at this point. The steering wheel isn't shaking like the rest of the car, only a tiny bit. When I brake, I can feel my brakes pulsating heavily. I just keep trucking along and it eventually goes away, as if nothing ever happened. The brakes actually go back to normal as well!

So frustrating. I've gone on 3 ride alongs with my mechanic and it only happened once while he was in the car. Of course, now it is happening all the time.

If someone has any suggestions, I'd be very grateful for your advice. I really do love this truck but it's trying my patience. :ybrick:

 

[etc.]

Hi all,

I've been visiting this site for a while now and this is my first post.

I own a 97 Limited all stock 2WD. I bought it from a shady dealer who went out of business just after my warranty expired. When I bought the vehicle, it had no apparent problems. I first started noticing the following issue about a year ago. (actually, I bought new tires)

My "poor Runner" has been violently shaking at times. It is more apparent at freeway speeds. I've brought it to two different highly rated shops. Nobody can figure out what is happening. The real kicker is that the shaking will get worse and worse and then GO AWAY!

Here is a list of all of the repairs I've paid for to try to fix this issue:
- Resurfaced rotors, they warped again quickly, then I just had them replaced
- new drum brakes in rear
- drive shaft was straightened
- u joint replaced
- tires balanced, rotated (the tires are about a year old)
- my driver rear wheel's brakes kept dragging, had them replaced again
- parking brake adjusted twice

That's all I can think of at the moment. I've had the brakes and the steering inspected several times.

More specifics:

When I drive in the city, I can feel the truck "lurching": no throttle, just coasting along in gear, I can feel it being held back by something. The slower I go, the slower I can feel the lurch, the faster, blah blah you know.

On the freeway, this violent shaking/vibration gets really bad at 45 through 70 (as fast as I'm willing to go). Just for fun, I pulled up gently on the parking brake and can feel it though the handle quite well. It seems like the entire rear end is going to shake itself apart. The rear view mirror image is totally fuzzy at this point. The steering wheel isn't shaking like the rest of the car, only a tiny bit. When I brake, I can feel my brakes pulsating heavily. I just keep trucking along and it eventually goes away, as if nothing ever happened. The brakes actually go back to normal as well!

So frustrating. I've gone on 3 ride alongs with my mechanic and it only happened once while he was in the car. Of course, now it is happening all the time.

If someone has any suggestions, I'd be very grateful for your advice. I really do love this truck but it's trying my patience. :ybrick:

I would look into steering rack bushings. They are known to go bad.

And unbolting the DS and spining it 180*s and reinstalling. Maybe your DS lost a couple weights. When looking at your DS, see if you can notice any imperfections were a weight could have been.

As far as the lurching, have you looked at each corner independantly? Raise the rear, and spin the tire by hand? For the front, you can raise one corner at a time.

 

[trailhead98]

Cylinder misfire? I had a awful violent shake going on with my runner, and turned out a had a spark plug fried causing one of my cylinder to misfire. Just a idea..

 

[alaskaflyer]

- my driver rear wheel's brakes kept dragging, had them replaced again

did you just have the brakes replaced? what about the drums? hows the rear axle?

 

[maxspeed96ct]

Check your main crank pulley . I know it sounds stupid. But on my maxima there a little rubber vibration isolater in the middle of the pulley that fell apart on me. And was cause vibrations throughout the hole car.

I did the same thing as you , I think I changed just about everything on the car. And finally when a belt shredded on me I noticed the pulley.

Good luck bro.

 

[4x4RunnerSR5]

So we have balance shafts or any of those vibration dampering devices? I would also ckeck motor mounts and suspension mounts. Also. It may sound stupid but you never mentioned doing an alignment.

 

[brian2sun]

Hi all,

I've been visiting this site for a while now and this is my first post.

I own a 97 Limited all stock 2WD. I bought it from a shady dealer who went out of business just after my warranty expired. When I bought the vehicle, it had no apparent problems. I first started noticing the following issue about a year ago. (actually, I bought new tires)

My "poor Runner" has been violently shaking at times. It is more apparent at freeway speeds. I've brought it to two different highly rated shops. Nobody can figure out what is happening. The real kicker is that the shaking will get worse and worse and then GO AWAY!

Here is a list of all of the repairs I've paid for to try to fix this issue:
- Resurfaced rotors, they warped again quickly, then I just had them replaced
- new drum brakes in rear
- drive shaft was straightened- u joint replaced
- tires balanced, rotated (the tires are about a year old)
- my driver rear wheel's brakes kept dragging, had them replaced again
- parking brake adjusted twice

That's all I can think of at the moment. I've had the brakes and the steering inspected several times.

More specifics:

When I drive in the city, I can feel the truck "lurching": no throttle, just coasting along in gear, I can feel it being held back by something. The slower I go, the slower I can feel the lurch, the faster, blah blah you know.

On the freeway, this violent shaking/vibration gets really bad at 45 through 70 (as fast as I'm willing to go). Just for fun, I pulled up gently on the parking brake and can feel it though the handle quite well. It seems like the entire rear end is going to shake itself apart. The rear view mirror image is totally fuzzy at this point. The steering wheel isn't shaking like the rest of the car, only a tiny bit. When I brake, I can feel my brakes pulsating heavily. I just keep trucking along and it eventually goes away, as if nothing ever happened. The brakes actually go back to normal as well!

So frustrating. I've gone on 3 ride alongs with my mechanic and it only happened once while he was in the car. Of course, now it is happening all the time.

If someone has any suggestions, I'd be very grateful for your advice. I really do love this truck but it's trying my patience. :ybrick:

I think that's your issue. The big question is.. what the hell happened to it (and the truck) to need to be straightened?

 

[Headly]

So we have balance shafts or any of those vibration dampering devices? I would also ckeck motor mounts and suspension mounts. Also. It may sound stupid but you never mentioned doing an alignment.

I read the 3.4 is internally balanced - no harmonic balancer to go out of whack like on a Jeep

 

[brian2sun]

I read the 3.4 is internally balanced - no harmonic balancer to go out of whack like on a Jeep

The harmonic balancer is right behind the crankshaft pulley on the 3.4.

 

[cfranck1]

I read the 3.4 is internally balanced - no harmonic balancer to go out of whack like on a Jeep

There is sometimes countershafts in the engine to further dampen NVH (Noise, Vibration, Harshness)

There is pretty much a Harmonic Balancer on everything.

The harmonic balancer is always made from two pieces separated by rubber. The purpose of this setup is to isolate engine vibrations from the belts. In a four-cycle engine, you get four distinct torque twists. The rubber insulator absorbs some of those shocks


Sounds like the same thing that happened to my and my Tacoma. I had the lurch also. You will want to new drums machined before you put them on. They are always out of round from factory unless you bought OE Toyota ones. The drums are out of round when they get hot. That's probably why the issue comes and goes. Either the rear ebrake is adjusted too tight, or your Bell Cranks (see link) are frozen on, which occurs all the time.

http://www.tundrasolutions.com/foru...-toyota-truck-park-brake-bellcrank-repair.pdf

 

[AddictedOffroad]

How are you rear panhard bar bushings? It could lead to death wobble in the rear end.

Does it feel like the axle is moving side to side under the car when this happens?

 

[fightman80]

I had the same issue with my 98. It would shake then stop! I posted a thread last year asking about this issue, and told people that I had lost my coolant in the rad. We decided to do a pressure test of the cooling system, and were able to determine there was a leak. I ended up finding out that my rear coolant lines that lead to the rear heater were leaking!

DO YOURSELF A FAVOR: Check your coolant level! Top up the rad and fill the reservoir to its mark. If that cures your problem, that's what the issue is! You'll find the coolant lines run along the passenger side frame rail. THere is a plastic shield that covers the lines, the shield can be removed using a socket wrench. Check your lines, and I'm willing to bet you have a leak somewhere!

How's the undercarriage of your truck? Any rust issues? THe lines are made of steel, and rust out!

Please take this seriously and check out your coolant levels. If it is your issue, just cut out the rusty section, and replace with rubber coolant hose that is the same size. Use a small hose clamp to secure the line and that should be it!

Keep us posted!

 

[legokcen]

Did you have your drive shaft rebalanced after it was straightened? Toyota drive shafts need balancing.

 

[fightman80]

Did you have your drive shaft rebalanced after it was straightened? Toyota drive shafts need balancing.

If it were an axle or drive shaft problem, wouldn't it start out minor, get worse upon accelaration, and then continue???? This shaking is stopping with no apparent reason......I would still recommend the coolant check 1st.

Think about it, if the mechanics keep checking the wheels, brakes, and driveline stuff, and find nothing......maybe it's something totally unrelated to the driveline??? Check the coolant, if all is good with the coolant, then at least you ruled it out, and you can move on.:bluejump:

 

[LINY4Runner]

You never mentioned having the tires balanced and/or rotated...

maybe you threw a weight, or even worse maybe a cord shifted in the tire...
what kind of tires are they?




:snacker:

 

[fightman80]

Any word on this yet? Have you figured out what the issue is???

 

[eoj.turner]

I have a 97 runner with 223,000 miles and it too shakes violently above 60mph but it comes and goes. The vehicle and steering wheel shake! And it will pull slightly to the left then to the right.
I know i have a bad strut and will be replacing that today. The shakes are worse in warmer weather. I checked TRE's inner outter, ball joints and bearings and don't see any looseness.
The ujoints seem ok. I can hear a very very small tink when I shake the back of the d-shaft coming from the rear joint but i cant really see it moving.

checking the rack from below with my wife turning the steering wheel the rack doesn't move untill the wheel is forced to the extream left or right then the rack will move between 1/4-3/8ths on an inch!
Is this normal?
And since it's worse in warmer weather I'm thinking bushings or shocks would be the most likely culprits right?
I also have a tube in the front tire opposit of the bad shock.
I want new tires but can't afford 4 new ones at this time.
Where should I start if the shocks don't fix the prob?
Rack bushings? ujoints?
Any help is appreciated!
Thanks

 

[sells2u]

What was described in the initial post is a rear end wobble...not a lurch, not a drift, not a pull and not a vibration. However, as systems go, all could be ... or not be part of the resulting root cause. Not sure at all about the leaking coolant reply that came out of left field...certainly not anything I would consider based on my 50 years of wrenching. In my opinion, the pan-hard bar reply is dead on, but.......

The death wobble. Comes in two flavors...front and rear. Both can be caused by several problems that result in the same symptom, but is mostly a symptom of rigid axle suspension designs that are loose.

Out of necessity, I've been following this symptom on several boards now for almost two years and it seems very few real answers are out there. Lots of guessing tho. My one 4Runner was used in my business for 5 years towing trailers near the upper limit of the truck's design. Subsequently, the wobble showed up and got worse. And then worse. A death wobble.

Here's my take on getting to the real, no guesswork needed, solution: First put the truck in the air and inspect everything in the suspension with a very good, bright flashlight. Look for leaks in shocks (replace them in pairs), crushed or split bushings (replace), broken stab link ends (replace them in pairs with urethane bushings also), broken springs (duh). Check for broken mounts. Find a good frame shop with welder. Check tie rods for play (replace). Check wheel bearings for play (they don't always groan when bad). Check your ball joints with a pry bar the correct way now that the truck is up in the air. Uppers and lowers. Replace with OE or Moog.

If your shocks are more than 60K miles old, replace them unless you've only driven on smooth highways at highway speeds and don't brake hard or accelerate hard. They may last another 20K. Naturally, fix any other problems that you discover from the visual like rear heater coolant leaks:thumb3:.

If you have discovered more than one problem during this first inspection, fix them all at once. After that, only do one fix at a time. Plan on spending both money and time whether you do this yourself or direct your mechanic on what you want them to do and how you want them to do it.

Now that you've taken care of the obvious, go for a ride. If there's vibration you have to locate it. If it's in your seat, or your hands only, then move the front wheels to the rear and the rears to the front. If the vibration moved, it's in your wheels. Get them balanced with a road force balancer.

If no change when you move the wheels, then check your drive-line for bad u-joints and have it rebalanced by a reputable shop. However, a bad drive-line will not create a death wobble and you will usually always feel it in your seat only.

Now that everything else is taken care of, down to the death wobble. In my experience, a front wobble is rare in any Toyota and I'd eliminate the rear first. Note that since no one, and I mean no one is making poly bushings for the rear of a third gen 4Runner, this can get ugly. Pull the pan-hard bar (lateral track bar). Inspect the bushings at both ends for distortion (an area of crush parallel to the bar itself is common), as well as dry rot and excessive cracking. Any of these....replace the bar. ($200) If you are handy, you might be able to take a universal poly bushing from energy suspension, daystar etc and trim to fit on a lathe. Mine had high hat rubber bushings from the factory, so washers were necessary to shim the bar correctly since no two piece high hats were out there when I looked. Replace the bolts with new, no matter what. The bolts take a beating, they wear and get 'loose'. If you have 1/32 inch play at one end, you have it at the other also and it's cumulative in effect. The wobble should disappear on the next test drive.

IF not, then it's on to the lower control arms! 4Runners that do a lot of towing will show a symptom upon acceleration and deceleration where the front of the truck seems to 'steer' in one direction (to the right when accelerating) and then the opposite when letting off the gas. Once they hit 200k miles, the same. Heavy acceleration or supercharger abuse....control arm issues. The axle is moving forward and rearward on the drive side which means...Lower control arm bushings are shot. Like the bar, no one makes a Gen 3 urethane replacement. Toyota has the rubber OE, part number 48702-35070. Most parts guys will tell you they don't exist...or that they are only for one end. Not true and not true. Toyota OE control arms are anywhere from $137 to list price ($212) each. This is what they try to sell you. Ouch. Careful if you go to your local pick-a-part because you most likely get the same or worse condition. Many yards move their wrecks with forklifts and the lower arms take the hit. In my opinion, you may only have to replace the bushings on the dog bone that attaches to the axle. Replace both and test drive. If I'm wrong, replace the other two after the test drive fails. You might save a few bucks. Replacing the bushings is a shop job. I mean, you need a really good, 20 ton minimum press and adapters that fit what you're trying to accomplish. The bushings are 44 millimeters in diameter and you need something that will press that outer shell/ring without damaging the center that projects out from the bushing. I used an old motorcycle piston turned on a lathe and the center drilled out to fit.

These lower control arms are mostly to keep the axle perpendicular to the center line of the frame, whereas the pan-hard is to keep the axle centered left to right under the frame. If there's enough slop in these lower arms, the axle wanders. The upper arms are for resistance to the rotation forces that can cause the axle to twist forward or backward. These will be the last to go since this force is minimal. But they do go.

If you have done all of the above and still have the wobble you either missed something, or you have a broken frame or component mount (you missed something). Time for a new truck?

 

[sw1]

Thank you for your suggestions!

Hi Folks,

I feel awful that I haven't followed up on this until now. I've been reading suggestions and kept bringing the vehicle to my mechanic to try and suss out the issue over the years. I'm actually on here looking to buy a 3rd gen with 4wd and I'm embarrassed that I left you guys hanging!

I'm running out of steam for tonight and intend to explain what was done to ultimately sort this out.

Again, many thanks to all, and to all a good night.

 

[SCRunner12]

I'm definitely interested as I get a significant wobble at freeway speeds as well.